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Offline Dale

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #15 on: July 13, 2013, 08:22:00 AM »
Back to HC Free Spirit--his genetics include many of the great ones, combined as a new creation that is a very attractive in the pasture as well as on paper.

Offline aj

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2013, 08:37:38 AM »
So you manage a 750 cow ranch. Very cool. Do you weigh every calf. You'd be tagging what 15 calves aday. Do have some helpers under you to help or do you do it all yourself? What do ranch managers make......is it a salary deal. What is the ranch name. Sounds like a resume building job. Very cool.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline Okotoks

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #17 on: July 13, 2013, 09:12:05 AM »
So you manage a 750 cow ranch. Very cool. Do you weigh every calf. You'd be tagging what 15 calves aday. Do have some helpers under you to help or do you do it all yourself? What do ranch managers make......is it a salary deal. What is the ranch name. Sounds like a resume building job. Very cool.
Sorry for staying off topic but some word definitions are required
Helper "A person employed to help, especially a farm worker or domestic servant." (as in "I have been helping calve...) the farm worker was actually used in the 4th definition in the dictionary

Manager "A person responsible for controlling or administering all or part of a company or similar organization: "the sales manager".

 

Offline knabe

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #18 on: July 13, 2013, 11:33:31 AM »
Not that hard to weigh 15 calves a day. 

A little bit easier than taking a th bull to denver.


Offline aj

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #19 on: July 13, 2013, 11:52:06 AM »
Are there ddg sources up in Canada? Ethenol plants?
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline Okotoks

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2013, 12:23:18 PM »
Are there ddg sources up in Canada? Ethenol plants?

Canada is a cold country covered with ice and snow where people live in igloos and keep 2000 lb pet show cows that deliver their 200 lb calves semi annually by c-section*

*source AJ's Canadian Fact Book 2013

There are some conspiracy theories out there that Canada shares the longest unprotected international border with the US and surprisingly there isn't much difference on either side of that border. These theories should be ignored wherever possible.
 
http://www.ddgs.usask.ca/MarketingandTechInfo/EthanolIndustryStatusinWesternCanada.aspx

We also have great bulls like HC Free Spirit
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 01:54:31 PM by Okotoks »

Offline aj

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2013, 09:23:36 PM »
As in most of the Canadian stories on here........give a stretchhhh here and stretch there and you have a damn good story.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline knabe

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2013, 09:31:54 PM »
give a stretchhhh here and stretch there and you have a damn good story.

not near as tall a story as the heavily used club calf and purebred AI sires from sod house.

Offline jaimiediamond

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2013, 11:10:31 PM »
As in most of the Canadian stories on here........give a stretchhhh here and stretch there and you have a damn good story.

Funny how you constantly accuse others of the flaw that is most evident in you.

 Craig Hoyt I invite you to come up and visit our herd.  Then I can take you on another couple of herd tours which were mentioned yet called stretching the truth.  You will need the follow items for this journey, a calculator and paper to keep track of cattle numbers and most importantly the ability to enjoy good stock in two breeds and one commercial operation ;)  I even will further the invite to my place to save on hotel this has risk as my cooking is terrifying

Offline justintime

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2013, 11:28:50 PM »
As in most of the Canadian stories on here........give a stretchhhh here and stretch there and you have a damn good story.


If you had to live in an igloo for 10 months of the year, with 4 months of total darkness,  with no TV and only occasional internet service, and have whale blubber ( imported from Kansas)  as your main food source ..... you probably would become a good story teller too!
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 11:29:48 PM by justintime »
Experience is what you get when you don't have it when you need it.

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Offline aj

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2013, 08:42:27 AM »
Study after study  after study sites that bigger bwt's cause dystocia in beef production. The bigger bwt calves have a higher incidence of having a front leg back. I don't think this is argueable. Even with antedotal evidnce from a 750 head cow herd in Canada. We have a big birth weight problem in the Shorthorn breed. The latest herd bull issue states this. I don't see how we can ignore the problem.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline knabe

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2013, 08:57:57 AM »
What's the numbers?

It's irresponsible to just say there is an increase.

Again, with all your expertise, why aren't you the largest supplier of seed stock of shorthorns for purebred use, commercial use, and club calf use?


Offline justintime

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2013, 09:29:22 AM »
Study after study  after study sites that bigger bwt's cause dystocia in beef production. The bigger bwt calves have a higher incidence of having a front leg back. I don't think this is argueable. Even with antedotal evidnce from a 750 head cow herd in Canada. We have a big birth weight problem in the Shorthorn breed. The latest herd bull issue states this. I don't see how we can ignore the problem.

I will agree with you that birth weights in any breed must be a constant concern.. but we also need to be talking more about calving ease than just birth weights. We have had this discussion on here more than a few times now, and I think Shorthorn breeders are working at this. I do not see the huge problem you continually post about, in my herd, and if I did, I would be probably as vocal as you are about this problem. As I have mentioned a few times before, we have calved reasonable numbers of some other breeds along side our Shorthorns in past years, and we have found that our Shorthorn herd has consistently had fewer calving issues. We have had herds of 50-100 head of Charolais, Hereford, Simmental,and Maines, along with smaller groups of a few other breeds. We decided a few years ago, to concentrate on the Shorthorns as they were the most troublefree breed we have had here. There are many other factors that contribute to calving issues other than just birth weights. I am sure there are some who have huge issues with calving problems, but I am thinking that a portion of their problems are created when they try to breed females that do not have proper structure to calve easily. There are some females that would struggle having a Longhorn calf.. and they can be found in most breeds. That said, I agree that we need to always be conscious of birth weights, but we also have to be conscious of numerous other issues that contribute to calving problems.
I have a commercial bull buyer who has now purchased 17 Shorthorn bulls from us in the past 10 years. He was using Charolais and Angus bulls prior to his first Shorthorn bull. His cows have to calve on pasture with little supervison and he is now using only Shorthorn bulls, because he says he has fewer calving issues from the Shorthorn sires he has been using.  Two years ago, a commerical man who has 800 cows, purchased a bull in our bull sale. The bull he purchased had a BW of 105 lbs and I shuttered when he told me he had used him on his yearling heifers. When I asked him if he had many calving issues, he said he wished the Shorthorn bull had bred all his heifers, as he had virtually no problems from him, but he had to pull almost every calf sired by the Polled Hereford bull he had run in the same pasture.
I have also commented on this before as well, but we have sold over 300 bulls since I made a decision to not keep any bulls intact with BWs of 110 lb or more. These bulls have sold to herds with as many styles of management as you can imagine, and I have not had a single complaint regarding calving issues from our bulls. I would think that someone would have told me that they were having problems if this was as big an issue as you continually say it is.
We all need to use some common sense when selecting our breeding stock and we also have to have a pretty good understanding of basic structural soundness in selecting replacements for our herds.
Experience is what you get when you don't have it when you need it.

Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and bad breath!
Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity
If love is blind... why is lingerie so popular?
The only thing worse than an idiot ... is an educated idiot!

Offline frostback

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2013, 09:39:45 AM »
Study after study  after study sites that bigger bwt's cause dystocia in beef production. The bigger bwt calves have a higher incidence of having a front leg back. I don't think this is argueable. Even with antedotal evidnce from a 750 head cow herd in Canada. We have a big birth weight problem in the Shorthorn breed. The latest herd bull issue states this. I don't see how we can ignore the problem.
There are also studies stating that using low BW bull after low BW bull after low BW bull will decrease the size of the heifers or cow pelvis. Meaning that they will have a hard time having calves and you would just keep having to use  smaller BW bulls. I would rather have cows that can have 100lb calves with no assistance then cows that cant have 60lb calves. My choice, I really don't care what you want, just quit telling me that I am ruining the US cattle industry or the ASA by doing so.
Some peoples true character only comes out in PMs.

Offline knabe

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Re: One of our junior herd sires
« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2013, 09:54:29 AM »
Hoyt for Asa president.

 

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