3 way carcass class

Our county fair is no longer using the judges placing as part of the carcass class.  The three parts of the contest are: average daily gain, carcass grading at slaughter, and scoring on a 3-5 min. presentation given the last day of the fair on any aspect of the beef industry the exhibitor chooses.  My husband thinks it it stupid, I think they are doing it so the kids that have less competitive animals have a better chance.  Has any other county done this?  What are your thoughts on them trying to fix something that many don't believe is broken?  :-\

I am a 4-H leader, former Ag Teacher, and also a beef dad.   

4-H and FFA programs are built on learning and developing leadership skills. 

I see a lot of merit in the contest.  I would welcome the change.      It takes a lot of the $ out of the equation and rewards kids who put in the time to actually learn about the beef industry and their project.          The speaking skills they learn and demonstrate are far more important than learning how to rinse and fit an animal.

In my many years of showing, I have seen the industry move from a home-raised and shown calf to one that is far too commonly bought(already broken and clipped), brought home to a super-secret mix of high dollar feed additives and supplements, placed in a cooler to stimulate hair growth and then clipped by the breeder or other professional fitter.  The calf is far too commonly brought out of the cooler and into 90+ degree heat at the fair, kept under misters and fans to keep them from dieing. 

I am not saying this is done by all of the winners and high $ showmen, but is is far too common.    I do not subscribe to the idea that the kids learn how to properly care for an animal when they follow this regimen.  Far too many kids simply rinse and comb, not a lot to learn in that.

For the benefit of the youth involved, this sounds like a great way for them to grow into strong and knowledgable leaders in the cattle industry.

Why bother even having a show if this is going to be what your fair consist of?  Why not just have all the kids send the calves out to a feedlot and measure ADG there, than score the carcass and have them give a presentation?  That way it would take all the variables out.  I can see some merit in having them do a presentation, but only as a part of showmanship.

it's really important to eliminate showing cattle.

ADG and of course carcass grade are very important and the presentation would help provide a great learning tool for young cattle men and women but another aspect that is important is the fact that this animal has been prepared and presented alive to a judge. That shouldn't be discounted completely otherwise what was the point of halter breaking, grooming and preparing this animal? 

Nkotb, the kids will still get to show their animals to be judged and placed in both market and showmanship classes. This change was only made in the carcass class.  Maybe our fair is different, but our carcass class is an additional competition the exhibitors can choose to be a part of, it isn't the only class.

While I agree with a lot of what LLBUX said I also know that the last day of a 10 day fair is going to be a very challenging time for me to get my child focused enough to give a presentation!!

I think it is a good idea, my major concern is are all the kids in there together??? Age could give some kids an unfair advantage in the carcass class.  I dont disagree with the fact that it helps the kids learn and that is the point of why the 4-H/FFA projects were developed.  If they are gonna run it all together and not split the kids by age, maybe an interview would be a better idea. The judges could then ask questions that they felt were age appropriate and pertinent to the competition.

is there a class where everyone gets first place?

I LOVE this idea.  As long as they still have the opportunity to show in market and showmanship classes this is the way carcass classes should be run.  Why have a live placing for carcass if they have a live placing in market? 

Twisted I am right there with you, as a matter of fact an interview was what I was originally told would be the third part of the contest.  We were kind of blindsided when we went to weigh in and were told it would be a presentation instead.  My hope is they will find a way to make the scoring age appropriate.

From the responses so far I'm guessing we are the only fair to have implemented this kind of change?

I love this idea of how the carcass contest is set up.  I feel that kids would learn a lot more about their project if they knew they had to give a presentation pertaining to the beef business.  I also know there are a lot of kids out there that work hard at showing their calves but there is a pretty big number too that sit on the showbox and screw around all week while mom and dad or a hired fitter preps their calves for the show.  It's been going on for at least 25 years that I know of.  I think classes placed like whats being talked about here would really cut down on the amount of "bullshit" that goes on at any show in the country. <cowboy>

I guess at our county and at many the carcass class is supposed to be much more real world money oriented.  You want the animal that gains the best with the best hanging carcass.  While I think it is too bad the kids don't get to show, one could argue the way to make more money in the feedlot business is knowing about the industry and it challenges versus how to set up a profile on a steer.  If they can't show the carcass steers in carcass, can they show in the market class?

My family puts on the carcass contest every year for our mid-state fair here in california, and the sole determining factor is the carcass in a carcass contest.  YG and QG that is what determines a carcass in my mind.

The kids still get to show the steers, it will most likely be the same steers in the Carcass Contest as in the Market Show.  They werent saying the kids didnt get to show. What they were saying is that in the past there was a formula to figure who won the carcass show and the placing in the show or live evaluation was considered. Now for the carcass portion that is being taken out.  How the kids place in the carcass contest will be tallied on a combination of ADG, Carcass Evaluation, and a Presentation the kid has to make.

VERY hard to find a hole in that system.  I wish more fairs would go this route. This way you focus on both aspects of the cattle industry ...show & feedlot...... verses trying to find a way to tie them into one.  Facts are they are not the same and to try and force them to be is silly

twistedhshowstock said:

The kids still get to show the steers, it will most likely be the same steers in the Carcass Contest as in the Market Show.  They werent saying the kids didnt get to show. What they were saying is that in the past there was a formula to figure who won the carcass show and the placing in the show or live evaluation was considered. Now for the carcass portion that is being taken out.  How the kids place in the carcass contest will be tallied on a combination of ADG, Carcass Evaluation, and a Presentation the kid has to make.

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it wasn't clear from the original post.  now i think it's a good idea.  it lets the carcass competition compete against the show portion for auction dollars with the buying public.  the only problem with that is having a seated arena to purchase sides of beef versus a cute calf in the ring.  it will be up to the organizers to come up with a way to do that.  perhaps in the long run it will help ag present themselves to the public and think different.  some city folks want to get closer to what they eat.  this would be a way to do that.  if only the USDA would cooperate and give up the inspection control to the states or some other system to reduce costs, increase flexibility to smaller custom butchers instead of the always big guy preference.

I like that idea makes a more usful cattle person

In our county on tag day business people and individuals show up and bid on each calf for our carcass contest. The calves are then shown at the fair in the steer show and placed just like any steer show. They then go through the premium auction. Kids get the premium and the calves are then sold on the rail at IBP. Carcass data is collected and sent back and the calves are placed 1 to 5. The money in the calcutta pool is then split up percentage wise. The buyer of the calf and the kid that owned it each get half of the payout. It's free money for the kid and advertisement for the buyer.