NEW TOPIC-Maybe?

Show Heifer · Jun 23, 2010

frostback said:
The only problem was, I saw 1 junior for every 9 parents doing the JUNIORS work.

Lots of polygamists in that county eh?
[/quote]

You know what frostback, if you have a problem with me, lets just pm each other and spare everyone the drama. You seem to have a fettish about responding to only my post. Let it go, frosty. You can get over it.

On topic: A few of you brought up full sibs due to embryo transfer, and that is a good point. I also LOVE the idea of giving each project junior a cloned calf and then see how much management makes a difference! That would truly be an eye opener!
Our cattleman used to do a similair thing, by having a scramble and then giving each "winner" a calf that was as closely related as possible. The calves were then shown the next year, and it was incredible the difference!

farmboy · Jun 23, 2010

..and the multiple wives ;D

frostback · Jun 23, 2010

WOW, no fetish just thought it was worded funny. Guess I should have put a JK after it. By the way fetish only has one T since you are a stickler for correct spelling.

simtal · Jun 23, 2010

aj said:
In theory the next generation should always be better. But I sometimes question this line of thought. Seems like us breeders tend to chase fads and single trait selection thus the next generation might not be better. The end product "good cattle" may change 10 years from now. I think fuel costs and protein costs will sky rocket. 6 dollar corn could dictate what a good calf might be whereas 3 dollar corn may or may not call for a different type of calf. Will there be a significant select/choice price spread difference in fat cat cattle to encourage good marbling cattle or will the supermarket type beef not really need the carcass qualitymarbling is not the only measure of palatibility, consumers would likely prefer tenderness, some are trying to do this . The economy will be a huge factor in what type of beef will be best. If you are a gloom and doomer and expect economic stagnation I think beef could be in trouble. If ypu are a strict epd guy and you are selecting for say a balanced 6 traits a extra year would give you more time to use selection pressure and cull cattle accordingly. I'm not sure there are lines of "good cattle". Only lines of cattle that work under certain economic or enviromental conditionsgood cattle always pay.

OH Breeder · Jun 23, 2010

olsun said:
The board seems a little slow right now, blame it on summe I guess. I have heard a few rumors that clones may be banned from some shows. I don't know if this is a fact, or is even being discussed for that matter, but I would be interested in all of your thoughts on this. My belief is that showing the clone of a great steer takes much of the challenge out of raising one. Just my thought, so what do you all think? Good or bad?

Guess for clarification purposes- clones of steers, heifers./cows or bulls.

I think it is interesting that some of the clone females seem to be producing calves of the same quality as their donor dams. The bulls don't seem to follow the same path. If you have that much disposable income to show a clone as a steer then more power to you. No different than buying a "$50K" steer at a pasture sale. Same amount of work must go into the work and preparation of that animal.

ps...those kids weren't from Salt Lake were they...

herefordfootball · Jun 24, 2010

Show Heifer said:
On topic: A few of you brought up full sibs due to embryo transfer, and that is a good point. I also LOVE the idea of giving each project junior a cloned calf and then see how much management makes a difference! That would truly be an eye opener!
Our cattleman used to do a similar thing, by having a scramble and then giving each "winner" a calf that was as closely related as possible. The calves were then shown the next year, and it was incredible the difference!

Well put. St. Joe county has a calf drawing in January. The 4-h'ers sign up for the beef project and are allowed to show up to 2 heifers and 2 steers I believe, don't quote me on the numbers. But what they do is get the beef committee to tag the steers calves i.e. 1-100 and the heifers 1-100, put them in a lot at the county fair and everybody(4-h members) brings their trailer up to the grounds, you basically pick a number out of a hat and that's your calf for the same price as everyone else pays. All calves are priced the same and the committee does their best to make sure the calves are as close as possible in quality. Now I'm not from St. Joe county and dint know the exact process, but this is pretty much how it goes as people have told me.

ustacould · Jun 25, 2010

LostFarmer said:
Friend of mine raises some darn nice club calves. He has sent them to shows all over and the calves have done a fair amount of winning. His kids get calves out of the second and 3rd draft of calves. Like he says can't afford to keep a steer that will bring 2-6 times feeder market. His kids consistently place well. Not always winning but usually in the final drive. Being our first year with fat calves he told my boys. Take a pair of rice root brushes and if they are worn out by fair then you will be a winner. Didn't understand what he meant but now I do. If the kid is getting up and walking, rinsing, and brushing the cattle then they will be winners no matter what. They just might win it all but either way they are winners.

As to the clones issue. If someone wants to spend the time and money to clone a steer to try and win more power to them. If they want to breed embryos in mass to find a winner, it is great economy stimulus. If they want to build an cool box and all that goes with it who am I to complain? If all you want is a buckle then log onto Montana Silversmith and buy a buckle.

Buy or breed a good calf and then feed and groom him into a great one. The calf may or not win his class but a winner was made that wasn't the calf.

Lostfarmer AKA dad

Thank you, I have been working with show cattle sinse i was eight years old. I had few years in there where we where very competetive winning female shows at every level from county fair to the National Western. It got to the point where it was easier to when a National Show than it wasa local show and we would not go if we didn't see a pay check on the other end. As the pendulum swings i am now working with my little brother who is 11 years younger than i am. Most days the hardest part of the deal is that he does not have that killer instinct that it takes to succeed at the higher levels. Going into a weekend like this where we have three horse shows and a steer show I need to hear that it is not always about the banners and the paychecks, who cares if the cattle arn't going to travel quite the way i would like them to, who cares that the feet are not done up the way i would have them, who cares that the baby bull isn't dyed the way i would do it and the steer is not corn starch white. I can search the country bringing home the best females i can afford, learn the cows and mate them to high heaven, run one of the best health and feed programs that money can buy, and fit with the best of them. But i have to leave it in his hands to feed well, rinse twice a day, leave every hair lying in the right place and growing. The important thing is that he has spend the whole week preparing pretty much all by himself and we are to the point know where i know he can hanndle a weekend like this.

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