RyanChandler
Well-known member
Bahahahaha
Tyranny
- Thread starter RankeCattleCo
- Start date
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knabe
Well-known member
Reid and is cronies are committing racketeering and all you woosies think it's it's about me.
Bahahahahahahahaha
Bahahahahahahahaha
XBAR - you stated that "we live in a representative democracy. Majority rules. The minority interest has no choice."
We live in a Representative Constitutional Republic. There is a slight but very important distinction. Majority rules. However, the Majority can not infringe or remove the rights of the minority.
"James Madison cautioned that under a democratic government, “There is nothing to check the inducement to sacrifice the weaker party or the obnoxious individual.” John Adams argued that democracies merely grant revocable rights to citizens depending on the whims of the masses, while a republic exists to secure and protect pre-existing rights. Yet how many Americans know that the word “democracy” is found neither in the Constitution nor the Declaration of Independence, our very founding documents?"
I just starting reading about this story today. But it seems to essentially boil down to an issue of states' rights versus an overreaching federal government.
Apparently Bundy feels that Nevada is the owner of the land and thus is not willing to pay the US Government for the grazing rights. His family has been grazing the land since the 1870's - and he states that he doesn't have a contract with the federal government (implying that his grazing contracts are with the state?) As I understand it, he has attempted to pay the grazing rights to the state or the county but they would not accept the payment.
Seems like another round of the “Sagebrush Rebellion” - "a collection of unsuccessful state and local efforts, beginning in 1978, to assert title to federal lands or force their divestiture".
We live in a Representative Constitutional Republic. There is a slight but very important distinction. Majority rules. However, the Majority can not infringe or remove the rights of the minority.
"James Madison cautioned that under a democratic government, “There is nothing to check the inducement to sacrifice the weaker party or the obnoxious individual.” John Adams argued that democracies merely grant revocable rights to citizens depending on the whims of the masses, while a republic exists to secure and protect pre-existing rights. Yet how many Americans know that the word “democracy” is found neither in the Constitution nor the Declaration of Independence, our very founding documents?"
I just starting reading about this story today. But it seems to essentially boil down to an issue of states' rights versus an overreaching federal government.
Apparently Bundy feels that Nevada is the owner of the land and thus is not willing to pay the US Government for the grazing rights. His family has been grazing the land since the 1870's - and he states that he doesn't have a contract with the federal government (implying that his grazing contracts are with the state?) As I understand it, he has attempted to pay the grazing rights to the state or the county but they would not accept the payment.
Seems like another round of the “Sagebrush Rebellion” - "a collection of unsuccessful state and local efforts, beginning in 1978, to assert title to federal lands or force their divestiture".
-XBAR- said:
knabe
Well-known member
The federal government has a problem with that phrase, " all else is left to the stares.
knabe
Well-known member
Quick. Attack the messenger
http://www.infowars.com/breaking-sen-harry-reid-behind-blm-land-grab-of-bundy-ranch/
Al Capone would be proud.
http://www.infowars.com/breaking-sen-harry-reid-behind-blm-land-grab-of-bundy-ranch/
Al Capone would be proud.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
You should be above sources like that- you're resorting to trickery.
Eggbert - what right is being infringed upon or removed?
Eggbert - what right is being infringed upon or removed?
I am not necessarily saying that Bundy's rights are being infringe upon or removed, but just want people to know that we live in a Representative Constitutional Republic NOT a Representative Democracy. If we lived in a Representative Democracy...the majority could infringe upon or remove the rights of the minority - which should be considered dangerous whether you are progressive or conservative.
I will admit that is hard to determine who is right in this case - is the land owned by the federal government, the state of Nevada, or even Clark County? Bundy obviously believes that the federal government has no constitutional authority over the lands in question. As a result, he refuses to pay the grazing fees. I tend to agree with him as I am a proponent of state's rights and believe that states to express more independence.
"Bundy has in fact paid fees to Clark County, Nevada in an arrangement pre-dating the BLM. The BLM arrived much later, changed the details of the setup without consulting with Bundy — or any other rancher — and then began systematically driving out cattle and ranchers. Bundy refused to pay BLM, especially after they demanded he reduce his herd’s head count down to a level that would not sustain his ranch. Bundy OWNS the water and forage rights to this land. He paid for these rights. He built fences, established water ways, and constructed roads with his own money, with the approval of Nevada and BLM" - http://danaloeschradio.com/the-real-story-of-the-bundy-ranch/
I will admit that is hard to determine who is right in this case - is the land owned by the federal government, the state of Nevada, or even Clark County? Bundy obviously believes that the federal government has no constitutional authority over the lands in question. As a result, he refuses to pay the grazing fees. I tend to agree with him as I am a proponent of state's rights and believe that states to express more independence.
"Bundy has in fact paid fees to Clark County, Nevada in an arrangement pre-dating the BLM. The BLM arrived much later, changed the details of the setup without consulting with Bundy — or any other rancher — and then began systematically driving out cattle and ranchers. Bundy refused to pay BLM, especially after they demanded he reduce his herd’s head count down to a level that would not sustain his ranch. Bundy OWNS the water and forage rights to this land. He paid for these rights. He built fences, established water ways, and constructed roads with his own money, with the approval of Nevada and BLM" - http://danaloeschradio.com/the-real-story-of-the-bundy-ranch/
-XBAR- said:
knabe said:
One word, move ..... BTW I offered a while back to donate to your campaign fund to get you and your ideas put forth for all to see ,not just those of us who are blessed to get daily installments of your idea of "perfect government" . And if you are wondering there is no such thing.. You sure were hard on Old man sir loincloth for talking crazy and beating us over the head with his opinions and yet.... So try practicing what you preach and do something to make it better Mr chicken hawk, or Not.. you are probably too busy dispising indians , hispanics,the lil old lady at the fsa office , maybe its aj and his th bull, or educating us on all our shortcomings or just might be you are stewing over having to replace yet another caulvert. Any way I am sure you just can't find the "time".
trevorgreycattleco
Well-known member
I'd gladly run for any office if I had the backing. <rock>
knabe
Well-known member
Cry me a river when they come after you. Fairness seems to be a crime. Harry Reid is a crook and you are worried about me. I have to laugh. You are not understanding the consequences of his actions. Personally, Harry Reid has less factual credibility than Alex jones. I apologize for forcing you to open threads and forcing you to read them.
Of course there is no perfect government but one that keeps getting bigger and bigger each election cycle has a logical conclusion. Paid your health care deductible yet and your higher premium and switched doctors yet and wanted a specialist out of network? Own it.
I agree Alex jones is not even remotely a good source, but go ahead and kill the messenger.
Once again, it appears people just can not stand choice.
As for sir loin cloth, I asked many relevant questions about the scientific method, faulty extrapolation and actually stood up for him. Sorry if that's inappropriate. When asked, I said he wasn't hurting anyone. Again sorry if that's inappropriate.
As for aj, he continually bashes show genetics yet takes show genetics defects to Denver and tries to sell a defect bull. Sorry if its inapprpropriate to point out the irony. I would venture the number of comments of aj bashing show genetics far out numbers mine calling him on his hypocrisy. Again I apologize if that ratio should be smaller.
Of course there is no perfect government but one that keeps getting bigger and bigger each election cycle has a logical conclusion. Paid your health care deductible yet and your higher premium and switched doctors yet and wanted a specialist out of network? Own it.
I agree Alex jones is not even remotely a good source, but go ahead and kill the messenger.
Once again, it appears people just can not stand choice.
As for sir loin cloth, I asked many relevant questions about the scientific method, faulty extrapolation and actually stood up for him. Sorry if that's inappropriate. When asked, I said he wasn't hurting anyone. Again sorry if that's inappropriate.
As for aj, he continually bashes show genetics yet takes show genetics defects to Denver and tries to sell a defect bull. Sorry if its inapprpropriate to point out the irony. I would venture the number of comments of aj bashing show genetics far out numbers mine calling him on his hypocrisy. Again I apologize if that ratio should be smaller.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
Eggbert said:
How do you feel about this definition? I was always under the impression that a representative democracy was a kind of republic?
http://www.williampmeyers.org/republic.html
knabe
Well-known member
Labels don't matter. It was set up to have high thresholds for decision making to balance interests instead of simple majorities as they understood that simple majorities led to tyranny.
They of course understood the life cycle of power and that all forms of government are subject to a sort of monarchy, ie clinton/bush as well and felt their system would delay that cycle slow enough for the public to be aware of it. Alas, we are not.
Here's another opinion.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Fraser_Tytler
They of course understood the life cycle of power and that all forms of government are subject to a sort of monarchy, ie clinton/bush as well and felt their system would delay that cycle slow enough for the public to be aware of it. Alas, we are not.
Here's another opinion.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Fraser_Tytler
trevorgreycattleco
Well-known member
Anyone reporting news today has a agenda. Of course Alex jones wants the shock factor. It pays the bills. Just like every other damn media outlet going. Twc77 could you show me where I should go to get my info? If you think for a second there isn't some big changes going on then that's sad. Petrol dollar going down? Russia/china getting cosy. The largest debt in the history of the world. Half of our country doesn't even work ! I truly believe some major corrections are coming one or another. There will be winners and losers.
I guess I'll just listen to Diane Sawyer all the time. Surely she never twists the news. Exploits it for viewers. Flocks to a black guy getting shot by a half white half Hispanic guy. Flock to a school shooting and name it a massacre and play dramatic music. Yea the mainstream media is much more reliable then Alex jones. They are all the same. Anybody who is ACTUALLY ON THE GROUND AND INTERVIEWING CLIVEN BUNDY is getting news out. It's up to us to take it for what it's worth.
I guess I'll just listen to Diane Sawyer all the time. Surely she never twists the news. Exploits it for viewers. Flocks to a black guy getting shot by a half white half Hispanic guy. Flock to a school shooting and name it a massacre and play dramatic music. Yea the mainstream media is much more reliable then Alex jones. They are all the same. Anybody who is ACTUALLY ON THE GROUND AND INTERVIEWING CLIVEN BUNDY is getting news out. It's up to us to take it for what it's worth.
trevorgreycattleco
Well-known member
Sean Hannity is all over this too. He must be like Alex jones too.
knabe
Well-known member
$1500mo plus deductible of $6500.
knabe
Well-known member
http://twitchy.com/2014/04/11/freaky-photoshop-disaster-jay-carney-puff-piece-goes-hilariously-wrong-pics/
Too funny. Wouldn't be surprised if his relatives weren't fellow travelers.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fellow_traveller
They ended up in fdr's administration.
The "revolution" has been going on for quite a while.
Like the commies from Russia said, the easiest way to conquer America is from the inside and without a shot.
Too funny. Wouldn't be surprised if his relatives weren't fellow travelers.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fellow_traveller
They ended up in fdr's administration.
The "revolution" has been going on for quite a while.
Like the commies from Russia said, the easiest way to conquer America is from the inside and without a shot.
. Organize, you will want to bargain for maintenance of benefits. /color]