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Offline garybob

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #30 on: October 22, 2007, 03:57:11 PM »
Justintime...he's a dude...lol..

GB...that might be one of your best posts of all time..I really liked it.
No, ShortyJock! He's THE MAN. If Knabe is President, then, we need JIT for Secretary of State, simply for his Diplomacy during difficult times.

Me? I'm just a RedNeck from the hills south of Branson. My apologies to Red. She's the one who invited me here. I just never thought that I'd rile anyone's negative emotions by promoting my ideas and beliefs on the topic of cattle breeding. I thought that's Why we're Here.

Ya'll tell DL I said "hello".

GB

Offline SD

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #31 on: October 22, 2007, 10:01:55 PM »
Oops! My bad! :o Sorry about that JIT.
Tact and Political Correctness were developed by those who lack the Testicular Fortitude to say what they really mean.

Offline aj

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #32 on: November 02, 2007, 07:54:04 AM »
Gary bob....I was curious on the herford bull that was popular and non-pigmented and feather necked. Was he a abs bull. I assume he was a horned herford..just curious I guess.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline garybob

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #33 on: November 04, 2007, 04:07:39 PM »
Gary bob....I was curious on the herford bull that was popular and non-pigmented and feather necked. Was he a abs bull. I assume he was a horned herford..just curious I guess.
AJ,

I was referring to a Bull that definitely pre-dates American Breeders' Service. He was popular in the era of around World War One, 1915, I think his name was Siilver Domino. Don't confuse him with the Line 1 Domino bloodlines developed by the USDA at Miles City, MT. This Bull I'm talking about is responsible for taking away, in one generation,the pigmentation, sound feet, good udders, (the traits that made Herefords popular on the Western Ranges). AND, what's worse, Uterine Prolapse became a more frequent problem about this time, all because of show ring "standards", set in place by "gentlemen farmers" in New England. They were looking for a pretty, white, non-pigmented face, that was pretty when it was washed.

Basically, when the uppity-uppity crowd invades a breed, they leave a mess in their wake.This is currently happennning in Shorthorns here in the USA.

Wake UP!!!!!!!!!!

Offline sue

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #34 on: November 04, 2007, 04:43:11 PM »
Why in the world isn't pha include in requirements. Is it because it isn't licensed or something. The durham red deal in a lot of ways is the only program in which the shorthorn breed will be taken seriously. You know that someone will take advantage of this deal. If you are a serious breeder you will demand a pha test also. The shorthorn board should stop this potential nightmare senario right by god now or they will have a huge wreck on there hands to dump on someone like bolze 10 years from now. I tested 5 durham red bull calves for th and pha also. All were clean except for 1 th positive. We must start this durham red deal off right as foundation herds are being started. I tested for pha because it is to simple not to. I have begged and begged  and begged to find out if nobodies fool is a pha carrier for 2 years and and no one speaks up. I don't like or use that line but it needs to be known. If you want to use pha positive cattle in the showring deal I really don't care but please lets not screw up the durham red deal for 5 years of profit when this could become a great line of cattle for a 100 years. It is to darn easy to test durham red cattle for pha right now instead of fighting another nightmare 10 years from now. ???

The PHA could still be included in the requirements and if I am not mistaken- PHA Marker is not officiall ?? So I think we are still in the same boat as we were when TH was pending ??? So nothing can be in writing at this point. We have tested two animals that go back to Fool and both are pHa free?? Not sure this helps you. I agree Durham Red is a great program and let's not screw it up. I have to comment about F1 and commerical breeders doing it for years. Durham Red, Balancer and other composite programs make it one stop shopping for commerical herds that have a strong Black Angus influence. Composite is the wave of the future and it is up to each Purebred breeder to continue to breed the best or purest or how ever you want to look at it. Hey just another plug about Durham Red Cattle- simply assume. I love my appendix free SH- but we have enjoyed our first group of DR. Please if you have not taken time to see a group of DR - please do.
Registered Red Angus x Shorthorn Composite Cattle. www.lakesidecattle.com

Offline DL

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #35 on: November 04, 2007, 05:14:31 PM »
Hey Sue - although the PHA test is not yet officially licenced results are available with lab numbers - so that the status can be recorded on the Maine papers. I think the ASA could have been more active re their take on the PHA status of DR cattle - the test is available and they could have required it - it seems (ie ASA and some Shorthorn breeders ignoring PHA) to be a trend - but then I am a zealot! Have some DR comin late spring - kinda excited...
Going to church doesn't make you a christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car

Offline knabe

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2007, 09:12:25 AM »
you can now get on your registration papers PHA and TH status.  one is P for obtained by parentage or T for test.  ie, if you had your cow tested and bred her to a bull that has a test, the offspring are clean by parentage (P).  this is to insure mixups that may have happened for whatever reason, and is not as conclusive as an actual test with a test number.  the voice should have an article about that.

attached pic is two different animals, one by test, the other by parentage.  the test one was out of a bull that i think joeboy had a positive out of, and he isn't tested, so i tested the heifer.  the other i didn't test as she's out of legacy plus and my midas cow who i had tested.
"The generation that told us to question authority, has now become the Authority we cannot question!"

Offline Jill

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2007, 10:27:27 AM »
In the thread earlier on that nobody really liked the parentage free thing because you didn't really verify that those were the actual parents.  Anyway from the response the verdict is still out (on this board anyway) on putting that there with no test, I guess I can see pros and cons both ways.  I guess to me your liability would greatly increase if I have a calf that wasn't really out of that bull and I now have a PHA calf when my paper says she was free, I guess I would feel more comfortable having nothing there as opposed to the possibility of being wrong.

Offline knabe

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Re: Shorthorn question
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2007, 10:40:03 AM »
i agree jill.  it's an intermediate step.  obviously one can blood type to get the parentage as well, and the association rightly requires this to be an ai sire or to register any calves from a cow from a flush.  for me, i am always leery about the parents of any animal, regardless of PHA/TH status.  too many on purpose "mistakes" in just about every breed to put head in sand.
"The generation that told us to question authority, has now become the Authority we cannot question!"

 

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