I will preface the following by stating i am already biased towards the young man of whom i will speak. Last year a young man in our ffa was kicked out do to the fact he tried to get a teacher fired over false accusations all because the teacher would not attend an event that he wanted to. The mother of the boy threatened to sue or cause enough problems that the school decided to reinstate the boy for this year. So to this point this year all has ran smooth he has appeared to have taken better care of his heifer and the responsibilities that entailed. Now the part that has me fuming. The boy just got a steer and was gung ho to get it halter broke. Love the enthusiasm. The young man gets the halter on and ties up the animal. Some of you may already have a little idea where this is headed, but not the part that has me fuming. We are in Texas so its still hot. The boy then decides that after all of the work getting the calf haltered that he needs a drink! He proceeds to leave the steer tied up while he leaves to go to the store to get a drink. Mind you this will take a minimum of 15-20 minutes. Needless to say by now you have a clue what has happened. The steer tried to fight ran his head through the fence got tangled in a matter where he couldn't get free and strangled to death. My thought is he needs to be removed from the program or forced to sell his animals. Noe only has he proved to be incapable of properly caring for others or his animals he could have put others in the program in a bad light The wrong person(s) catch wind and they could start so kind of fight to end the program all together. I realize this is a kid and maybe I'm being unreasonable but none the less I needed to vent. If nothing else just remember how important it is to be responsible with your animals or bad things can happen and I wish that on no one.
some one talk me down!
- Thread starter cebwtx
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sizzler14
Well-known member
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- Jan 17, 2012
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Probably not the best response to this but it is my opinion. This is the exact reason why they should bring the paddle back to school. If he would have got some sense knocked into him at a younger age, he may have grew up with a little more brains instead of an airhead. Still a firm believer if they brought the paddle back to school and gave the kids a whack or two when they were caught with drugs etc instead of patting them on the back, more kids would be leading better lives. JMO! In some of these situations much like this one, Si Robertson says it best, 'YOU CANT FIX STUPID JACK!". My thoughts are you can but its illegal <cowboy> but hey, he has a ledgit point
Sizzler I think you hit the nail on the head. You read between the lines. I say this because I didn't mention the fact that the mother failed to see that the boy had done anything wrong. Actually was inferring that it had to be someone else's fault. The way the fence was made, improper teacher instruction etc... So not only does the boy need a belt so does the parent.
rackranch
Well-known member
My thought is that unless your the Ag teacher you should mind your own business and worry about your own projects.
I'm not the ag teacher but I was the first person he called when the incident occurred. Considering our program is in the city and we have total of 5 kids with cattle projects its kind of hard to not be somewhat involved. I donate as much time as I can to try and keep FFA going in our area as its not very popular. I did say in my post that I might be on the harsh side but most people on this site are looking for the best interest of their respected programs and that's my concern for our program.
There are always kids that cause trouble or
neglect their projects. Sometimes it ends up with a skinny animal, a wild one, or occasionally a dead one. There are much worse cases out there - kids intentionally turning loose someone elses pig projects, killing them, etc. As much as these cases make us mad, its up to the ag teacher to deal with it. If they attack the ag teacher, then you can defend him to the school admin.
neglect their projects. Sometimes it ends up with a skinny animal, a wild one, or occasionally a dead one. There are much worse cases out there - kids intentionally turning loose someone elses pig projects, killing them, etc. As much as these cases make us mad, its up to the ag teacher to deal with it. If they attack the ag teacher, then you can defend him to the school admin.
I just want to clarify this is more of a vent than a linching. Chambero my concern is the kid I'm talking about is prone to do some of the other things youve stated. This being said I would not hesitate to help the young man or give him suggestions on his projects. I think it's a lead by example kind of situation. My daughter has 3 animals at the barn and yes her pens animals etc... are kept nicer than anyone else's. I take pride that's how she handles her projects but I don't expect everyone to be as vested as she is. It's more of a frustration of the lack of common sense that some have. The mother who believes her son can do no wrong gets less of a leash from me as she places blame on others such as the teacher who doesn't deserve the headache.
Davis Shorthorns
Well-known member
rackranch said:
Im sorry but no, when it comes to the miss handling of animals and it is causing them to suffer and die it is more than just a teachers problem. Take it to the teacher if they don't do something about it take it to who ever you can. You can not let the whole program get taken away for one moron. That animal didn't have to die how it did. If you just let someone else deal with it how can you be sure it doesn't happen again? Never turn a blind eye to something just because it should be someone else' problem.
And now I know why the world is in the state that it is.
Abuse of animals is EVERYONE'S problem and EVERYONE'S concern. Do NOT look the other way, and do NOT throw it into someone else's ring and let it be.
Cebwtx- I would talk to the advisor and express your concerns. I would then make an appt with the principal, superintendent and ask the advisor to be present. Express your concerns and tell them point blank, that this student should NOT be allowed to own animals. Be blunt and be forceful, but try and keep your anger in check. If that does not produce positive results, make an appt with the school board.
Be prepared to have a confrontation with the "parent", but again, be blunt and forceful, but do not get mad. Get your facts in order of his past behavior and how it threatens not only animals, but other students safety. Explain what animals rights groups are and how this students action makes the group a target. If possible, have other parents explain how they do not want their students subject to this bad apples example or harmful actions. Try not to go it alone, but if you must, then march forward.
The only way for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing. (Not my quote, but certainly quite fitting for this issue)
Abuse of animals is EVERYONE'S problem and EVERYONE'S concern. Do NOT look the other way, and do NOT throw it into someone else's ring and let it be.
Cebwtx- I would talk to the advisor and express your concerns. I would then make an appt with the principal, superintendent and ask the advisor to be present. Express your concerns and tell them point blank, that this student should NOT be allowed to own animals. Be blunt and be forceful, but try and keep your anger in check. If that does not produce positive results, make an appt with the school board.
Be prepared to have a confrontation with the "parent", but again, be blunt and forceful, but do not get mad. Get your facts in order of his past behavior and how it threatens not only animals, but other students safety. Explain what animals rights groups are and how this students action makes the group a target. If possible, have other parents explain how they do not want their students subject to this bad apples example or harmful actions. Try not to go it alone, but if you must, then march forward.
The only way for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing. (Not my quote, but certainly quite fitting for this issue)
The ag teacher was the one who originally notified me of what happened. I talked to him and he was taking the matter to the next level today. I haven't heard what came of that yet. The thing is for the most part the people who are up the ladder couldn't tell the difference in a bull and a cow. So i guess it's a wait and see situation. Like I say personally I don't think the boy should have the animal(s) but I don't call the shots.
In all honesty, an ag teacher doesnt have the right to say a kid can/cant show. They can control whether its kept at a school barn maybe. Although stupid, a school couldnt win a court case for "abuse" in a case like this.
None of us have the authority we wish we did like this.
None of us have the authority we wish we did like this.
Chambero you are right. He's in the second year with the heifer he has. When he was dismissed from FFA last year he showed her as 4h. He was even penned with us at ft worth. The entries had already been sent. He did haul his own animal. There is unfortunately no perfect world we just have to do the best we can to make it a better place. At least maybe everyone will be cautious when tying up their animals and not have the same problem. Though we try to be responsible with our animals I know we get lackadaisical at times. If nothing else comes of it maybe it at least keeps us more on our toes.
cebwtx, I read your first post several times to make sure I got it right. I understand from what you said this young man had caused trouble in the past, but the trouble he caused didn't seem to have anything to do with the care he gave his animals.? Does the earlier incident have anything to do with what happened to this calf?
In your own words, you said he was doing much better with his heifer and things have been going smoothly this year. Was it a smart thing to leave a calf tied up for the first time (was it the first time?) for 20 minutes? Maybe not, but I'd need more information before I'd march him to the gallows. You didn't say he tied him high and he threw himself down and hung himself or anything like that. From what you said it sounds like an unfortunate accident!
In one breath, you're offering this young man support and advice and in the next, your stabbing him in the back and calling him unworthy or stupid?! Your "leading by example" by getting on a forum and trashing a young person... real adult.
We had a calf die under similar circumstances at our Ag farm and it never once occurred to me to try to get that young person banned from owning an animal or being in FFA.
Sizzler14... beating the kid with a paddle is the answer... really?
I'm with rackranch on this one.... mind your own business and let the ag teacher handle it.
In your own words, you said he was doing much better with his heifer and things have been going smoothly this year. Was it a smart thing to leave a calf tied up for the first time (was it the first time?) for 20 minutes? Maybe not, but I'd need more information before I'd march him to the gallows. You didn't say he tied him high and he threw himself down and hung himself or anything like that. From what you said it sounds like an unfortunate accident!
In one breath, you're offering this young man support and advice and in the next, your stabbing him in the back and calling him unworthy or stupid?! Your "leading by example" by getting on a forum and trashing a young person... real adult.
We had a calf die under similar circumstances at our Ag farm and it never once occurred to me to try to get that young person banned from owning an animal or being in FFA.
Sizzler14... beating the kid with a paddle is the answer... really?
I'm with rackranch on this one.... mind your own business and let the ag teacher handle it.
knabe
Well-known member
PETA might have an opinion on show animals.
cebwtx said:
Who was/is responsible to teach this kid proper care of his animals? Who teaches the kid what is right and what is wrong with regards to animal care? Who is his mentor? What FFA adult is helping him? Isn't FFA suppose to be an educational experience? If the kid has no guidance what does it say about the whole FFA program at this school? Kids often do not think of the consequences of their action (well some adults too) - there is nothing in your rant to indicate that this kid purposely tied up the calf with the idea that he would strangle and die - was what he did stupid - yup, but abuse is a willful act - this sounds a lot like a bunch of adults ganging up on a difficult kid. IMHO the problem is lack of adult supervision and guidance - chances are people in your FFA read this board, know the kid and now have read your biased against the kid rant - sometimes, as evidenced by this thread, it is darn hard to be a reasonable adult
SWMO
Well-known member
Where are his Parents? Parents are ultimately responsible for raising their children and responsible for the actions and inactions. That is why our countries kids are in the shape they are in. Their parents are not holding their own children accountable.
knabe
Well-known member
Parents have been taught to not hold their kids accountsble or expose them to failure since the 60's.
Perhaps this will be a wake up moment for this young man.
Sometimes events like these are their first exposure to responsibility.
Perhaps this will be a wake up moment for this young man.
Sometimes events like these are their first exposure to responsibility.
knabe said:
Odd you would mention that. There is actually a push by peta and the humane society to get rid of 4-H and FFA due to the fact it teaches kids to "become attached to an animal and then to chop off its head and eat it"; which in their opinion teaches callousness toward animals. There is also a you-tube video pushing for all show animals to be banned from the food chain due to "all the illegal and harmful drugs" that are given to show animals.
SWMO - If more "examples" were made of kids and situations, those situations wouldn't happen so often. I was at a salebarn and noticed a worker using a hot shot on an animal in an alley way for no reason. It had no room to move. Another worker told them to stop, but the kid kept zapping it. The other kid took the hot shot away and zapped the kid several times and told him if he caught him again using the hot shot, he would find "somewhere else to stick it and make his point." The kid looked at me and said "You saw that right?" "Nope, I didn't see a thing." was my reply.
I never did see that kid use a hot shot again.
Again, if examples are made of more kids, those situations wouldn't happen over and over again.
