Will this feed recipe work?

Davidsonranch · Jan 31, 2013

Been working with Dan (AAOK) to try and get a feed recipe that is "close" to his using the limited ingredients I can get here in SE Oregon. Not being in or near the corn / grain belt sure isn't fun! Please note I cannot get cottonseed hulls or shredded beet pulp. But per my mill and nutritionist working on it this mix should be about 13-14% protein for our growing calves that will be shown at our Labor Day 2013 fair. Note the barley and no corn. I might as well be buying gold than corn in my area so the rolled barley was recommended as a substitute. For an idea, this mix will cost me $518 a ton.
Here is the mix per ton:

1200 lbs. rolled barley
250 lbs. oats
200 lbs. beet pulp pellets (substituted for cottonseed hulls per AAOK - wish I could get shredded)
250 lbs. soy bean meal
100 lbs. molasses

Does this sound like a good try? Wanting some input before I make the first order.

J2F · Jan 31, 2013

I can't speak for the feed but don't forget about the mineral.

blackdiamond · Jan 31, 2013

Rolled barley and corn are pretty similar. Barley will put a 'harder' touch on one though.

best thing I an say, is try it for a couple of months and give it plenty of time to either work or fail...

CAB · Jan 31, 2013

Do you have an experienced beef nutritionist available to you? If so run the ration by him/her. The only question that I have is whether or not you may run into should compaction issues feeding that % of barley.

blackdiamond · Jan 31, 2013

CAB said:
Do you have an experienced beef nutritionist available to you? If so run the ration by him/her. The only question that I have is whether or not you may run into should compaction issues feeding that % of barley.

Do you think the 'fluffiness' of the feed might counteract that though?

Of course, I mix my feed with 200 beet pulp and 200 cottonseed, instead of just using one ingrediant. My feed is bulky enough that 40 pounds barely fits into standard 50 pound bags...

I suppose my cottonseed is fluffier than straight beet pulp would be.

cowman 52 · Jan 31, 2013

I would double the hulls and feed more of the feed, would be a little concerned that there will be a bit of overeating if you are not careful.

Davidsonranch · Jan 31, 2013

After working on this darn near all day, I've decided that I will most likely look at decreasing the barley and adding a little more oats and then either adding a little more soy bean meal or possibly look at some protein/vit pellets to make up the difference. I've been reading and article from the University of South Dakota (I think) on a study substituting barley for corn in feed lot / steer gains. They found that any mix that has 50% barley or more is about as high as you should go. The nutritionist I have been working with keeps giving me the protein levels but me not thinking, forgot to ask about the fat content. A friend of mine thinks it sounds good but worried it did not have enough fat? I was shooting for 12-13% protein and 4.5-6% fat?? I would have never thought I would have spent this much time on this. Availability of ingredients has been huge.
So does this sound better?
1000 barley
400 oats
200 beet pulp (dang I wish I could get cottonseed hulls out here)
300 soy bean meal
100 molasses

ploughshare · Jan 31, 2013

The amount of bean meal concerns me. Not as an ingredient, but from a palatability standpoint. The molasses will help, but I have had rejection issues due to bean meal. You might want to off set the amount with some ddg.

Davidsonranch · Jan 31, 2013

I'm glad you brought this up with the soybean meal. I have options of using it or a 30% protein pellets as a source of protein. AAOK said to use the soybean meal instead of protein pellets? I think the soybean meal is close to 40% protein?

blackdiamond · Jan 31, 2013

I would be concerned with 6 fat as well.. I've always been told not to go over 5 without concern.

what other kind of protein supplements do you have out there? Fish meal?

how about alfalfa pellets for roughage, and protein?

GONEWEST · Jan 31, 2013

Sent you a PM

KSanburg · Jan 31, 2013

Soybean meal is 40%, well actually I think they have some slight variations between 30 and 44% but just in soy your ration would be over 14% if I am reading it right. I know you feel like you live in BFE, is your local feed meal a dealer for any name brand feed , ie; Purina? Or calf mana? If they are can't they bring in a few hundred pounds of shreds on a regular shipment?

CAB · Jan 31, 2013

Again I'll reiterate, please find a reputable experience beef nutritionist that you can work with. As always when these feed rations are discussed here we get so many different ideas and suggestions that I really wonder if anyone actually ever gets any help and usually will be more confused as we go along. To me it seems like we get about as much misinformation as good common sense information. Good luck with your ration, I'm out as far as feed rations are concerned on Steer Planet.

GONEWEST · Jan 31, 2013

CAB said:
Again I'll reiterate, please find a reputable experience beef nutritionist that you can work with. As always when these feed rations are discussed here we get so many different ideas and suggestions that I really wonder if anyone actually ever gets any help and usually will be more confused as we go along. To me it seems like we get about as much misinformation as good common sense information. Good luck with your ration, I'm out as far as feed rations are concerned on Steer Planet.

It doesn't take a rocket surgeon though to figure out that last ration is at 17.2% protein (5.7 by-pass), a little over 2% fat and about 7.5% fiber.

It won't work.

creativecattle · Feb 1, 2013

I'll volunteer up our VitaFerm and Sure Champ nutritionists if you are interested. We work on rations for no charge all the time for our customers and potential customers. All you have to do is email [email protected], let them know what you are thinking and what age/type of livestock you are formulating for.

CAB · Feb 1, 2013

crystalcattle said:
I'll volunteer up our VitaFerm and Sure Champ nutritionists if you are interested. We work on rations for no charge all the time for our customers and potential customers. All you have to do is email [email protected], let them know what you are thinking and what age/type of livestock you are formulating for.

Now here's a great offer of help. Thanks Crystal for offerring your nutritionist to help out. Also GONEWEST canl be a great source of help to PPL, I'm sure.

Davidsonranch · Feb 1, 2013

Sooo, thanks to some wonderful people on here we are moving forward on the mix. GONEWEST is working up some numbers as we speak. And yes, the last couple recipes were WAY off even though "others" recommended me; one who claimed he was a nutritionist???. That is what has been confusing - getting too much input from different people. But I think we are on the right track. When we come up with a ration using the very limited resources I have, I will post. Our biggest concern right now may be even if we come up with a mix, it may not be as cost effective as I initially though vs. buying a already made product.

AAOK · Feb 1, 2013

Davidsonranch said:
Sooo, thanks to some wonderful people on here we are moving forward on the mix. GONEWEST is working up some numbers as we speak. And yes, the last couple recipes were WAY off even though "others" recommended me; one who claimed he was a nutritionist???. That is what has been confusing - getting too much input from different people. But I think we are on the right track. When we come up with a ration using the very limited resources I have, I will post. Our biggest concern right now may be even if we come up with a mix, it may not be as cost effective as I initially though vs. buying a already made product.

Good decision!

Davidsonranch · Feb 4, 2013

OK for anyone who was watching this post and interested in creating a food ration with a very limited amount of ingredients I wanted to post a final recipe that we think will work. Please rmember we had very limited ingredients and we ARE NOT in corn country. I want to thank many people including two individuals on this site who have their doctorates degree in ruminant nutrition who came up with the recipe to follow. But one thing I wanted to throw out there. We all think of protien, fat and fiber. But feeding a calf in North Dakota this time of the year can be different from feeding a steer in Florida. I am in very cold climate at a very high elevation and I truly believe my calves use a lot of energy to "survive" or stay warm. So this recipe we came up with may not have as much fiber as some out there, but the nutritionists who helped me think it will work great. So here it is:
1000 lbs steam rolled barley
610 lbs oats
200 lbs beet pulp
90 lbs soy bean meal
100 lbs molasses

Come out to be "roughly" 14% protein and 3.4 % fat

AAOK · Feb 4, 2013

Yea! Glad you got a ration suitable for your unique situation.

Will this feed recipe work?

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