A&T CAPTAIN OBVIOUS calves

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sue

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Aug baby post wean. pic taken christmas holiday time...
 

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sue

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Mid April baby pic taken September prewean.
 

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jaimiediamond

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I haven't used either bull in my program but I have seen impressive as in REALLY impressive bull by Jake's Proud Jazz JSF Addicted 82U in the flesh and he really was deep, thick, and sound made.


I have not seen Captain Obvious or his offspring in the flesh so Sue would have more information and even videos of his offspring on the Lakesides' youtube channel as well as some photos on Lakeside's website http://www.lakesideshorthorns.com/females.html.  Sue probably has the most information regarding his calves.  Aandtcattle has more information regarding his dam :). Also pictured is Doc Clark a CO son who was seen at the 2012 NWSS and was the heaviest Shorthorn bull on the hill.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veBVqQlpH58
 

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Davis Shorthorns

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I have had some JPJ calves and some out of our captain son Doc Clark.  I love the doc calves.  Wasn't to impressed with the JPJ calves I had both went to the sale barn.  I have seen alot of JPJ calves that looked great though.  I have loved all the captains that I have seen at Lakeside and around the country.  Probably doesn't help any but you get what you pay for. 
 

trevorgreycattleco

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JPJ has some issues with small feet and not as sound as CO calves. Co has more growth and better carcass. JPJ is the more popular at the moment and his calves may have a little bit more "show" appeal as BS said. Shortdawg on here has put up some really good pics of JPJ calves on here. I have seen CO twice in the flesh. Never seen JPJ. Co is a really good bull IMO and would be the better choice for real world traits and production. both have there place and neither is what I consider a turd. good question.
 

sue

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She is a feb. pic taken in september prewean. 
 

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sue

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6mos CO x angus standing next to a commerical yrling black angus.
 

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sue

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openas_shorthorn said:
what are A&T CAPTAIN OBVIOUS calves looking like are they better the jakes proud calves
I think the breeder of JPJ is a flat out legend, global beef icon. Ohlde!!!
JPJ is nearly twice the age of Captain and from what I understand still breeding at 11?  To my knowledge K-kim and Bigelows were some of the first purebred breeders to incooperate jpj... older females in production at these two operations? jungels should have a large group with a second calf coming at side??  JPJ is currently the number one shorthorn in the breed for registrations . JPJ is roan and likely to give the full fluffy hair coat 95% of the time.  I personally prefer Proud Leader daughters in production over JPJ females-  sorry dont think Proud leader semen ( sire of jpj) is on the market.

from what I have seen they both have a traditional shorthorn disposition...this is good for all ages.

It really just depends on what you're doing . Feel free to call me. Videos of older captain sons and daughters on our youtube page.  Captain is still breeding the daughters have beautiful udders and milk really well. Charlie Marsch Show Cattle has a sweet sweet pair of yrlings and a awesome fall born. From what I hear the two bulls work well together.

 

McM93

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From what I hear the two bulls work well together.

That answered my question.  (clapping)
 

rarebirdz

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Not sure what kind of program you have but in Denver I saw jpj sired bulls and a co sired bull. The co was bigger then I expected with loads of width great from right behind i was impressed but he lacked soundness in movement and was massive threw the shoulder. the jpj bulls were really pretty hairy and overall uniform but I noticed when I moved the bedding they were low threw the heel and small footed. The pen of bulls that was most practical imho was the wakaru set if your thinking maternal commercial like i am.  If I had to pick between jpj and co I'd go with jpj based on what I saw in denver but I like those heifers by co posted earlier close choice which is hard when comparing 1 son and many sons the major factor would be purebred clubby or commercial and then what type of cows you have both would work great on xotic type females co judging by his 1 son has more growth so possible great kill steers probably would finish quikly  <beer>
 

kfacres

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rarebirdz said:
loads of width great from right behind
the jpj bulls were really pretty hairy and overall uniform but I noticed when I moved the bedding they were low threw the heel and small footed. 

If I had to pick between jpj and co I'd go with jpj based on what I saw in denver   <beer>

do you often make a habit of picking small footed, hairy bulls for commercial use?
 

sue

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Marsch show cattle ... sorry I dont remember the mgs
 

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sue

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SBR Obviously  CO x JPJ  this calf sells feb 18th, Java SD.
I stopped last fall to see Rick's calves, this calf is probably the youngest in the PT sale. Very smooth thick , I did not see his dam but did see the granddam.... sbr dee?  Rick has alot of jpj offspring and had intentions of keeping this calf. Rick did also have a CO heifer calf, didnt see her. Pretty cool that he ende d up  solid red! Very old established shorthorn breeder. Some of Rick's fathers articles from early shorthrn worlds should be "republished" true cattlemen.  Bottom side of Captain's pedigree is Dover breeding ( DRC)  SBR would have a solid base of Dover influence in the cow herd.
 

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rarebirdz

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Cut the BS said:
do you often make a habit of picking small footed, hairy bulls for commercial use?

I did mention the only shorties I thought were practical were the wakarus

If I had to choose between the two bulls based on the offspring seen at Denver I'd go with the smaller footed beast as they were sound moving smooth shouldered. Big shoulders alarm me and the unsoundness in movement was the deal breaker my husband reminded me there was a red son in a pen of 3 also by co who looked good until you elevated his front at the show he was already showing stiffness in his movement
 

kfacres

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rarebirdz said:
Cut the BS said:
do you often make a habit of picking small footed, hairy bulls for commercial use?

I did mention the only shorties I thought were practical were the wakarus

If I had to choose between the two bulls based on the offspring seen at Denver I'd go with the smaller footed beast as they were sound moving smooth shouldered. Big shoulders alarm me and the unsoundness in movement was the deal breaker my husband reminded me there was a red son in a pen of 3 also by co who looked good until you elevated his front at the show he was already showing stiffness in his movement

I don't think I've ever seen a JPJ son that I didn't consider tight upfront, or straight...  Matter of fact, i have one of his sons in my tank... and IMO he's about as straight shouldered- and tight moving as any of them...

Does one structural flaw- counter balance another? 

is there a bull in the shorthorn breed who hasn't produced a structurally compromised calf- but is yet merchandising to the commercial cattle person.
 
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