What are everone's opinions on this?

I'm new to this forum, and don't post alot, but I am on here at least once a day reading all the great posts, and there are tons of great posts at that.
I have a question that I'd like everyone's opinions on, but don't want to offend anyone, I hope I don't get bombarded with hateful comments for asking.

What is your opinion on the the amount of money some families spend on a steer for their son/daughter to bring to a small county fair?
I'm not talking a big show like the State Expo's or something you would find in Texas, I'm just talking a small county fair.
Some of the kids at our fair, and a few surrounding counties, raise steers that were born on their farm, or maybe have to go out and buy a steer with what they can afford, some not able to afford much. Then they work their butts off all summer working with that steer, only to have someone who has gone out and spent $10,00-$20,000 on a steer and probably their parents spent more time with it than their kid (because who in their right mind would invest that kind of money in a steer and let a first time 4H'er raise it on their own).

I have been struggling with this for some time, and I just want to know if it's just me or do other people feel it's wrong also?  Maybe I'm just jealous, who knows.  But I can't see spending that much money on something that after you show, and say you do win Grand Champion, will be slaughtered, and you are out that money.  You will never be able to recoup any money from that steer.  The money spent on the steer including feed, etc, will never come close to what you get out of it come sale time.

Do you feel there should be a *cap* put on the amount of money one is allowed to spend on a steer or any other animal for that matter, for a county fair?

There, I got it off my chest.  I'm sorry if I'm offended anyone, it was not my intention.    Thanks for reading  :-\

For me it is kindof comparable to parents who spend thousands of dollars on their kid to attend every camp possible for their respective sport only to have the kid burn out when they get older, or the kid is a great young athlete... only to flop when they get older.  I have struggled with the same stuff before in cattle .... as well as other areas.  Wether it was people who purchase a record book hunts or dirt track racing.  We always try to do our very best with what we have.  There have been days when the sun has shown on us and all seems Grand... but then we go to the next show and get humbled once again.  Like an old coach of mine said.... "Leave it on the floor/field. All you can do is your best, let God do the rest".     

I guess this is the way I see it. We have a fairly competitive county fair. I know kids who spend $5-10 on steers but they also show at a state level and go to all the different jackpots in the surround states. Our county is so late it makes for a nice sale in the fall that they get to show for almost a year with one calf. I also know families that can take a 1000 calf and make it look like 5000. Half of the battle with any calf is the care and feeding. We don't spend that kind of money and most of the time we raise what we take. We do alright and the kids have never complained. By having those high dollar calves at our county level it makes us work little harder with what we have. We don't mind it because we have beat some of those calves in class and sat in the final drive more than once. IF it were my kids I would explain to them it should make you want to work harder with what you have. Yeah there are people who are jealous and make a stink every year after the county level but it all boils down to hard work. You can win with a $2000 calf it just takes someone with a good eye picking one out and hardwork to go with it. I don't think you can set a limit on what a family can spend. To each their own.
What we did was watch some of the high dollar calves our first year and watched those families. Many of them work just as hard as we do with our home raised etc. No matter what you compete in there will all be someone who can out spend everyone.
JMO

We struggled with that when our son was in ag in high school.  He had a decent heifer, but not one that would ever win big
events although she'd usually do fairly well in local arenas.  Then we'd see these high dollar steers and heifers and it was hard,
but he handled it well.  He worked his butt off every day with her, and when the showmanship classes rolled around is when he
had a chance to shine. She might not have won breed or champion, but he could kiss at her and she'd do exactly what she was
supposed to. It's harder for the kids who don't have those resources, so look for those opportunities to show how hard they've
worked. In fact, I've seen threads on here that encourage ways of recognizing these kids that work so hard and don't sit back
and let their parents do the work. And sometimes you can find an inexpensive animal and turn it into something with the right
program.  Hang in there - it's all good learning experience!

I'm not saying those who spend that much DON"T work with their animals,  because I know of some who have spent  alot of money on their steer and I know they take care of them.  I didn't mean to imply they didn't work with them.
When we first started out showing, we took what we raised here on our farm.  Then the next couple of years, we didn't have any steers to take, so we had to bite the bullet and go out and buy one.  Spent $800, and it nearly broke my heart.  Next year, spent $800 and beat out a $20,000 steer.  If I were the parents of the kid who lost to us, I would have cried.  I agree with what you said.  The more work you put into it, the more payoff you'll get.

I understand what you are saying but I don't know how you could ever put a cap on it.  We paid $2500 for the heifer that my daughter showed last year, she will make a great cow and was an average show heifer.  We have some people in our county that pay 5 times that for show cattle, that is fine for them but not what i want to do.  I am sure there are people in our county that think we are crazy for spending $2500....I think people are crazy for spending $12,500.  My point is....how would you set a cap?  For me $12,500 is crazy and $2500 makes sence, for another $2,500 is crazy and $750 makes sence.

Excellent post coachmac, all you can do is do your best with what you have and don't worry about what everyone else is spending, there is always going to be someone that is better, faster, spends more or works harder, that's just life.

One other thing to add.  If I asked my kids what they were looking forward to at the fair this year I seriously doubt either would mention walking in the show ring.  They would talk about the 4H float in the parade, running around the midway, letting their friends from school that don't show cattle lead their calves around, watermelon feed, animal scramble, and I could go on.  I think sometimes as parents we get more caught up in winning than our kids do.  We don't even bring big cattle to the fair anymore...just 5 or 6 feeder calves and we enjoy the week.

blackcows said:

  For me $12,500 is crazy and $2500 makes sence, for another $2,500 is crazy and $750 makes sence.

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That last part says alot, it's all about perspective. You're going to run into these types of situations on ANY form of competition no matter if its showing livestock, racing, sports, etc.

Different families have different goals in the cattle showing game, and definitely different bank accounts.

I have seen many high-dollar steers win a show or place high and get in the sale. I saw a $70,000 steer get the gate @ Ft. Worth last year.

What a buncha "average" income folks do is look for that diamond -in -the -rough that is reasonably priced and then work hard to beat the high-dollar calves. This can be very rewarding and satisfying.

We raised and sold a very good Angus heifer (for $3300) that beat a $25,000 heifer TWICE this year. We have had a $1500 heifer beat an $8500 heifer from a high-profile ranch in Oklahoma. The difference was not in the heifers, as all were good. It was the better job of fitting, feeding, and stickn' the heifer that won.

Of course, to some people,  $1500 or $3500 heifer is too expensive. Others will not even come look, thinking that they are too cheap, so they could not be as good as the $10,000. calf from another breeder or jock.

My recommendation: find a very knowledgeable cattle person that you trust, that has had much success in the showring, and pay them for their expertise, and forget your ego, and let them help you find a good calf in your price range.

For me $12,500 is crazy and $2500 makes sence, for another $2,500 is crazy and $750 makes sence.

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You are very right.  Although $2500 for a heifer that you can continue to use for years to come makes more sense than $20,000 for a steer that will be butchered.  
Our fair IS our vacation.  We camp there, and spend the entire week.  The kids love to hanging out at the barns with their friends, eating nothing but *fair food* all week and for the most part, don't seem to even care about my*concerns*.   I just hate it as a parent because I see how hard they work and while I know life isn't always fair, I wish it was a little more even playing field.
Thanks for all  your opinions, I appreciate EVERYONES imput  <beer>

What a buncha "average" income folks do is look for that diamond -in -the -rough that is reasonably priced and then work hard to beat the high-dollar calves. This can be very rewarding and satisfying.

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You guys have a way of making someone feel so much better.  I guess I was always one to assume that the high dollar animals were always going to be better.  Thanks for your thoughts.......

coachmac - you said it

everyone has a hobby that you dump money into it and people look at you funny, some people look at my cousin funny because he pours money into an old hobby car, people ask me why in the hell did i spend $1500 on a rifle just to shoot coyotes, or like what coachmac said about sports,  same thing why did someone spend 20K on a steer? b/c they want to, it is what makes them happy, some strive to that "Grand champion",

is it unfair to those that work hard and use homeraised cattle or reasonable priced and get beat by a high dollar deal? probably, but its probably just a dose of true life......also if winning is the only thing one thinks they can get out of 4-H, FFA, and junior breed shows.. they need to rethink their priorities.

i have been on mostly the nonhigh dollar animal end of the cattle showing deal, and the ones that put the time in and learn how to beat the high dollars ones will be happier with a reserve w/ a homeraised animal than a supreme with a bought animal

just my take-


JWW

Our goal is to treat this little cattle enterprise as a business and a college fund.  We will not pay more than we think the steer will sell for at fair.  Purchased steers have to at least make a couple hundred dollars with jackpot winnings, premiums and final sale.  Otherwise it isn't teaching the kid anything.  We have purchased his heifers and he now has a few nice cows that are having prospect calves for him so he can show what he raises.  This is the college savings plan.  He knows that if his calves win it is a big deal because he has not invested the money, but has invested the time.  We know one kid at county fair that probably makes more money than anyone by just bringing in a common old steer every year, placing in the bottom two of his class, does his marketing with prospective buyers and sells near the end of the sale.  He is probably the best businessman in the show.

russfarm said:

I can't see spending that much money on something that after you show, and say you do win Grand Champion, will be slaughtered, and you are out that money.  You will never be able to recoup any money from that steer. 

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it's just fun.  you lose money on fun all the time.  do you buy a used car, or a fancy one?  take satisfaction in getting people to bid on your steer, or actually getting it fat and selling it and having someone be a repeat customer. 

the notion that everyone should win will never go away.  that's why liberty requires vigilance.  if everyone  wins, everyone loses.

Truth, Justice, and The American Way! I personally feel very fortunate to live in the USA!

The most emotional bashing of my pre-adult life was the year I did some consistant winning with a home raised steer. But I know now it was by an insignificant few, including accusations from bought off judges to illegal professional fitting. At least high dollar cattle are expected to win.

The complaining done by those "insignificant few" children, in part, grow up to be insignificant adults. What really matters is the group of people, children and adults, gathered around the winners with smiles, handshakes, and hugs. These are the people that matter! Win or loose!

If your upset getting rolled with a home raised calf, how you gonna handle gettin rolled with one you mortgaged the house for?

ELBEE said:

how you gonna handle gettin rolled with one you mortgaged the house for?

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blame everyone else.

ELBEE I agree 100%! Same thing happened to me with a couple steers I raised when I was younger.  

If you put a cap on what people can spend, the same people will still win.  We've beaten numerous heifers that cost many times what our calves did, and we've also been beaten by heifers that cost less than ours (not as often, but it has happened). I love finding deals on calves- heck this year we ended up buying 4 heifers for what I originally planned on spending on one.  

Does your county have a rate of gain contest? Put your effort there. We raise or buy steers at market price with the goal of actually making a profit. The high dollar calves are often fed hard early and then "held". You can't dictate what someone's going to spend as long as they play by the rules. And kids need to learn that not everyone gets a turn at being champion. Maybe if Mom and Dad were more excited about being 3rd in class the kids would see that as a victory too.

GoWyo said:

Our goal is to treat this little cattle enterprise as a business and a college fund.  We will not pay more than we think the steer will sell for at fair.  Purchased steers have to at least make a couple hundred dollars with jackpot winnings, premiums and final sale.  Otherwise it isn't teaching the kid anything.  We have purchased his heifers and he now has a few nice cows that are having prospect calves for him so he can show what he raises.  This is the college savings plan.  He knows that if his calves win it is a big deal because he has not invested the money, but has invested the time.  We know one kid at county fair that probably makes more money than anyone by just bringing in a common old steer every year, placing in the bottom two of his class, does his marketing with prospective buyers and sells near the end of the sale.  He is probably the best businessman in the show.

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This is the most important quote as far as I am concerned.  We have won our county fair several times with home raised steers and we never spend much money on a steer that we buy.  We are trying to teach our kids the importance of money and that you cannot spend more than you can win and sell the end product for.  We are more geared toward showing heifers anyway and even though the kids enjoy showing their steers at the county level they decided this year to only show females and concentrate on them.  We rarely ever try to compete beyond the county level with steers because we do not want to put our resources there.  We would rather compete beyond the county level with females it is just more fun for us. 


I also agree that my kids and many others have more FUN at our county fair than any other show they go to.  This is where they see all their friends and get to run around with them for several days.  Also our female show is very competitive and their are several families including us that would rather win the supreme female award than the champion steer banner.  I think more feeling are hurt at our county over the supreme female trophy than the steer banner.