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Author Topic: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics  (Read 3319 times)

Offline Willow Springs

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Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« on: April 08, 2019, 08:11:14 PM »
Would appreciate pics if someone has them handy on their computer or knows where to find them.

Seven T's Greg
SRS Instant Replay
Homedale Equity
Matlock Torpedo
Deer Trail Goliath
Homedale Equity
Belmore Ultra-Bright
CF High Rise
Red Max Prince
Butterfield Krakatoa
Kenbar White Expansion
Minn Duke Darius (DP)
Green Row Everlasting (DP)

Offline Willow Springs

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2019, 08:28:03 PM »
Well I'll add some that were sent to me


Offline oakview

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2019, 08:43:20 AM »
That is one interesting mixture of bulls.  I am somewhat familiar with all of them except Red Max Prince.  Most of them were decent bulls in their day, don't know if that day is today, though.

Offline Shorthorn-Fed

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2019, 08:45:38 AM »
It would be nice if there was someone standing in the photo of Red Max Prince to gauge his size/frame. I would take a guess that he would be 4.5 ish and not any where close to hunting geese with a rake like the other two.



Russ
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 08:46:36 AM by Shorthorn-Fed »
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Offline knabe

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2019, 09:03:07 AM »
If 7ts head was on his butt and vice versa, he might be an ok bull.

Offline Willow Springs

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2019, 09:20:08 AM »
I prefer the look of Red Max Prince, but he was born in 1964 so chances are he was fairly small? Picture just not taken in 2 feet of straw, but I can sure appreciate the type he displays in the picture. Goliath looks fairly useful too - again picture taking/clip jobs probably make him look more extreme than he is. Gregs structure and type are just not good - but again just a picture so who knows.

Offline knabe

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2019, 10:23:37 AM »
Middle 80s was a waste of time.

More good cattle were sidelined probably than the 50s

I remember showing  and judging thinking what the heck is wrong with these people.

Offline oakview

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2019, 10:39:09 AM »
You need to remember who it was that told us those "Greg" type cattle were good.  The educated, smarter than us, college professors.  These were the same folks that told us we needed belt buckle cattle 20 years before.  Every calf in the late 70's and 80's needed to look like Friggio.  Every breed was the same.  I still have the old AI catalog describing Dollar II as "a comfortable 6 feet tall at the shoulder."  Clark was advertised as the Shorthorn bull that got the breed out of the mud.  There were ton junior yearling "Angus" heifers in Denver.  There was a rumor that some Herefords were actually Simmental crosses.  No kidding.  How much was Signal semen 30 years ago?  I'll wager it's not that expensive today.  Times change.  It's interesting and fun to use a little hindsight.   

Online GM

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2019, 08:05:15 PM »
Was 1984 Denver the peak of Shorthorn interest in modern times?  I recall the sale being incredible with a bull selling for 100k - not much heard from him after that (2416).  From what I recall reading the stands were full of bidders, there was huge buzz, and the high seller sold for part interest to a breeder in South America.  Goliath was a monster and I dont think he won, or came close.  I think it was the first big wave of Ayatollah offspring at that show.  Curious what the historians recall.  Many amazing <7 frame cattle were pushed aside or lost in the chase.

Offline Willow Springs

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2019, 08:56:40 PM »
Quote
You need to remember who it was that told us those "Greg" type cattle were good.  The educated, smarter than us, college professors.  These were the same folks that told us we needed belt buckle cattle 20 years before.  Every calf in the late 70's and 80's needed to look like Friggio.  Every breed was the same.

I think the industry blames the college professors, ag fieldman, etc too much for their own screw ups. I agree that those types were advocating more growth and yield, however I doubt they were advocating for what the cattle became. The purebred show ring hype takes something and it becomes a game of one upmanship to the point that we move right past optimum to maximum - it happens with everything people do and is repeated over and over. First too small, then too big now it is chasing the highest EPD's and as usual show ring types that are not generally functional for a commercial range based operation.

Offline Willow Springs

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2019, 09:27:28 PM »
Some more pics

Offline justintime

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2019, 10:51:39 PM »
I prefer the look of Red Max Prince, but he was born in 1964 so chances are he was fairly small? Picture just not taken in 2 feet of straw, but I can sure appreciate the type he displays in the picture. Goliath looks fairly useful too - again picture taking/clip jobs probably make him look more extreme than he is. Gregs structure and type are just not good - but again just a picture so who knows.

Red Max Prince was a bigger bull than most in that era. He was raised by George Zelonka, Redvers, SK and we went down to try to buy him when he was about 6 years old. George did not have a scale on his farm, so he loaded him in his grain truck and took him to the grain elevator to weigh him. He told us he weighed just over 2400 lbs and my dad and I both thought that was fairly accurate. He had a massive body and was taller than most bulls in that era. George had him priced at $5000 and we did not buy him. That was a bunch of money back then, especially for a 6 year old bull. I remember my dad saying that he would have paid that for him, if he has seen some better calves from him. That day, we didn't see any calves that we thought would be as good as Red Max Prince was himself. He was very thick, and deep with exceptional softness, as well as smooth as an apple.  He looked like he was very easy fleshing.
There were some cattle in the 60s that were larger framed, especially here in Canada. They were the exception rather than the rule though. I remember Scotsmorr Fascinator being a massive bull, and he was a bull that bred very well. He was a 2500 lb bull that weighed that year round. Four Point Major was also a massive bull who weighed over 2600 lbs. Nupar Cherrio was another of the massive bulls I remember from the 60s and early 70s. We found him in a commercial herd near Yorkton, Saskatchewan when he was 8 years old. He was probably one of the biggest bulls I have seen.  There were several others that I remember, and almost all of them were bred by breeders who lived off the beaten track and didn't use much Scottish breeding from that era.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 08:34:38 AM by justintime »
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Offline idalee

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2019, 09:28:12 AM »
Minn Duke Darius from the cover of the 1973 Milking Shorthorn Journal (Herd Sire Issue)  Darius weighed over 3000 pounds and sired a lot of growth and milk in Milking Shorthorns at that time. 

Offline idalee

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2019, 09:36:44 AM »
Green Row Everlasting from the Western Ontario Breeders advertisement in the September 1975 Milking Shorthorn Journal.   Harley Headings of Kansas bred a bull from him named Double H GR Defender 4051361

Offline oakview

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Re: Looking for old Shorthorn bull pics
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2019, 11:02:05 AM »
In my 55 years of showing cattle, I would bet at least 90% of the judges I've shown under were college folks.  Nothing wrong with that, it's just the way it was.  I was on the ISU livestock judging team until my wife made me retire after we were gone for over 2 weeks on a judging trip.  You would have a hard time proving to me that college livestock judging was not controlled by college people.  It's just a fact that they controlled type.  If you wanted to do well in the show or in the judging contest, you tried to show and pick the kind those in control liked.  You adjust your breeding program accordingly.  There's no reason to debate whether it's practical, good or bad.  That's just the way it is.

 

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