Maternal Standouts

It's cold here, and I need something to ponder. If my goal is to produce a herd of sound, fertile and functional cows, what are my options? these cows must be oriented more toward commercial production, but should be able to produce a show steer or heifer on occasion. I don't have a breed or color preference, but in this area blacks sell best at auction. For that reason, the bulls that I select probably won't be char or char cross. I personally like them, but our buyers tend to discount them. What are all of your thoughts on bulls that can produce the good cows. Thanks in advance, Earl

Who Made Who
Chill Factor
3C Macho
Northern Improvement

I like all 4 of those bulls. I might be a little concerned about Who's soundness, and I really like Chill Factor except for the semen cost. Has anyone used the Taz bull ?

OCC Anchor, Traveler 6807, EXT, Meyer 734, Who Made Who, Chill Factor.  Im leaving some out and I' sure not everyone will agree with the ones I like, but these bulls came to my mind.

sos

  Some factors that I personally would like to add would be commercially feasible ,ie. $30.00 and under per unit and old enough to have 2 least lets say 5+ calf crops on the ground so that it's not a one & done bull & we have some prooven consistency over multiple cows & herds & maybe how they perform in different geographic areas of the country.

Boy, CAB, you blew my bulls completely out of the water with the $30 per unit cost. (lol) I agree it would be good but once a bull reaches the status of what I would call a maternal bull,  A few years of his females producing the top calves, he's usually dead and semen prices have risen beyond the $30 range.  I just wish I could predict the future and know which bulls of today that I would want to breed to 10 years from now. <cowboy>

i'll make it tougher.

what 3/4 or above maine bull has an udder that looks like 1019, especially the teats?

Who's are not sound enough and functional enough to go in a feedlot as a whole.  Some of the bulls that come to mind for me are Encore [the 1/2 blood simmi], SOS, strickly bus., Dr. Who,  Northern Improvement, Nutt-n-butt, ect.  I know i'm leaving some off the list but these are the first ones that came to mind.

some bulls that cost quite a bit but get it done:  draft pick, sooner, and for cross breds i like who and friction.

wrc said:

Boy, CAB, you blew my bulls completely out of the water with the $30 per unit cost. (lol) I agree it would be good but once a bull reaches the status of what I would call a maternal bull,  A few years of his females producing the top calves, he's usually dead and semen prices have risen beyond the $30 range.  I just wish I could predict the future and know which bulls of today that I would want to breed to 10 years from now. <cowboy>

Click to expand...

wrc, sorry, but we are looking for bulls that a guy can use on a herd of commercial cows. I can't justify spending the kind of money on those bulls. It just won't work. I agree that I like most of the bulls that you listed have had some great females, but we/I can't afford them right from the get go. I want to be able to come to this board or another board and try to find some info that is gong to help me not be like I wish I could get some $30.00 anchor semen. Truth of the matter is there are alot of great bulls available for very reasonable prices and it's a matter of sharing information from real life experiences that helps immensely when trying to decide which bulls maybe the best kept secret.
 SOS is on my Radar, but how old is he and what is the possible oldest cows alive out of him?

 Hope that I have not been too blunt. I honestly don't mean to be. I love posts like this one. It's one that has so much potential to help us all out. I really am looking for a bull to use commercially that will improve my cow herd. Hope that someone has info on great maternal sleepers and then that I have the guts to buy some semen and put it to good use. I can't honestly afford the high dollar bulls and I don't want the newest hot bull when it comes to making great momma cows.

Our herd is pretty similar to what you are asking about.  We've got good solid cows and make most of our money on the commercial end with feedlot and replacement females.  You cant beat a good commercial Angus base.  Thats what we started with.  Early we bought sons of Magic, Pistol Pete, and Smithbilt and a little later - Meyer.

Currently, I we are still using Meyer sons, a Lifeline son, and a Shamrock son.  I'd strongly suggest you give Shamrock and Lifeline a look if you want Maine influence.  Maybe Tyson - but his calves may be a little small to work as a group in the feedlot.  We've got three years of carcass data on truckload lots of our calves to prove that calves from these kind of cows mated to the currently popular "steer" bulls do just fine in the feedlot.  We never have trouble selling them.  Plus, we raise enough good ones to do our share of winning in Texas relative to the money we put into it.  With this approach we are in the top end of our regional jackpot shows and get consistently get our calves in the sale at Texas majors.

Personally, being a Short breeder, I'm going to suggest something along that line...  F1's might have a tad color to them, but when bred back to a black bull- chances are you're not coming out any color other than black...  I think their are plenty of bulls out their that can get the job done for you...  Check out feeder ducks' Wildside, IMO he'd work for what your wanting to do...  at 8 yrs old, he still looks better than most 2 y.o.'s...  Double clean too!    

In my opiinion, its going to be awefully hard for you to find the bull you're looking for in a cheap package...  The old greats are going to be expensive for a reason...  Typically, bulls don't prove themselves, and come to value until thier long dead!    Just my 2 cents

I think there are plenty of bulls out there that are maternally oriented that can be affordable.  I would look at the Schaff herd.  The cows that his herd bulls are out of are what I think are phenomenal cows.  You have SAV Net Worth, probably the most powerfull bull in the Angus breed right now and I'm willing to bet you could put two clubby bulls inside of him.  SAV Bismarck who is sure fire calving ease with a ton of growth(BTW, two of his daughters were Grand and Reserve Grand at the National Junior angus Show).  The supposed magical cross is Net Worth X Bismarck.  I heard that second hand from someone who had this discussion with Kelly Schaff.  Figures he'd tell you to breed to one of his bulls!

After you get some momma cows you could make some half blood simmis or Maines.  One breed offshoot that has really caught my eye are the Lim-Flex(Just think they are cool).  

olsun said:

It's cold here, and I need something to ponder. If my goal is to produce a herd of sound, fertile and functional cows, what are my options? these cows must be oriented more toward commercial production, but should be able to produce a show steer or heifer on occasion. I don't have a breed or color preference, but in this area blacks sell best at auction. For that reason, the bulls that I select probably won't be char or char cross. I personally like them, but our buyers tend to discount them. What are all of your thoughts on bulls that can produce the good cows. Thanks in advance, Earl

Click to expand...

Red Angus- there are quiet a few breeders on here that can throw out the most maternal- I have always admired Brylor bull battery and donors
Simmi- We have had luck with 3C Macho, Dream On's seem smaller and slick haired. Mr. Corrector made us some good cows great momma's .
Angus- Legend, Northern Improvement, SS Traveler T510

Chambero, please tell me about the bull Shamrock. You have me curious. Also I'll have to agree with CAB on the cost thing. With timed AI on commercial cows, it just won't work for me, a poor man, to use 50 dollar semen. I appreciate bulls like Ext and Chill Factor, but just can't afford them. By the way guys, thanks for all the good info (clapping)

I can't afford semen on the bulls on my list, but I do have daughters or granddaughters of all the bulls on my list.  I misread the original post and thought that you were wanting to put together a heard of cows by buying cows of maternal origen, I didn't catch were you were wanting to breedthe cows you currently have to maternal bulls to put the heard together.  I agree that there are bulls out there for under $30 that will work for what you are wanting to do, but very few of the proven time tested maternal bulls can be bought for $30 or under.  Sorry for the misunderstanding.  When I think of a true maternal bull he has to be a time tested bull and that usually but not always means higher semen prices.  I have my own list of bulls that I think would fit my criterea but either from lack of promotion or because of their age they are not proven.  I use them on a few of my cows and am waiting to see what I will get in a few years but if I had unlimited resources or had been smart enough to bank semen on a few bulls a few years back I would always use time tested bulls over bulls that SHOULD be great maternal sires.

wrc, sorry, but we are looking for bulls that a guy can use on a herd of commercial cows. I can't justify spending the kind of money on those bulls. It just won't work. I agree that I like most of the bulls that you listed have had some great females, but we/I can't afford them right from the get go. I want to be able to come to this board or another board and try to find some info that is gong to help me not be like I wish I could get some $30.00 anchor semen. Truth of the matter is there are alot of great bulls available for very reasonable prices and it's a matter of sharing information from real life experiences that helps immensely when trying to decide which bulls maybe the best kept secret.
 SOS is on my Radar, but how old is he and what is the possible oldest cows alive out of him?

 Hope that I have not been too blunt. I honestly don't mean to be. I love posts like this one. It's one that has so much potential to help us all out. I really am looking for a bull to use commercially that will improve my cow herd. Hope that someone has info on great maternal sleepers and then that I have the guts to buy some semen and put it to good use. I can't honestly afford the high dollar bulls and I don't want the newest hot bull when it comes to making great momma cows.
[/quote]


CAB, SOS was pictured in the no bull catalog this year at 7 years old.  I have personally not seen any cows in production out of him but have seen quite a few bred heifers and open heifers out of him this year.  They have all been AWESOME!  The sos's are going to make some pretty awesome cows.

Maybe not the answer if you're looking at using 'em on larger framed cows, but for smaller to moderate ones, you might consider looking way back at Buck (Sim) and Pistol Pete (MA).  The purebred folks may or may not like 'em, but in my experience (and quite a few others will agree) those two have made as many good, solid, productive females as any others. And at $12 and $15 respectively (according to SEK's current price list), you can hardly beat the price.  I still have an own daughter of Buck - I believe she's 6 now, prob'ly weighs 1300, weans one of the biggest calves and breeds right back every time.