All Black %Sim bull
- Thread starter Sparty-On
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b_kackley
Well-known member
I know you specified % Sim. What about purebreds? I have had good luck with NLC Upgrade and Grandmaster for cow makers.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
Yea that's bizarre to want to mongrelize the cow base. Assuming you have some crossbred cows now, coming back over them with an unrelated crossbred bull results in progeny whose genetics are in utter disarray. Better approach is to create as close to F1 momma cow as you can, or even backcross with your cow base (baldies bred back Hereford or Angus, for example,) and then if you must, use these mongrel bulls as terminal sires back over that cow base. Consistency and predictability will suffer with the resulting offspring but this approach should shake the bottle up enough to get you a few extreme outliers out of the deal that you can put a halter on.
Gargan
Well-known member
What if they aren't crossbreds? You know what happens sometimes when you assume don't you?-XBAR- said:
aj
Well-known member
ABS is sporting a black % bull. He's sired by the angus bull Hoover Dam. They claim he is the industry best in the industry. I can't remember the name.
Gargan
Well-known member
Boulderaj said:
https://bullsearch.absglobal.com/en-us/beef/bull/detail/2033658/breed/14/proof/6/country/222
mark tenenbaum
Well-known member
Gargan said:
RyanChandler
Well-known member
Gargan said:
Hey smart ass, if the cows aren’t crossbreds, even more reason to want to use a purebred bull of an unrelated breed in order to create genuine f1s.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
mark tenenbaum said:
Surely you’re not suggesting that there’s the same level of genotypical variation in, say a 98% Angus cow that’s been stabilized at that percentage for 20 generations, as there is in a modern mongrel that has been bred back and forth to random percentage cattle for the last five generations?
mark tenenbaum
Well-known member
Where did the new Angus breeding come from to level the playing field ? And when you have bulls like Upgrade who are considered purebred how is he any less a generational mish mash than alot of the Angus and or the Angus that made Simmentals black? O0
Gargan
Well-known member
I guess a smart ass is better than a dumbass, but anyway, once again, you made no reference to the original posters questions. If he's wanting to make sim solution show animals on purebred cows, then a purebred bull is not what he/she needs. Not everyone wants to maximize hybrid vigor and be the rhinestone cowboy you are, tex,! Btw, which one are you in this pic, and has this pic been photoshopped?-XBAR- said:
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WinterSpringsFarm
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I'll add No Remorse to Frankes suggestions.
Gargan
Well-known member
Good one, and fhen halftime came to mind also (thumbsup)WinterSpringsFarm said:
aj
Well-known member
The hybrid deal is a interesting topic. I do know that some big name purebred people have added composite bulls to their catalog. Even Wedel red angus in my part of the universe.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
simsolution (lol) Talk about participation trophy generation. Is this like some little designation they've come up with so that all of you little freddy 4-H'ers have a place to fit in? Mercy, anything to make a buck I guess
I thought the Op's question was about cowmakers. Sorry for interrupting, I'll let y'all get back to brushing your ponies now-
I thought the Op's question was about cowmakers. Sorry for interrupting, I'll let y'all get back to brushing your ponies now-
aj
Well-known member
When I was a college judging team guy in 1980 we used to debate each other.........on the bus......in route to contest. I remember one argument that I made. If you take a cow....that has nothing but frame 5 cattle in her pedigree......a Herford cow-and you breed her to an Angus bullthat has nothing but frame 5 in his pedigree....will most likely get a frame 5 calve almost always. The calves would be consistently 5 frames even if they are crossbred calves. On the other hand if you take a Angus cow of a frame 5 and breed her to an Angus bull who is a frame 9........you will get a crazy array of frame scores......from 5 to 9. So in this case you have better consistentcy in the crossbred calves over the "purebred calves".
aj
Well-known member
The heterosis factor in breeding plans is completely a different deal though.
mark tenenbaum
Well-known member
Since Simm Solutions are created with purebreds both sides as are: most Durham Reds,Optimizers etc etc-What makes them so different in outcomes than "so-called' purebreds that actually are not. I havent seen many commercial herds where every calf was semi identical or purebreds for that matter. The only feedlots Ive seen up close were Iowa-and they were all holstiens because they are uniform-and basically the same gene pool-(certified Angus Beef) Like it or not the most uniform groupings of purebred cattle Ive seen are also in Iowa at Sullivans :and once he gets rid of all the high BW embryo heifers, they may be more so- O0
