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Offline librarian

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Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« on: April 13, 2017, 12:39:13 PM »
This online sale has some pretty cool breeding combinations for the functional commercial real world segment.
Sale is Tuesday, 4/18,
but I just like to study the catalog- shows what a YY foundation can produce. Kicking myself for letting my CCL6th daughter go...oh well.
http://auctions.thewendtgroup.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?wendtcattle6/category/BULL
'Those who do not understand the old will not understand the new'. -farmers quote

Offline Olson Family Shorthorns

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2017, 12:51:05 PM »
Do you have much experience with Dover bulls?  The females I've been around are really good cows but almost have a dual purpose look to them. Very distinctive, you can pick a Dover daughter or granddaughter out of a lineup.
Shorthorn cattle and genetic opportunities available at all times. (515) 520 1972

Offline librarian

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2017, 01:15:24 PM »
Do you have much experience with Dover bulls?  The females I've been around are really good cows but almost have a dual purpose look to them. Very distinctive, you can pick a Dover daughter or granddaughter out of a lineup.
redbulls has the most Dover experience of those I know and hopefully he will address your question. I do think the reason the YY females are so nice is that the DRC range cow functionality crossed with the more compact volume of the Leader 6 genetics makes balanced combination. Then breeding back to DRC works pretty good.
'Those who do not understand the old will not understand the new'. -farmers quote

Offline oakview

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2017, 02:59:32 PM »
The gentleman that owns those cattle is a good guy.  They will be honestly presented and perform like you think they should.  I'm hoping to get down and take a look before the sale.  One of them even goes back to some very familiar breeding.

It's interesting, to me anyway, to look deep in the pedigrees of the DRC cattle.  Generations of almost nothing but DRC.  You get back to Remitall breeding, that's old stuff.  Show ring popularity definitely did not influence breeding decisions too much in that herd.  The cattle in the sale will look "functional" to some, "plain" to others.  Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.  You can be sure, though, that what you see will truly be what you get.  Even after they shed their hair.     

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2017, 03:08:22 PM »
Lot 1 bull looks like a really good one.  I like what Don Hardin's got going on-  he's certainly working with the genetics I personally value.  I've used a Dover son, JR Drover, and wish I'd have used him a whole lot more now that I've got a few of his daughters in production.  I have 8 more YY heifers arriving here in the morn. These DRC influenced YY cattle breed on time, calve unassisted, raise good calves, and do it with very little inputs or oversight. I imagine whoever ends up with these bulls is going to be very pleased.

Offline RedBulls

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2017, 09:57:39 PM »
Big tip of the hat to Don Hardin! It's always gratifying to see these cattle doing well for folks around the country. A big thanks to XBAR for having confidence in these cattle. The DRC x CPCL6th crosses work well. I can't take credit for the success of the genetic base. All I can just do my best to keep them functional! Dover Ranch made a success of raising industry acceptable Shorthorn cattle and did it continuously since 1888. Not screwing them up is something I take very seriously, and I hope the late Mr. Dover Sindelar is looking down with favor.

I'm not sure I'd think of DRC cows as dual purpose. I'd prefer to call them a "Maternal" type beef animal. I do know they've contributed greatly to our goal in breeding sound, productive beef cows. I'm always a bit surprised when some prospective bull buyers here demonstrate so little interest in looking at the females that make the bulls. When I am looking for compatible genetics, the female side of both parents and grandparents (if possible) are of great importance to us. The bull needs to come from sound females, as he will be spreading their influence (good or bad) over a wide swath of ones herd. A big reason I purchased Coalpit Creek Leader 6th was because I liked his dam so well. Same with DRC 101VM who was his dams second calf. His double Grand Dam, according to Dover, was "the best cow I ever owned". That was reason enough for me. Again, I'm glad to see folks having success in raising these cattle. Best of luck to Don Hardin of Longview Farms!

Offline Hardin of Longview

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2017, 02:14:24 PM »
Appreciate all the kind words and interest in our upcoming sale.  This is our first online sale we are very excited.  I have a new appreciation for all those who have to get cattle ready for a sale.  Ive learned a lot and already have a list of things that will be different next time.  This is our 10th year with the Shorthorns and our 8th year with the Black Herefords.  It takes a few years to settle into the type of cattle you like and what works best for you.  Having 2 breeds is extra work but it gives us insight and has pushed us to fix things in each breed that ultimately make both of our herds better.

If anyone has further questions about any of the LOTS, send me a PM.  Thanks

Offline Lucky_P

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2017, 08:00:24 AM »
We've been using some red Shorthorn genetics over Angus/Simangus cows for about 10 years now;  mostly Waukaru bulls, but also Rob Sneed '034' and Captain Obvious.   Still intend to use DRC 101VM and CPCL6 in the near future.
Got along fine with Waukaru Goldmine, Coppertop, and Gold Card... and the Goldmine daughters are looking like they're gonna pan out to be the best of the bunch.

Orion, on the other hand...steers grew like gangbusters, and performed well in the feedlot... but it's looking like he sucked the milk right out of his daughters... tiny udders, dinky calves.  If they don't up their game next time out, they're all gone. 
Used Orion's sire, Patent 8161, next, and I'm cutting my losses and sending almost all the Patent daughters to town as open yearlings... they look just so-so, and with his -11 milk epd, I'm afraid they're likely to be worse than the Orions when it comes to raising a decent calf...

Offline Hardin of Longview

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2017, 10:11:22 PM »
It was great to have Bert Moore stop out yesterday to view our group of bulls for sale and today, Dale Studer and his wife Anita stopped by.  I have so much to learn from these 2 guys; they are walking libraries and great resources for your cattle questions.    It was pretty clear that Dale has a soft spot for the Dover and Easy Coalpit genetics and even more so after he saw the Coalpit Dams of these bulls.  Thanks Dale and Anita and Bert I thoroughly enjoyed talking cattle.

Offline Dale

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2017, 09:10:02 AM »
Lucky P, your bull selection is for solid bulls that have performed well in range conditions.  We also have used 034, Captain, and Gold Mine 2109.  Lately some of the popular lines as well as commercial Shorthorn genetics being used are low or way low on MEPD.  Once I was advised not to use more than one bull in a 10 yr. cycle with negative MEPD.  With new EPD's "negative" probably means below 17 for milk.  Check out the spring 2017 milk numbers for your AI sires--some of the ones I'm using took a hit this time.  034 is in the lower 5% of the breed in milk, so stacking another bull with below average MEPD on an 034 daughter could cause a problem.

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2017, 10:59:29 AM »
I've found MEPD to be the least reliable EPD in terms of being an indicator of performance. 

Offline Duncraggan

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2017, 11:14:24 AM »
Appreciate all the kind words and interest in our upcoming sale.  This is our first online sale we are very excited.  I have a new appreciation for all those who have to get cattle ready for a sale.  Ive learned a lot and already have a list of things that will be different next time.  This is our 10th year with the Shorthorns and our 8th year with the Black Herefords.  It takes a few years to settle into the type of cattle you like and what works best for you.  Having 2 breeds is extra work but it gives us insight and has pushed us to fix things in each breed that ultimately make both of our herds better.

If anyone has further questions about any of the LOTS, send me a PM.  Thanks
I liked your sale bulls, hope you were satisfied with the prices.

Offline Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR

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Re: Dover/Coalpit/Orion
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2019, 01:50:36 PM »
Looking some pedigrees, got some XGR in front of pedigree numbers. What it's means?

 

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