Bulls in May issue of Shorthorn Country

Shorthorn Gurus,

There were a few bulls in the May issue of  Shorthorn Country that I haven't seen before.  They have semen for sale in the Youth Auction.  Does anyone have any information on these bulls? (progeny, pics, data, what are they used for, etc)

GLENELL IMF B90 x4158702 - 5 straws donated by Waukaru...born in 06, he's owned by Sprys in Australia and doesn't have any progeny listed in the ASA

TEROOK SUPEREX 38G *3801788 - 5 straws donated by Koulee...born in 75, he's owned by the Mcleans in WA and sired by a Weebollabolla bull...there are 7 calves registered in ASA

JAKE'S PRINCE OF JAZZ 236P - 5 straws donated by JMDC Cattle Co....born in 04, he's owned by Jacob Ohlde, sired by Proud Jazz and goes back to Dividend, Stinger, Irish Pride, Coronet Leader 21st and an Angus cow on the dams side...he has 7 calves registered on ASA, one is Jakes Tabasco who's out of the dam of Proud Jazz.

Thanks!

GM

Glenell IMF B90- go to http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-bin/i4.dll?1=313021&2=2420&3=56&5=2B3C2B3C3A&6=5C255B5A2127582626&9=5B5B52

The attached pic is a son recently sold for Aus$22,000.

Have no information on the Weebollabolla bull- can't find any registered calves for him here.

thunderdownunder said:

Glenell IMF B90- go to http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-bin/i4.dll?1=313021&2=2420&3=56&5=2B3C2B3C3A&6=5C255B5A2127582626&9=5B5B52

The attached pic is a son recently sold for Aus$22,000.

Have no information on the Weebollabolla bull- can't find any registered calves for him here.

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Wow the pic on the link you provided for Glenell IMF B90 is AWESOME!!!  A real beef bull!!!

He is a good bull, but he's smaller framed

Whats the story on the Broker bull ? He's by HAA Smart Money.

thunderdownunder said:

Glenell IMF B90- go to http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-bin/i4.dll?1=313021&2=2420&3=56&5=2B3C2B3C3A&6=5C255B5A2127582626&9=5B5B52

The attached pic is a son recently sold for Aus$22,000.

Have no information on the Weebollabolla bull- can't find any registered calves for him here.

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A little self promotion here. The $22,000 top selling bull in Sprys recent sale is out of a dam bred by us. Gerald Spry purchased a package of 20 embryos from us a few years ago and this bulls dam was one of the resulting calves. If you look up Sprys Solution E006 on the Australian Shorthorn Association and click on his dam you can see a picture of her.
The Glenell Imp B90 bull has sired some very good calves at Waukaru. It appears he has now been registered in the ASA herd book as he was not registered for a couple years after Barry Jordan purchased the American rights in him, because there are no pedigree records on his dam's sire of the pedigree.

The Weebollabolla Superex 18th bull was one of 2 bulls imported into Canada from the Weebollabolla herd in Australia in the early 70s. If memory serves me right there was 3 other bulls imported from Australia about the same time by ABS, Lone Pine Grand Society, Meriwong Smuggler, and Meriwong Royal Grant.
The two Weebollabolla bulls were brought in by Gary Hook, Terook Shorthorns, in British Columbia and I never ever saw any calves from them. I did speak to a guy who had gone out to see these bulls and he was not super impressed with them.... but remember that this was the early 70s. These Aussie cattle were smaller framed than Canadian cattle at that time, so they were not very well accepted.
He also brought in a couple females from Weebollabolla and I did see both of them as older cows, when they sold through a sale. They were smaller framed and they sold for about $1000 each.

The dam side of Terook Superex 38G is a Western Canadian bred cow, sired by  Lacombe Dock 140Y. Dock was from the closed herd of the Lacombe Experimental Farm, owned by Agriculture Canada, where no new blood was introduced for over 30 years and herd replacements and herd sires were selected on strictly performance. Terook Superex 38G would be one of the farthest outcrosses you will ever find in the breed.

JIT, interesting that you should say the Weebollabolla cattle were small framed- I can't think of anyone here who would use the word 'small' to describe the Weebollabolla cattle that way!!

They are big, voluminous cows, with a definite 'type' to them. The reason for this would be because Weebollabolla has been a largely closed herd for such a long time- only the occasional outside bull is brought in, the sires used are predominantly their own.

To quote the Beef Australia book (published in 1990): "It is the Munro family's remarkable dedication to breeding big, commercially-acceptable, high meat-yielding cattle for nearly 120 years that is the hallmark of this historic stud. Successive generations of the Munro family have scorned fads and fashions in favour of breeding their own consistent line of cattle, classed to the pattern established by A. G. F. (Alec) Munro, who founded Weebollabolla in 1873."
"R.F. (Roley) Munro - father of present principal, Wallace - ridiculed the trend, which began in the 1930s, to breed smaller, compact animals to cater for a perceived preference by housewives for smaller cuts."

Such was the determination of the Munros to continue their own breeding program, they withdrew from the Stud Breeders Association of Australia soon after its formation during WWI, and the “self-imposed exile” continued until 1962 when Wally Munro approached the Poll Shorthorn Society to again register the Weebollabolla herd. During this period, the Munros used only pure-bred bulls and, when the scale and type of available outside bulls became unacceptable to them, the Munros used home-bred bulls to “continue the tradition of breeding practical animals that would produce the maximum financial profit for the commercial breeder.”

Weebollabolla is now run by Wallace Munro’s son, Sandy, and his daughter, Jen, and the type of cattle they breed is certainly distinguishable from other Shorthorn cattle.

One of the most influential bulls in the Shorthorn breed in recent times, Weebollabolla Theodore T85
His pedigree and EBVs: http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-bin/i4.dll?1=313021&2=2420&3=56&5=2B3C2B3C3A&6=5C255B5A5A2420212E&9=52525F50

Thunderdownunder... I meant to say something about the Weebollabolla cattle as they have been historically some of the biggest framed Shorthorns. The females I saw that were imported from Weebollabolla were smaller framed, but I suspect there were other reasons for them being smaller. If I remember correctly, they came to Canada as weaned heifer calves, and I think the management they received may have had more to do with their mature size than the genetics did. I, in no way meant to say that Weebollabolla cattle were all small framed cattle. I meant to say that the two females I saw sold when they were about 11-12 years old were quite small, and I expect there were reasons for this other than genetic ones.

I have heard many comments about the Weebollabolla herd, and they all have stated that this is one of the best sets of big framed, volumous cows that are easy fleshing and maintain themselves on grass. I have used Theodore in my herd, and I also like the looks of Weebollabolla Quasitmoto who was used at Marellan.

I saw some pictures of the Munro's coming two year old bulls on pasture prior to last year's sale, and I have to say that they were a very impressive set of bulls. True grass cattle and lots of thickness and softness to them. They would have looked good if they were any color and any breed.

What happened with Theodore? He was on a pretty big high for awhile then faded away here in the states. I always thought he was pretty cool.

bump

anyone have any info on this guy...JAKE'S PRINCE OF JAZZ 236P

justintime said:

Thunderdownunder... I meant to say something about the Weebollabolla cattle as they have been historically some of the biggest framed Shorthorns. The females I saw that were imported from Weebollabolla were smaller framed, but I suspect there were other reasons for them being smaller. If I remember correctly, they came to Canada as weaned heifer calves, and I think the management they received may have had more to do with their mature size than the genetics did. I, in no way meant to say that Weebollabolla cattle were all small framed cattle. I meant to say that the two females I saw sold when they were about 11-12 years old were quite small, and I expect there were reasons for this other than genetic ones.

I have heard many comments about the Weebollabolla herd, and they all have stated that this is one of the best sets of big framed, volumous cows that are easy fleshing and maintain themselves on grass. I have used Theodore in my herd, and I also like the looks of Weebollabolla Quasitmoto who was used at Marellan.

I saw some pictures of the Munro's coming two year old bulls on pasture prior to last year's sale, and I have to say that they were a very impressive set of bulls. True grass cattle and lots of thickness and softness to them. They would have looked good if they were any color and any breed.

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38 G was on the cover of the Shorthorn World in the 80's - I think the photo speaks for itself? Any cattle men of any time that cant see the power in this bull is probably not really a breeder. 38G is was used heavily in a commerical shorthorn herd - KOULEE in Washington. It's true Weebollabolla did breed and Hook had a large part of 38G. I hope Mr MCLEAN WILL POST ON THIS BOARD AND SHARE EVERYTHING HIS FATHER HAS SHARED WITH ME??? Thunder down under is right - weebollabolla is the real deal and actually dropped out of registration for a long period. Theodore was the 1st bull ASA accepted back into the books. So if you are looking for alot of progeny by the powerhouse - you should drive to Washington- but grab a horse cuz you have a long ride when you get to KOULEE pastures. I personally feel this is a hidden treasure

trevorgreycattleco said:

What happened with Theodore? He was on a pretty big high for awhile then faded away here in the states. I always thought he was pretty cool.

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Theodore's a 1998 model and been used so much out here, his popularity is still high but people need to do some outcrossing. He was used pretty heavily in a couple of herds, and there have been sires from these herds which themselves have made a huge impact, so they need to try something different.

I personally haven't used Theodore, and don't have any within any of my pedigrees.

I think you know how we feel about Trump in the states sometimes! I finally found a heifer with no Trump that can run with the Trump cattle in the show ring.  And she's out of a Venture daughter  ;D

Venture seemed to do a pretty good job for you guys over there, from what I've seen. I know his breeders are pretty proud.

I have my own feelings about Trump!

GM said:

bump

anyone have any info on this guy...JAKE'S PRINCE OF JAZZ 236P

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GM
I just saw a few Prince of Jazz daughters in Iowa. The Spring group of Ohlde's was recently purchased and a few yrlings and females in production were in the group. I cannot say that were any huge differences between those and JPJ females. I really liked the direct daughters of Leader 21st.  This dosent help you but I think Prince of Jazz is slightly taller too?

With all the talk of Aussie bulls on this thread. We used a son of Super Dazzler out of a dtr of Rose T90. We bought him from Raymond Carnes in TX & he bought him from Masonic Homes at the Polled congress. Really liked his dtrs. I've got a Super Dazzler dtr (virgin hfr) out of Augusta Pride 230 that I'm fixing to breed. I've got a full Irish dtr of Irish Mist that I sold a flush on & as soon as it is done I'm going to breed her back for a natural calf to Moombi Powerplay.

Are there any cows big enough for jit? Just kidding.

aj said:

Are there any cows big enough for jit? Just kidding.

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aj.. I do wish you would come and see my cow herd. My cows are, on average not huge, in fact, I would say that most of my cows are smaller than some other breeders have.My cows live on grass and hay. The only grain they see is when we have had a bad winter like we did in 2008-09 and I did flush them in the spring with some mash from a local ethanol plant.  I do have a few bigger cows and they are only here because their genetics are sought for and they help pay some bills. My biggest cow is also one of the easiest fleshing cows I own. She weighs over a ton on a very poor day, and she has never seen grain since she arrived here. She has generated over $60,000 for me, in just over 3 years, from offspring and embryos. I find it rather interesting that she is always picked out by our visitors whether they be purebred or commercial producers. I am not saying I would like to have a bunch of cows this size, but I do believe that there is a place for a few cows like her... especially if they are trouble free and pay their way. She is massive in every dimension and yet is never thin.

I sold a donor cow that was coming 14 years old and I just got the check today. I hated to sell her, but the ET vets said the lining of her uterus was damaged from extensive flushing, and that she would never hold a pregnancy again. This cow has been a major money generator for us, but she was old and her useful life was past. She weighed 1810 lbs after an overnight stand. She sold for .62 per pound for a gross of $1122.24. Sale costs were $27.12 for a net sale price of $1095.08. I did not think this was too bad for an old cow.

My cows only stay here on their own merit. I now have my first set of two year old females in production that have not had any grain fed to them in their lives. I think they may be some of the best females I have had in some time.

I spoke with an Angus breeder a few days ago who had visited Schaff's Angus Valley in ND. He said he had never seen so many ton plus cows in one place. At the ET center where I do my embryo work, there are many ton plus Angus cows there being flushed. I am not saying this is right, but I find it interesting that some of the hottest cattle in the industry are coming from some big momma cows. Like I said, I have a few big framed cows but I also have some smaller framed cows that weigh a lot as well. Major Leroy's dam is a very moderate framed cow but she has never weighed under 1730 since I have owned her. I have no issues with anyone who keeps any cow if she can pay her way. The majority of my cows work hard and don't get any frills.

So what is your issue with what kind of cows I have if they are working for me? They must work for some other people or I would probably not sell as many as I do to others... most of which have never inside a show ring.

If you look at the new sires Schaff's has brought in I think you can see a trend. Waimata E230 56 inch hip height, Rito 707 of Ideal 3407 7075 (moderate framed), FV 20K King 308M is another moderate bull. Waimata weighed in at 2750 mature. There is performance in smaller framed cattle. Net worth is a 5.9 frame mature weighing over2,500. Not that I think 5.9 frame is that small.  I think he is trying to moderate his cows a bit.

Well if the cow weighs less then 1750 thats ok. <beer>