Roanoke Flashback

Anybody have mature cows out of him ? I think he is the sleeping beauty we seek. The studer bull out of him seems to work.

trevorgreycattleco said:

Anybody have mature cows out of him ? I think he is the sleeping beauty we seek. The studer bull out of him seems to work.

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He's gone now though, so will be limited from now on...

I do not know of any mature daughters, and pretty sure the oldest I saw at the homeplace- were breds...

+1 <beer>

When did he pass???
Does Joe and Cattle Visions have a pretty good supply?
I had a Flashback daughter that I bred to Jake's Proud Jazz and tried to sell at the Iowa Beef Expo one year without so much as a bite.  She came home with me and a commercially oriented farmer bought her from me directly.  I believe she went on to be a good mama cow for him,  Now I wish I had her back!!!
EF

Shorthorns4us said:

When did he pass???
Does Joe and Cattle Visions have a pretty good supply?
I had a Flashback daughter that I bred to Jake's Proud Jazz and tried to sell at the Iowa Beef Expo one year without so much as a bite.  She came home with me and a commercially oriented farmer bought her from me directly.  I believe she went on to be a good mama cow for him,  Now I wish I had her back!!!
EF

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He didn't..  he was sent to town.  I drug my feet too long with getting him bought due to the house moving, and new farm purchase.  I should have been in better contact with Joe- didn't think he was that serious about getting him gone that quick- atleast he wasn't last I talked with him in April...  I do suppose his entiecer, and the white dividend bull need cows to breed and room-- so out with the old, in with the new. 

They kept him around a long time considering he would be 9 this year. You would expect they had some new bulls to move on with especially since there is semen available.

I was considering using him this spring on a capiche heifer, y'all think that might be safe?

Joe's a good guy and the bull definitely has some usefulness if you want to incorporate some of the old Leader 21 genetics.  I always think the reaction is interesting regarding some of the old time genetics.  Flashback is now being touted as a great commercial option, and he just might be one.  However, his sire, Leader 21, was widely used in the late 60's and early 70's because he was one of the dominant show sires of his era.  If those Leader 21 cattle hadn't have come from Bob Gordon's and so influenced the American show ring, I doubt if there would have been much semen used back then and seriously doubt if there would be much, if any, available today.  Flashback's dam is very closely related to Rodeo Drive and most of the commercial Shorthorn breeders I know want to avoid him like the plague.  Further back on the dam's side is Dividend crossed with Milking Shorthorn genetics.  So, we end up with a bull that just could be a real world, commercial type Shorthorn with basically show ring oriented genetics.  Interesting. 

kidsandkows said:

I was considering using him this spring on a capiche heifer, y'all think that might be safe?

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Depends, Joe would not tell me to use, or not to use on heifers.  He did not believe the CE and BW EPDs, and said that flashback himself was bigger BW, and bred more BW on than his other bulls did, or had-- yet his EPDs were more heifer oriented. 

oakview said:

Joe's a good guy and the bull definitely has some usefulness if you want to incorporate some of the old Leader 21 genetics.  I always think the reaction is interesting regarding some of the old time genetics.  Flashback is now being touted as a great commercial option, and he just might be one.  However, his sire, Leader 21, was widely used in the late 60's and early 70's because he was one of the dominant show sires of his era.  If those Leader 21 cattle hadn't have come from Bob Gordon's and so influenced the American show ring, I doubt if there would have been much semen used back then and seriously doubt if there would be much, if any, available today.  Flashback's dam is very closely related to Rodeo Drive and most of the commercial Shorthorn breeders I know want to avoid him like the plague.  Further back on the dam's side is Dividend crossed with Milking Shorthorn genetics.  So, we end up with a bull that just could be a real world, commercial type Shorthorn with basically show ring oriented genetics.  Interesting. 

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I think you're right.  When I saw him, he was a moderate, big bodied, stout bull that had mass.  I don't know that he had a tremendous amount of true, massive muscle shape- and doubt he'll breed that on either...  But then again, I know that's not why I would use him either.  I'd use him to make moderate, easy fleshing heifers.  To make show calves- I don't know he'll do it, unless bred to somethign really flashy. 

I know one thing, and that was lamost every cow on that farm, was WAY bigger than anything I'd ever want to make- exvcept the couple FB daughters, and him.  Those Double Visions, are some of the very ibgest caows I've ever seen. 

For herd bulls now, he had another solid white, Dividend son- thing he was named white dividend or something like that.. and I know that he has a solid red Enticer son that I posted a picture of a baby heifer calf from a vortec dam on  another thread.  Neither bull, IMO is half the bull of Flashback..

trevorgreycattleco said:

Anybody have mature cows out of him ? I think he is the sleeping beauty we seek. The studer bull out of him seems to work.

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I really like the Studer bull.  I searched 704's daughters and a lot are in production hopefully someone can give you more solid information about udders, structure and fleshing.

jaimiediamond said:

trevorgreycattleco said:

Anybody have mature cows out of him ? I think he is the sleeping beauty we seek. The studer bull out of him seems to work.

Click to expand...

I really like the Studer bull.   I searched 704's daughters and a lot are in production hopefully someone can give you more solid information about udders, structure and fleshing.

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then you'd really like the pics I took of flashback this spring... but I'll not be posting them.

We bred a heifer to him she due feb 20. i have 10 straws of him in my tank. i am pretty sure cattle vision still has some or they did when i bought 10 straws a few months ago.

We have a grandson woodside permission out of students precision bull that we like.

oakview said:

Joe's a good guy and the bull definitely has some usefulness if you want to incorporate some of the old Leader 21 genetics.  I always think the reaction is interesting regarding some of the old time genetics.  Flashback is now being touted as a great commercial option, and he just might be one.  However, his sire, Leader 21, was widely used in the late 60's and early 70's because he was one of the dominant show sires of his era.  If those Leader 21 cattle hadn't have come from Bob Gordon's and so influenced the American show ring, I doubt if there would have been much semen used back then and seriously doubt if there would be much, if any, available today.  Flashback's dam is very closely related to Rodeo Drive and most of the commercial Shorthorn breeders I know want to avoid him like the plague.  Further back on the dam's side is Dividend crossed with Milking Shorthorn genetics.  So, we end up with a bull that just could be a real world, commercial type Shorthorn with basically show ring oriented genetics.  Interesting. 

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Oakview, the ASA website lists just under 1200 registered offspring by Leader 21.I remember reading about 1 rancher alone outside of Billings that used him on close to a 1000 cows for several years.Might have been one of the few times that commercial and showring intersected.

Probably a good sign that Leader 21 was accepted by both segments.  I would imagine that he was used widely commercially since ABS handled the semen.  We purchased semen from both Leader 21 and his son, Leader 9th, from ABS and it was relatively cheap.  Of course, after we used it, we found out somebody decided they wanted $250 to sign the registration application.  I suppose that ABS got their interest in Leader 21 due to the popularity he showed in purebred circles from the show ring success of his offspring.  Semen from several other popular bulls of the day was handled solely by their owners which probably limited their commercial use.  We may never know if Columbus or Dividend could have been popular commercially.