aj
Well-known member
Could marbling ability be partly or mostly be a metabolism factor.Like people with slow metabolism stay chubby where other people not so much. This might account for the fleshing ability cross over?
marbling ability
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librarian
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I doubt it. One could reason that animal with a very slow metabolism would have less need for stored energy than one that constantly burned energy.
aj
Well-known member
You may be right. It is kinda interesting that some dairy breeds seem to marble well. How would one test a bovine individuals metabolism rate?
Speaking of marbling, the MARC data from one of the cycles Shorthorns were included in, showed the only breed that topped the Shorthorn in marbling was the Jersey. Angus were used as base cattle, I believe. I've got to find that data. It's in some Shorthorn Country magazines. I'll find it eventually.
Does anybody remember Merle Welch's marbling gene markers he used to promote on all those 80's era bulls? If I'm not mistaken, Payoff was included in one of the MARC research cycles.
Does anybody remember Merle Welch's marbling gene markers he used to promote on all those 80's era bulls? If I'm not mistaken, Payoff was included in one of the MARC research cycles.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
aj said:
Feed conversion ratio.
I think marbling and backfat are antagonistic traits. The high marbling cattle are almost always the tighter hided types that are leaner in appearance.
Duncraggan
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Look at the aesthetically pleasing Wagyu breed regarding marbling!-XBAR- said:
Duncraggan
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Very interesting, an yes, you need to post the data!oakview said:
Every research paper I've seen says, in a nutshell, the positive correlation between external fat and marbling is well documented. I have not seen many tight hided, lean appearing cattle, such as Limousin, that were well marbled. When we fed a lot of cattle, the buyer would tell us to feed them another 30 days if they appeared lean and tight hided. We always did very well selling grade and yield in those days. Perhaps my perception of tight hided, lean appearing cattle is different than everybody else's.
The MARC data I've been referring to was from the 80's, I believe. It may take me a while to find it. However, more recent MARC data can be found in an ASA promotional from when Ron Bolze was Exec. Sec'y. That cycle included Hereford X Angus, Char., Salers, Gelb., Pied., and Shorthorn. #1 in % calving unassisted was the Shorthorn sired group at 99.8%, HA was 95.3%, and Char. was the lowest at 90.8. #1 in ADG was the Shorthorn sired group at 3.98. HA was 3.72, Pied. was the lowest at 3.24. Shorthorn had a marbling score of small-51, HA small-34, 2 breeds were small-01, and the other two were slight. Number 1 in % choice was the Shorthorn sired group at 78.0%. HA were 75.5%, Char. were 53.5%, the rest were under 50% choice. Number 1 in yield grade was the Shorthorn at 2.1, HA were 2.7, the rest were 2.9 or higher. Obviously no place for a Shorthorn in a crossbreeding program.
RyanChandler
Well-known member
oakview said:
The two highest marbling breeds I know of are wagyu and jersey. Both extremely lean, tight hided breeds with some of the least backfat.
Of the British breeds, Herefords have the highest backfat and least marbling.
I would agree that muscle and marbling are antagonistic. Such as is the case with limousine and the other continentals.
Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR
Well-known member
http://vetorial.net/~shorthorn/cruzarsho.htm
The MARC table with marbling is on the mid page.....sorry, translated to portuguese, but numbers are on sc.
The MARC table with marbling is on the mid page.....sorry, translated to portuguese, but numbers are on sc.
librarian
Well-known member
This is not that recent, but it backs up what oakview is saying.
http://www.cabpartners.com/articles/news/222/CAB-Review-of-Marbling.pdf
I've been thinking that Shorthorn should look to dual purpose influenced or even Milking Shorthorn lines to identify high marbling strains. The data on Norwegian Red and Swedish Red andd White Friesian is in line with that idea.
http://www.cabpartners.com/articles/news/222/CAB-Review-of-Marbling.pdf
I've been thinking that Shorthorn should look to dual purpose influenced or even Milking Shorthorn lines to identify high marbling strains. The data on Norwegian Red and Swedish Red andd White Friesian is in line with that idea.
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Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR
Well-known member
Since my university time, I remember that marbling is the last use of all food components used for produce.
Marbling is deposited after all other requerements to be OK..basal methabolism, muscle, fat cover......on web you can get some more details about it.
But I think that is basically associated with frame and food availablity....
...To understand the relationship between subcutaneous fat and marbling, it is important to first understand growth of cattle. Calories are first used to meet bone growth, then muscle growth, followed by fat development. For all classes of cattle, bone growth occurs rapidly, then as the skeleton become mature, quickly levels off, with little increase in bone as a percentage of the carcass. Muscle growth starts out slowly, and then increases quickly as the animal reaches mature weight, when muscle growth slows considerably. Fat growth also starts slowly, but grows quickly as the animal approaches maturity, and then levels out as the animal reaches a finished weight.
http://www.cabpartners.com/articles/news/2615/EndPoint_Maddock%20whitepaper.pdf
Marbling is deposited after all other requerements to be OK..basal methabolism, muscle, fat cover......on web you can get some more details about it.
But I think that is basically associated with frame and food availablity....
...To understand the relationship between subcutaneous fat and marbling, it is important to first understand growth of cattle. Calories are first used to meet bone growth, then muscle growth, followed by fat development. For all classes of cattle, bone growth occurs rapidly, then as the skeleton become mature, quickly levels off, with little increase in bone as a percentage of the carcass. Muscle growth starts out slowly, and then increases quickly as the animal reaches mature weight, when muscle growth slows considerably. Fat growth also starts slowly, but grows quickly as the animal approaches maturity, and then levels out as the animal reaches a finished weight.
http://www.cabpartners.com/articles/news/2615/EndPoint_Maddock%20whitepaper.pdf
showqueen95
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This is a little off topic because it doesn't apply to cattle, but still applies to marbling ability. But why are durocs and Berkshire are the only swine breeds to marble?
knabe
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I think if one added marble bone, marbling might go up.
aj
Well-known member
Would early maturing cattle marble be the marbling leaders? I guess I wonder.......if markers found in association with marbling ability........are identified as to what they actually do? With the new 50 k or whatever its up to now.
librarian
Well-known member
Early maturing cattle marble sooner because they finish growing sooner. If they appear to be marbling leaders its probably due to same age comparisons across cattle with different growth rates.
aj
Well-known member
So is there a magical marbling gene? Could the marbling gene be stolen and spliced from the Wygu cattle? Is marbling a combination of other traits and not a magical gene. Will breeds copyright or trademark marbling genes. Could the shorties steal the Wygu gene through a appendix grade up program?
knabe
Well-known member
aj said:
Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR
Well-known member
Yes, Wagyu is a composite.
Wagyu or Kobe means Japanese cattle.
They are an amalgation of lots of breeds, among them, Simental, Limouisn, Gelbvieh, Shorthorn, Aberdeens....
Each line - Tajima, Sanjiro and others.....show their particular breeds composition and particular selection traits, as well their particular body shape.
Wagyu or Kobe means Japanese cattle.
They are an amalgation of lots of breeds, among them, Simental, Limouisn, Gelbvieh, Shorthorn, Aberdeens....
Each line - Tajima, Sanjiro and others.....show their particular breeds composition and particular selection traits, as well their particular body shape.
