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Author Topic: Red angus-black angus  (Read 11844 times)

Offline aj

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Red angus-black angus
« on: November 29, 2014, 07:45:27 PM »
Is there a chance that the two associations would join together as one organization........100 years from now?
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline cowman 52

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2014, 09:46:31 PM »
When god comes home

Offline aj

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2014, 08:51:32 AM »
I remember when the horned herfords and the polled herfords had to different assc's. There were almost hatreds between the breeders. And then as generations of PEOPLE evolved they merged.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline Freddy

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2014, 11:06:16 AM »
I  remember the early day's of polled Herefords ,they were bad ,kind of like the black Charolais ..... But the POLLED HEREFORD'S had something to offer that the horn's didn't have ....  The red ANGUS would be crazy to bring the mixed up bloodlines and genetic defects of the BLACK'S into their pedigrees , maybe in a 100 years, if our country survives bringing one black into our USA  program ....

Offline -XBAR-

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2014, 11:54:16 AM »
^ Ignorance at its finest.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2014, 11:57:39 AM by -XBAR- »

Offline aj

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2014, 05:11:08 PM »
The Red Angus are allready bringing in the black genetics. It takes em at least 2 generations to get out of the black condition. The red angus already have a line of dd genetic defects through a black Gardiner bull. In theory.....what would happen if the black assc said........nothing wrong with red cattle, lets register the reds. I think the ONLY reason the Angus assc. frowned hard on the reds cause it was popping up out of no where. Now they have a simple test to test for recessive conditions. There is no SCARY red gene out there anymore.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline aj

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2014, 05:38:07 PM »
I guess one hang is......the Red Angus has an appendix grade up program......and the Black angus doesn't. What would happen if the Red Angus said........hey we accept black angus......at a cheaper rate....
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline SD

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2014, 06:11:42 PM »
It will take place the day the AAA can't pay their bills.....
SD
 <alien>
Tact and Political Correctness were developed by those who lack the Testicular Fortitude to say what they really mean.

Offline cowman 52

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2014, 07:05:50 PM »
I guess one hang is......the Red Angus has an appendix grade up program......and the Black angus doesn't. What would happen if the Red Angus said........hey we accept black angus......at a cheaper rate....



How do you figure?  The whole herd reporting deal is nothing but a way to generate income to Denton Texas and nothing more.  The reports, records and such are nothing more than a way to have employees having a job shuffling paper, and not one bit about the cattle getting better or helping breeders sell their cattle. 
The angus assoc wants nothing but reg and transfer fees without a heck of a lot of grief unless you use one of those questionable bulls then you dna to look for a defect. 
 Some red breeders have said to heck with the papers, I don't get enough return on the investment,  so tell me again how the black assoc needs the trouble.

Offline Freddy

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2014, 07:48:40 PM »
I CAN  THINK OF THREE COMMERCIAL BREEDERS in our area that 10-15 years ago had Herford or Saler base cow herds and now are selling Angus bulls for more than registered breeders and no dues to pay, no registrations and no testing unless they want to ....  Also with the ANGUS  no whole herd registry, you forgot you get no EPD'S until you register them , what's so great about that , maybe not anything ... Those commercial Angus bull producers
don't worry about their EPD'S ....

Offline cowboy_nyk

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2014, 10:01:44 AM »
FYI in Canada we are in the same association.

Offline cbcr

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uote
« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2014, 10:39:35 AM »
Quote from Cowman52:
Quote
The whole herd reporting deal is nothing but a way to generate income to Denton Texas and nothing more.  The reports, records and such are nothing more than a way to have employees having a job shuffling paper, and not one bit about the cattle getting better or helping breeders sell their cattle.

Most of the breed associations have gone to some form of whole herd reporting, Hereford, Simmental, Gelbvieh, Shorthorn, Limousin, and others.

These whole herd reporting programs charge the breeders various rates but all of them charge a fee for each breeding age female and then gives the breeder a free registration and transfer.  This is something that really is all about the money.  Why not lower the rate and then offer the breeders to register any calves they want to for half price.

As an example if an association charges $15 per cow for enrollment in their whole herd reporting program.  On a 100 cow herd, that is $1,500.  Why can't they lower the cost to $10 per cow and then let producers register any calf for $5 each.  So on the 100 cow herd it would initially cost the producer $1,000, then if he were to register half of the calves (50 head) at the $5 rate he would pay $250.  This would put $250 in his pocket that he could use.


Quote from Freddy:
Quote
I CAN  THINK OF THREE COMMERCIAL BREEDERS in our area that 10-15 years ago had Herford or Saler base cow herds and now are selling Angus bulls for more than registered breeders and no dues to pay, no registrations and no testing unless they want to ....  Also with the ANGUS  no whole herd registry, you forgot you get no EPD'S until you register them , what's so great about that , maybe not anything ... Those commercial Angus bull producers don't worry about their EPD'S ....

EPDs are a TOOL!!!  EPDs are only as accurate as the information that is reported.  You didn't say how these producers were raising their bulls, but again, when many bull buyers go out to look at bulls they want to see those big yearling weights, but at what cost to the health of the bull?  When bulls are pushed for those big yearling wights it does impact their health, their feet and legs and many times they are too fat.  And too, there are still many producers that so not understand EPDs.  They may not say so when looking at a group of bulls, and some of this is because they do not want to look like they are stupid.  And as the old saying goes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and everybody wants a good looking bull.
 

Offline BTDT

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2014, 11:36:43 AM »
I highly doubt if the two associations ever merge.  The red angus already are working with the simmi's and a few other breeds.  The two associations seem to have different goals and projections of which are not mutually exclusive (meaning the two ideas probably would not get along well together). 
What's wrong with two associations? 

Offline DSCSD

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2014, 02:45:17 PM »
Raised in a well known Angus herd of the early 80s being around Angus cattle and people my entire life and working for a well known Angus herd that's 120 years old now.... anyone who knows Black Angus breeders should know they are way to proud of their black cattle to ever allow any color in.... unless the retards that have messed up the AAA and made it total chaos allow it! Then the AAA will just be another crossed up breed that has 2 different shows in 1.... not that its not already crossed!

Offline Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR

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Re: Red angus-black angus
« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2014, 04:03:42 PM »
Here in Brazil both coats are registered at same register. Also in Argentina and Uruguay.
Think that only Americans have this apart breed.....
Also here a 7/8 blood bull is sold as purebred......Brazilian Aberdeen Angus makes lots of money salling lots of steers with balls!
On the end of road...only money is important!

 

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