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Offline Mcdonald Show Animals

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Cidr Implants Questions
« on: June 17, 2007, 08:54:41 PM »
Well I am new here been watching from the outside for a long time. I have first set of cows that were implanted 2 weeks ago tomorrow I took them home for a week took them back the following Monday the implants were removed last Monday as of Thursday they hadn't came back in I waited for a call Friday to pick them up never called so it is Sunday and I was wanting to know if this time line is normal what is the schedule you guys use?

Offline DL

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2007, 09:30:37 PM »
Hey McDonald - welcome! (welcome)

Let me see if I got this right - (I am a little confused about taking them places...)
Mon = CIDRs put in
following Monday - CIDRs removed
nothing going on...is that right??

Did you (they) give Lutalyse or another prostaglandin when they pulled the CIDRs?...if not that is your problem.

I use a time breeding protocol
day 0 CIDR + GNRH
day 7 pull CIDR and Lutalyse
66 hrs later (cows) 54 (heifers) time breed and 2nd dose of GNRH

I can send you copies of these protocols...

let me know about the lutalyse - we will try to figure it out!
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Offline justintime

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2007, 11:03:00 PM »
DL, Have you found much difference between breeding heifers on observed heats vs. timed breeding following this protocol? We sold the Brandon Research Station ( Ag. Canada) 400 doses of semen to time breed their research herd of 400 females. They also time bred 100 heifers. Last year they had 58% conception on the mature cows and only 25 % on the heifers using the timed breeding protocol. I was thinking of time breeding a few heifers until I heard their results and decided to continue on with my old method of breeding after heats are observed.
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Offline DL

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2007, 08:41:40 AM »
JIT - this is all anecdotal and I sure don't have the numbers you have -I haven't seen much difference but with an all AI herd I think there is self selection for good response to AI.

There is believed to be a smaller window for time breeding heifers 54 +/- 2 vs cows 60-+/- 6 so it could be that those heifers that had the CIDRs pulled first went thru the chute for AI last.  I'd have to skulk around for some of the other studies but that seems awful low to me....

The one think I have noticed on the heifer timed AI thing is for heifers that aren't showing heat (or you aren't seeing it) even if they don't stick with timed AI the next heat is a doozie!

PS - which protocol did they use??
« Last Edit: June 18, 2007, 08:42:25 AM by dragon lady »
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Offline Mcdonald Show Animals

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2007, 08:45:32 PM »
ok heres the deal I have 2 first calf heifers with calves at side one heifer that was being bred for the first time. I hauled them back and forth to the vet to heve this all done day 0 implanted with Cidrs
Day 7 removed implants and gave lutalase
Heifer came in on day 12 she was AIed
now it is day 14 2 First calf heifers have not cycled gave another shot of lutalase
now watching for heat with patches will haul back to vet when they come in

calves are 4 and 5 monthes old

is this a common thing with first time heifers should the vet have aied with out showing signs?

Offline DL

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2007, 09:18:17 PM »
What body condition score would you give your first calf heifers? Getting these critters bred back can be a challenge as they are growing and they are nursing a calf so management is critical. They need to consume enough calories to maintain a decent condition score and minerals esp trace minerals are important. Did they have any difficulty calving?

You (the vet) could have "time bred " them - don't know if it would have made any difference. I assume that when he/she put in the CIDRs he/she checked them? Was everything OK - ovaries normal? Had they been cycling before the CIDRs? - would expect that they should be.....with 4 and 5 month old calves
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Offline Mcdonald Show Animals

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2007, 12:31:47 PM »
the body condition score is 3.5 to 4  I have had them on pasture with and have not seen them cycle they were palpated when the implants were put in and everything was ok there was no problems calving. Should we just mark it down as bad luck?

Offline DL

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2007, 12:50:16 PM »
They might be a little thin (http://www.ext.vt.edu/pubs/beef/400-795/400-795.html#L2) so if you don't see them in heat it after the next go round it might be worth either weaning the calves, adding a little supplement or both. Also what do you have for minerals?
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Offline Mcdonald Show Animals

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2007, 01:15:39 PM »
we are feeding a evergreen triple 12 free choice mineral.

Offline red

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Re: Cidr Implants Questions
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2007, 01:45:44 PM »
That is on the thin side McD. I'd make sure you aren't in a deficient area like Selenium or something essential. Make sure the mineral is being eaten & also provide a white salt block.
I've had cows that don't seem to come in heat until the calf is weaned. Might be your best bet.
Listen to DL- she's got some great tips for you!

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