if you had to start all over

lets say tomorrow morning you when out to feed the cow and all of them were dead ..... lets call it a freak accident that can't be explained.

what genetic within the last 15 years (thanks to AI) would you use to start your herd all over again. list breed if referring to purebreds

Simmental- Meyer 734 Daughters
Some solid Angus x Sim mixed females
Clubby- Who Made Who, Monopoly, Irish Whiskey daughters, etc...
Of course a few shorthorns.

I do not think Pedigree, although important, is the most important thing. I would look for QUALITY over QUANTITY, make sure and get the type of females you think can produce and don't get in a rush.

Some good foundation females.  (lol)

Like MCSC said, I'd pry pick some Meyer 734 daughters.  If I was picking any female, I would pick structure over any other trait.  Don't care how ugly that udder is, how poorly haired, any of that.  As long as she isn't completly choke necked, she milked enough to feed one claf, and has a small amount of muscle she'd be good for me.  You can always use breeding to fix that stuff, but a good structured animal would be key.

Aside from that, some good clubby angus cross cows and I might invest into a halfway decent clean up bull.  With how good those I80 females are showing I may want some of those in my herd to.

Maybe a pb shorthorn or two and a handful of herferds to do some herford shorthorn crosses and breed a few herefords to charolais cross bulls.

I would have bought better animals as opposed to just average club calf females. I would have bought more donor prospects instead of say 5 average cows. Maine x SIMM x angus deals. Meyer 734 and whiskey daughters. Check out mike Mimms donors unlimited sale in April or hairietta stuff from Hara farms ohio

I agree with SCC- Find the better females and buy them first.

What I'm saying is that it's almost impossible to breed for a perfect structured calf, so why not find a dam that's good structured?

I'd get those in addition to those high quailty donor prospects.  Just incase those perfectly structured ones didn't work out in the long haul.

If I was to start over-- I'd not care about what kind of cow-- I guess... but I'd make damn sure not to use an carrier bulls...

i would start with some good simmy cows meyer 3c macho influenced and breed them to high % maine bulls irish whiskey, ice pick. 
and also have a separate herd of occ purebred angus genetics cross them with some powerfull char bulls and a couple non direct heat wave sons
i would have about 60 cows


cool thread!!  O0 (clapping)

This is an interesting thread. I have moved back to the farm in the last 2 years and am in the process of rebuilding a clubby herd. I sold most of my better cows in the mid-2000's (career took me away from farm, kids came along, bills to pay, etc). So, I guess in a way, I am living this thread....doing it all over again and I very excited... I loved the Meyer 734 daughters. I love the Meyer 734 grandaughters even more. Wish I had kept more of them. I wish I had used Habanero on more Angus cows for replacements and less on clubby cows for steers. I wish I had bred and calved out all of those Full Flush daughters to see which ones would have made cows (others did a fine job with them). I wish I had bred those OCC cows every other year back to OCC bulls. This time, when I buy (like a previous poster) structure is the first and last thing considered. Must be sound with a BIG foot. I am using and purchasing more shorthorn than I did the first time (no shorties first round). Color is in...Have not had tremendous luck with Charolais crosses and soundness in the past. Chunky Monkey and a son that I have are about as far as I am jumping into that pool right now. Using maternal cleanup bulls only. Females are worth more than a non AI steer every day of the week no matter how good he is...I am going to keep all of the Monopoly and other clubby bred females and give them one try to make a cow, too many good ones out there out of clubby genetics on bottom side. Even more of them out of a cow sired by an Angus, Shorthorn, or Maine bull with clubby genetics on her bottom side when mated back to clubby bulls. As previous posters stated, purchases need to have a "wow" factor. No need in buying average ones. You will kill yourself trying to get good ones out of average ones... <rock>

interesting choice with the OCC crossing with the Charolais i did not expect to see that.....

i would have to agree with using Habanero of some powerful angus cows trying to get the priceless replacement heifers

Would have started with Fullbloods without a certain breeder in Montana.

To me, it's been more important to avoid certain people than certain cattle.

People will cost you more money than cattle.

Meyer 734 x Angus halfbloods , registered , polled , good Angus gentetics on that side. Then either bred back up to purebred Simmys or kept on with the halfblood deal. Would have stayed away from anything that was just average. Quality is much easier to live with then quantity !

ALTSIMMY 79 said:

Meyer 734 x Angus halfbloods , registered , polled , good Angus gentetics on that side. Then either bred back up to purebred Simmys or kept on with the halfblood deal. Would have stayed away from anything that was just average. Quality is much easier to live with then quantity !

Click to expand...

Good answer, I would agree on quality over quantity. Breeding up is an option but with show cattle, most of us don't have the patience. Good maternal genetics can make a lot of bulls look good!

I would buy embryos out of the best cow in herds that I admire mated to bulls that I have followed for more than one calf crop.  Might not be as exciting as pulling the lever on a slot machine or trying to find the "gold nugget" weanling, but it sure would have a lot better chance of paying off quicker. 

knabe said:

Would have started with Fullbloods without a certain breeder in Montana.

To me, it's been more important to avoid certain people than certain cattle.

People will cost you more money than cattle.

Click to expand...

Painfully true...

You guys talk about these females but what do they cost obviously skys the limit but for the lowest price range what is it for these type of cows I'm just curious because i wanna know how much I'd be looking at if I ever did anything like that thanks

Another tactic might be go buy the sorriest cows you could find and see which bulls fix or don't fix them.

I got a lot of information here.

WBar - In answer to your price question I'm going to say upwards of 4 to 5 thousand a piece would be a better than average starting point. I'm talking purebred bred heifers. I've seen a lot of average breds this year sell for 2500 to 3000 just because the market is high. Now if you were talking open heifers or donor cows I'm afraid the skys the limit. Very hard to put a dollar figure on , too many variables !

Are you buying donor cows, bred heifers, doing ET work on recips? How are you getting back in if you walk out and all your herd is dead?

If I had to start over I would look into nice donor cows and flushing them to proven bulls you've followed.

Do what's best for you and not chase "the bull of the moment".

cmodog

I'm not trying to make anybody mad but I was thinking it's kind of weird how open heifers will sell higher than bred heifers. I do realize these ones are generally show heifers but with breds your getting the cow and the calf. with buying a heifer calf your putting more money into feeding it among other things. It seems backward to me.

and to continue with the topic I would probably go back to the same farms where I had bought before with the acceptation of a few places that I feel took advantage of me not knowing much about cattle when I first started as well as a cow that I bought on impulse.