Fitters??

Help Support Steer Planet:

nobody

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2010
Messages
182
Location
East Texas
There are a couple of posts on here asking questions about fitters so here's mine... is it unethical to have a fitter or someone that helps at a jr. show? I know what the rules say, but the barn at ft worth is filled with people that make their living fitting other peoples cattle. What is everyones opinion on this?
 

twistedhshowstock

Well-known member
Joined
May 2, 2011
Messages
758
Location
Nacogdoches, TX
I think it depends on the extent the "help" goes to.  If it is just a fitter coming in to help with show day preps, clipping, coaching, etc...then no I dont think it is at all a problem...but again I may be biased because I will be one of the ones there doing that.  But if it is a situation where the parents have paid the fitter, the fitter has raised the calf, the kid has only seen it at shows, the fitter hauls it to the show, and you never see the kid anywhere around the calf until the calf gets to the gate of the showring, then in the Jr shows yes I have a problem with that.
Now in the Open Shows...I say its all fair game...the open show is about a breeder marketing their product, so if they hire someone to market that product for them, then so be it.
 

AI Man

Active member
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
28
that's completely right if its a junior show then they at least need to be doing the daily work
 

angus214

Well-known member
Joined
May 9, 2011
Messages
144
Location
Florence, Mississippi
I have a 10 yr old son that shows angus cattle. He does all the daily care of his heifers. At the shows the farm we bought our heifers from will come help him clip and fit them. I see nothing wrong with this because there is no way my 10 yr old can clip and fit on his own and be competitive.
 

OLD WORLD SHORTIE

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
813
Location
TX
i dont see the fitters as the issue, I would have to say the stomach pumping is a bigger issue at the jr shows.
 

chambero

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
3,207
Location
Texas
A lot of people don't like the idea of fitters and think it gives an unfair advantage.  The reality is that if you eliminate them, you have almost zero chance - only the professional families will have a chance.  It takes a long, long time to get good enough at clipping and fitting to compete at the highest level, some people just don't have that skill (me included).  At least with rules the way they are you can hire help.

Fort Worth does a better job of enforcement on some of the other rules than you mention.  A serious contender for Champion Angus got kicked out before the show because of stomach pumping last year.  That was a family that was more than a little unhappy with their "expert" fitter.  Fort Worth is very quiet about rule enforcement, but they are serious about it.  For example, they also DQ'd a grand overall not that many years ago because apparently there was enough evidence that steer didn't "live at home" but at the fitters in Hereford.  That became public because a lawsuit was filed. 
 

Sambosu

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2011
Messages
242
Location
Oklahoma
If a child does all the work at home,  I have no issue with having someone help fit the calf at the shows.  Saying this, I think it would be best to only allow cattle to be shown slick.  Getting rid of the hair would give more people a chance and get rid of the need to hire fitters, buy coolers, etc.  

Saying this, I am totally against the individuals that pay a steer jockey high dollars for a calf and then let them raise it while the child does nothing but show up at a show and lead it around the ring and go home without the calf.  It goes totally against everything 4H and FFA stands for.  It teaches your kids nothing.  Believe me I know how difficult it is to say no when an expert offers their services but it is wrong.  I also don't see how one can even get gratification from winning when you had nothing to do with it.  

Lastly, I feel the same way with pumping cattle.  It is wrong.  I can't tell you how bad my son wants to win but I am not going to pump a calf.  If a calf doesn't have enough volume, feed them better or buy a better calf.  If we tell our children, grand children, friends one thing but then do another we are teaching them nothing.  The most important thing to showing is teaching your kids responsibility and hard work pays off.  


Sorry about the long comment....
 

OLD WORLD SHORTIE

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
813
Location
TX
images
 

The Show

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Messages
841
Location
Colorado
I don't think there is anything wrong with it. We hired fitters for several years until I got good, and now I do our cattle as well as other people's for both open and junior shows. I hate the not fair argument about hair. People with coolers have an advantage over people that don't, but coolers require more work and time than a blower and fans do. Genetics has a lot to do with growing hair, but hard work is a very close second.
 

nobody

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2010
Messages
182
Location
East Texas
The reason for my question is, we have someone in our county that is basically harassing us about this issue. He will do stuff like cornering our kid at shows when we are not around. Our cattle stay at our house 24/7,and we do all the day to day work, feed/rinse/blow dry/clip etc. But for the majors and maybe our county show we have someone that helps us clip or fit on show day. We do not pay this person, he uses his vacation time and pays his own way. He does it because he loves cattle and helping kids. I really don't see anything wrong with it either. We have competed with people that have live in fitters or send their cattle up north during the summer. More power to 'em, this just gives us more of an incentive to work harder at home. And I think if you aren't doing your homework at home just hiring a fitter on show day probably isn't going to do much. This is really a none issue at san antonio and houston, but the rules seem so blurred at ft worth.
 

bk2005

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 27, 2011
Messages
150
Location
kingston, ohio
nobody said:
The reason for my question is, we have someone in our county that is basically harassing us about this issue. He will do stuff like cornering our kid at shows when we are not around. Our cattle stay at our house 24/7,and we do all the day to day work, feed/rinse/blow dry/clip etc. But for the majors and maybe our county show we have someone that helps us clip or fit on show day. We do not pay this person, he uses his vacation time and pays his own way. He does it because he loves cattle and helping kids. I really don't see anything wrong with it either. We have competed with people that have live in fitters or send their cattle up north during the summer. More power to 'em, this just gives us more of an incentive to work harder at home. And I think if you aren't doing your homework at home just hiring a fitter on show day probably isn't going to do much. This is really a none issue at san antonio and houston, but the rules seem so blurred at ft worth.

im supprised that P.O.S. hasn't lost some teeth yet.
 

twistedhshowstock

Well-known member
Joined
May 2, 2011
Messages
758
Location
Nacogdoches, TX
Yeah an adult cornering your kid when you arent around is an issue that needs to be dealt with.  The rules really arent that blurred at Ft Worth, like Chambero said, they really do a good job enforcing the rules, they just dont come with sirens blarin to do it.  They are more likely to do it quietly so the whole world dont know about it.
One area I find people getting mad about and saying the rules are blurred is the pumping/drenching issue.  It is illegal at all the shows to pump cattle.  Pumping refers to actually running a tube down the esophagus and into the cows stomach and pumping em full of fluids. At most shows drenching is still legal, drenching doesnt force anything into the stomach, it just puts the fluid at the back of the mouth and strongly encourages them to swallow....lol. But drenching is still legal at most shows, though a lot of them are telling you to do it in a wash rach or somewhere out of the public eye.  But I often times see people see other people drenching and their off the races to tell show officials that somebody is cheating and pumping a calf.  At the TJLA Camp Show there was a forum presented on being proactive and out front in educating the people on why we do the things we do so that we dont have to hide to do them, drenching was one of the things discussed, we need educate the public that we drench to insure our animals stay hydrated and drenching is not in fact cruel. I think thats a good point, but how are we going to educate the public when the  people showing dont even know the difference.
 

blackcows

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
270
In my opinion it depends what the rules say....if there is no rule against hiring a fitter than I don't think it matters if you pay the fitter a dollar or a thousand dollars.  If the rule says family only and you hire a fitter than it's unethical.
 

Mouse

Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2010
Messages
8
I quess this all depends on your ethics. The following was taken from the Ft Worth premium book concerning junior steer show. I believe it is the same for the heifer show.

Parents, Agricultural Science Teachers, and County Agents will not be allowed in the judging
arena. An animal will be disqualified from the show if it is being trimmed, fitted, or dressed by anyone
other than exhibitors, County Extension Agents or Agricultural Science Teachers from the State of
Texas, or other feeders or leaders within the county or school district from which the animal is entered.


Last year at the steer show stalled near well know steer jock.  He brought in about 6 head that he and 4 hired hands cared for all week. The only time I saw the kids that were to show these steers was just before they walked them to the ring. After show never saw any of the kids come back to the stalls. He and his crew also work on several other animals that were brought over to them during the week.

This goes on through out the barns.  The steer show is BIG business with alot of money involved. Everyone there hopes to win some just more than others.
 

showrookie

Active member
Joined
Nov 1, 2010
Messages
34
99% of the people that speak out against fitters are those too damn cheap to pay one to help their kid..  Get over it, or get off of your wallet.
 

MCC

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
484
Location
LAMAR,CO
blackcows said:
In my opinion it depends what the rules say....if there is no rule against hiring a fitter than I don't think it matters if you pay the fitter a dollar or a thousand dollars.  If the rule says family only and you hire a fitter than it's unethical.

I agree.
 

nobody

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2010
Messages
182
Location
East Texas
Not trying to be a hard head but what does "feeders or leaders" mean exactly??  

@ bk2005 that P.O.S. is an AG teacher.....he carries a little notebook around and he writes down anything "he" thinks is unethical or questionable. But what is funny to me is he never bothers the people that don't beat any of his kids.

And as far as the whole pumping/drenching issue.....pumping definitely unethical and drenching scares me. All I can see is that poor heifer that the fitter drenched or pumped (don't know which) with sprite and it died at the show last year. But having one die from dehydration is scary too.
 
Top