Blue Roan Shorthorns?????

We were at a jackpot show this weekend and they allowed a blue roan heifer show as a single entry then enter the British drive. I had said something to the people running the show that the calf should be AOB instead of British since there were several AOB calves there. The family called me out for protesting the calf and said that her dam was only 50% Maine so it shouldn't matter. They were upset, and said I was upsetting their daughter. They told me its about the kids showing and I was messing up their daughters day. I agree....it is about the kids....there were 5 other kids in the drive that were beaten by this calf whose day wasn't going well either. Am I wrong in my opinion????? The calf won champion British BTW.

Depends on what the show's criteria for British heifers was... If they had to be purebred British then no, you're not wrong. Shorthorn Plus is not a breed but a percentage of a breed, therefore the calf should have been shown in a specific class for Shorthorn Plus or as a crossbred. I don't even think AOB would be appropriate but the rules should state the criteria for AOB also.

These situations really sucks for everybody. The people that got beat by the calf and even the winners maybe having a tainted division win. These types of moments really are awkward for everybody involved.  Now they are mad at you for stating the obvious, cant have shorthorn papers out of a half Maine cow. Im hoping whoever was running the show really knows they messed it up pretty good that way it doesn't happen again next year. Stuff like this is bound to happen running around to these jackpot shows, just try to stay out of the drama.

There were all purebreds there.....it was the only "mixed" calf in the English breed. The other mixed calves were in AOB. I wont take anything from the calf...she was a great one....they just allowed her the path of least resistance at the expense of the other kids showing purebreds.

We faced this at a couple jackpots last yr.  A family showing a Plus steer.  When they would go to Jackpots that just classed American, British, Exotic, they always put him in the British.  At the first such show the guy at the scale actually did the right thing and wrote down Exotic, the childs father flipped a lid and told them he was a Shorthorn Plus, with Shorthorn papers thus he should show British.  They changed him to British and he won the Division. The guy at the scales looked at me and told me he didnt know what to do with a steer like that.  I told him he should go to the AOB, we are in Texas and most shows follow the same guidelines as the majors. That steer would be an AOB at all majors, which would make him AOB at the Jackpots and the AOBs show with the exotics.  In my opinion there are 5 Breeds that should get in the British, Hereford, Polled Hereford, Red Angus, Angus, and Shorthorn.  If the animal doesnt meet the criteria to class one of those breeds it shouldnt be in the British.  A blue roan plus does not meet the criteria to class as any of those 5 breeds so it should have been an AOB.

That is what I was thinking myself. This was in Texas....I left out names and locations to keep the drama down. I just wanted other opinions about this situation because I was made to look like the bad guy. But like you said, their argument was they had shorthorn papers thus they should show British. I said it was a cross.....then I was told by this person that they had been an Ag teacher for 16 years and a county agent for 4. That was when I knew that he knew better and was skirting the rules. I apologized for upsetting the child...congratulated them on the win....and loaded my toys.  We had a Chi heifer still to show and my son said never mind....we are already the bad guys! So we left.

animalscience.tamu.edu/images/pdf/beef/beef-steer-classification.pdf

I know we were talking about heifers but.............
If this is the classifications for a terminal animal....it should very well be the same for breeding animals!

this is what i got the cow was 50% maine so the calf is 25% therfore the calf could be registered maintainer and they should have showed it that way and i dont think your opinion is wrong at all

Total BS, they knew better. Sorry for beating around the bush.... (lol)

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

-XBAR- said:

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

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dam was 50% maine--

anyway you look at it, she can't paper more than 1/2 blood- due to black color... 

-XBAR- said:

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

Click to expand...

The problem with this is all the cattle with Shorthorn Plus papers need to be classed together.  Since the majority of the Shorthorn pluses in the showring are Maine or Chi influenced they need to be in the Exotics.  The other issue with it is Shorthorn Pluses dont have a breed class, they dont show with fullblood shorthorns and dont have a breed class of their own.  Since they dont have a breed class of their own they show in the AOBs.  The AOB class always goes in the Exotic Division. 
If the Shorthorn association was to start a seperate registry for Shorthorn Angus crossed I would have no problem with someone tryin to get them their own class in the British Division.  However the Shorthorn Association doesnt do this, they are either Fullblood or not, the Pluses dont have their own breed class, and even if they did it would be in the Exotics.  No matter how you turn it, this heifer belonged in the exotics.

twistedhshowstock said:

-XBAR- said:

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

Click to expand...

The problem with this is all the cattle with Shorthorn Plus papers need to be classed together.  Since the majority of the Shorthorn pluses in the showring are Maine or Chi influenced they need to be in the Exotics.  The other issue with it is Shorthorn Pluses dont have a breed class, they dont show with fullblood shorthorns and dont have a breed class of their own.  Since they dont have a breed class of their own they show in the AOBs.  The AOB class always goes in the Exotic Division. 
If the Shorthorn association was to start a seperate registry for Shorthorn Angus crossed I would have no problem with someone tryin to get them their own class in the British Division.  However the Shorthorn Association doesnt do this, they are either Fullblood or not, the Pluses dont have their own breed class, and even if they did it would be in the Exotics.  No matter how you turn it, this heifer belonged in the exotics.

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already there-- called DURHAM RED>  Shorthorn x Red Angus...

This calf had plus papers not Durham papers.

crybaby said:

twistedhshowstock said:

-XBAR- said:

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

Click to expand...

The problem with this is all the cattle with Shorthorn Plus papers need to be classed together.  Since the majority of the Shorthorn pluses in the showring are Maine or Chi influenced they need to be in the Exotics.  The other issue with it is Shorthorn Pluses dont have a breed class, they dont show with fullblood shorthorns and dont have a breed class of their own.  Since they dont have a breed class of their own they show in the AOBs.  The AOB class always goes in the Exotic Division. 
If the Shorthorn association was to start a seperate registry for Shorthorn Angus crossed I would have no problem with someone tryin to get them their own class in the British Division.  However the Shorthorn Association doesnt do this, they are either Fullblood or not, the Pluses dont have their own breed class, and even if they did it would be in the Exotics.  No matter how you turn it, this heifer belonged in the exotics.

Click to expand...

already there-- called DURHAM RED>  Shorthorn x Red Angus...

Click to expand...

Well if they showed up with a blue roan with Durham papers and were allowed to show as such then that would raise a whole new set of issues...regardless, just as with the Pluses, the Durhams dont currently have their own breed class in Texas.  Actually I am not aware of anywhere that they do but I could be mistaken.  Thus would still show as an AOB and be in the exotics.

-XBAR- said:

Why would an Angus x shorthorn cross  blue roan not show in the British class?

Click to expand...

I presume that all 'British' animals need full papers for this show circuit.  Up here, 4-H classes and small shows would divide British X and Exotic X as there usually aren't enough purebred animals being shown.  Although this doesn't seem to be a bad system, British pure, Exotic pure & a commercial cross classes.

Heifers have to have papers to show in Texas. There are no commercial heifer classes here. The only exception would be some jackpots havin a class for American Breed Crosses.  I have yet to understand why they make a class for ABC heifers and not for other commercial heifers, but that is the way it is.

If it were up to me, I'd have put that one in the AOB class too. But, I can see the other side, as well...

Thing is, if the heifer would've been a red roan (or any other traditional Shorthorn color/combo), chances are no one would ever have thought much about it.  Many, if not most of the "pb Shorthorn" heifers showing have appendix blood in some degree.  I'm just not sure that other than the non-traditional color, she'd honestly be that much different than the rest.

Of course, here in OK, we don't split by British/Exotic/American (nowhere that I've been anyway), just by individual breeds.  Many shows (smaller jackpots and counties) split classes by the breed that issued the papers - regardless of percentage, color, whatever...  Is it any less fair than showing a 3/8 Simmental against a purebred?  I'll promise you those Simmental exhibitors don't think so.  But most smaller shows just can't afford to split 20 heifers into 15 breeds (for instance).

If this show was sanctioned by the Texas Junior Livestock Association and the Family plans to keep on showing her then they need to apply for and show her AOB. The Family will recieve AOB ear tags that must be present and all sanctioned shows.  If they have her papered another way to show at breed shows thats fine.  Also, if it was sanctioned then the host of the show should study up on rules for TJLA shows.  If it wasn't then I still feel like the heifer should be shown AOB in order to conform with the rules used by the TJLA and/or the Texas Majors.

If the papers were not red bordered then it is not a Shorthorn. If it is a Shorthorn Plus then it should show AOB along with Black Herefords (black baldies).

British division is for Angus, Red Angus, Hereford, Polled Hereford, and Shorthorn only.