Spooky Calf

oakie · Nov 20, 2012

A local kid is working one that won't stop running around the pen and has recently started throwing dirt in the air by pawing the ground and butting the pitch fork. The calf is only about 550lbs. He has a halter on it, he tied it a few times and it helped, I can't get to them to see what is going on so this is what I have heard, any advice? I've said twice a day sessions and to put a nose bud in him if he acts aggressive on the halter along with a radio and to whack him with a show stick on the nose if he tries to butt. Calf calm has helped, any other ideas? The kid is a highschool football player so he's not small his advisor seemed to think the calf will be breakable.

GoWyo · Nov 20, 2012

Calf is scared and can't run away so he is going to fight. Have to go way back to gaining trust before ever trying to lead it or tie it up. See other threads about halter breaking.

oakie · Nov 20, 2012

I did and I couldn't find anything I haven't already suggested to them. What do the big outfits do when they have the heatwaves with attitudes, besides ace.

vc · Nov 20, 2012

Have him feed him 30 to 40 3mg Melatonin a day, and just spend as much time around the animal that he can for awhile, a pen mate might help as well (one that is really calm).

He needs to continue to tie and rinse daily just not push the animal to fast, we kept ours in a 12*24 pen for the first week or so until they calm down, some took longer. We have found feed and water to be my best friend when trying to get them calmed, he needs to feed at the same time each day and stay around so the calf finds out that he is the good guy, and when he sees it is a good thing.

We had a HW that was like that, He would just get worked up and go off, (we knew he had some trust issues when we bought him, swelled up chin, but that is why he came cheap) we worked with him daily for about a month, we made progress but it was slow. The breeder said to try Glu-coat, it had worked in the past on some calves, about 2 weeks into feeding him the glu-coat, he just stopped, Tuesday, he was climbing the wash rack, Wednesday he just stood there from start to finish and was fine from then on out. (We did feed him the glu-coat for the entire project, but it was worth it)

It seems like some of them can test you more than others but scared calves can seem the worst at first. We had a Angus calf get out the day we brough him home, ran through the gate down the road and found the creek, I followed him for 3 hours until it got dark. Spent the next week tracking him in the creek found him twice just to see him run through junk I could not crawl through, after a about a 10 days being on the loose he found some horses to hang with and got trapped in a pen by the horses owners, we had to have him roped and loaded in the trailer. He spent 3 days in the trailer, we waited until he stopped blowing snot and bouncing off the walls to move him into a corral, he was haltered and getting rinsed a week later. Food and time is all it took.

Tell the boy, it is up to him, he needs to be patient and persistant, and always keep his cool, At least it is a long project and times is on his side.

OH Breeder · Nov 20, 2012

Just a thought- if calf is real aggressive might check how he was castrated.

oakie · Nov 20, 2012

My dad banded him when he was a month old. We run over 250 so I know he got them. It's real good to hear about the angus, I know he's not that bad. In the field you could almost pet him. When I brought him in the barn he would just run the perimiter to the point of panting. I would just sit there and my presence alone would do that. I'd try to sit there for about an hour a day and he never quit running around. When I got in the pen with him he wasn't mean just really spooky. I was breaking him for a fair and only had a month to do so, I quit on it because he was running the weight off and if I did get him broke he would look horrible.

vc · Nov 20, 2012

It really sounds like a friend would do him wonders.

renegadelivestock · Nov 20, 2012

The thing about calves like that being a project is this

The kid showing it is not the only one to worry about, football player or not, the calf already out weighs him, and will only get bigger, the other kids in the ring need to be taken into account as well, he sounds a bit dangerous, get rid of him, and find something safer for the kid to show. Beyond being safer, it will be more fun for the kid.

You can't make chicken salad out of chicken shit, some are just not ment to be show cattle, no matter how nice they are phenotypicaly

oakie · Nov 20, 2012

I've had my hands on him and I don't see that he would be mean, just spooky. He's a grizzly with some dr who in him and I'm wondering if the dr who may have something to do with it. I think he's breakable but he's just going to be a project

justme · Nov 21, 2012

There is an article on the front page on "breaking a calf the Red Method" or something like that...Red was a calf whisperer I swear. Well worth the read

DL · Nov 22, 2012

oakie said:
My dad banded him when he was a month old. We run over 250 so I know he got them. It's real good to hear about the angus, I know he's not that bad. In the field you could almost pet him. When I brought him in the barn he would just run the perimiter to the point of panting. I would just sit there and my presence alone would do that. I'd try to sit there for about an hour a day and he never quit running around. When I got in the pen with him he wasn't mean just really spooky. I was breaking him for a fair and only had a month to do so, I quit on it because he was running the weight off and if I did get him broke he would look horrible.

OK really? you sit with a calf for an hour and he never stops running the pen? and he runs to the point of panting? You were breaking him but you quit because he was running the weight off? And then you sold him to a big kid - and now recently he is throwing dirt in the air by pawing the ground and butting the pitch fork but you say he's not mean, just spooky - I am with renegade here - this ain't chicken salad and the most dangerous bovine is a fearful one - even if the kid is big -

oakie · Nov 28, 2012

DL said:
oakie said:

My dad banded him when he was a month old. We run over 250 so I know he got them. It's real good to hear about the angus, I know he's not that bad. In the field you could almost pet him. When I brought him in the barn he would just run the perimiter to the point of panting. I would just sit there and my presence alone would do that. I'd try to sit there for about an hour a day and he never quit running around. When I got in the pen with him he wasn't mean just really spooky. I was breaking him for a fair and only had a month to do so, I quit on it because he was running the weight off and if I did get him broke he would look horrible.

Click to expand...

OK really? you sit with a calf for an hour and he never stops running the pen? and he runs to the point of panting? You were breaking him but you quit because he was running the weight off? And then you sold him to a big kid - and now recently he is throwing dirt in the air by pawing the ground and butting the pitch fork but you say he's not mean, just spooky - I am with renegade here - this ain't chicken salad and the most dangerous bovine is a fearful one - even if the kid is big -

Everything was disclosed multiple times when they came out and visited the calf. The calf ran the pen when they came and picked him up. He was not sold without the buyers knowledge, nothing was hidden. The kid wants some tips and that is all that I am asking for. He paid what our calves that went on the truck went for so it's not like he got screwed over on this. The butting thing is something new and so is the sawdust throwing. I'm guessing that more than a couple of kids have messed with the steer to the point of him learning how to get away with things. If you have any advice we would appreciate it, if not, I'm not asking for your input.

cowpoke · Nov 28, 2012

The best thing is to have another calm calf with him for companion ship plus it makes them eat better when they have to compete a little.It sounds like he hasnt had the best start to being a gentleman so its time to start over first by feeding out of a pan so he gets rewarded for being friendly.Tieing up one thats tough usually escalates things as it hurts them.I have over 50 years of experience and there are some that just dont want to live the show life.If you tie him up again do it in a chute and have something in back of him so he cant pull too far.If you get to the point of giving him a bath most like that.A donkey works but they work best if they have never been tied.Sometimes a vet prescribed [dont want DL upset] tranquilizer will help.I have bought some really good calves with an attitude and I try kindness first.Just when you have had enough some come around and around 50% go to the feedlot where they do fine usually and as they get bigger they usually just become part of the group and are hard to pick out.They are not much different than really good cow that has an attiude they are not worth getting hurt by .Good Luck

DL · Nov 28, 2012

oakie said:
DL said:

oakie said:

My dad banded him when he was a month old. We run over 250 so I know he got them. It's real good to hear about the angus, I know he's not that bad. In the field you could almost pet him. When I brought him in the barn he would just run the perimiter to the point of panting. I would just sit there and my presence alone would do that. I'd try to sit there for about an hour a day and he never quit running around. When I got in the pen with him he wasn't mean just really spooky. I was breaking him for a fair and only had a month to do so, I quit on it because he was running the weight off and if I did get him broke he would look horrible.

Click to expand...

OK really? you sit with a calf for an hour and he never stops running the pen? and he runs to the point of panting? You were breaking him but you quit because he was running the weight off? And then you sold him to a big kid - and now recently he is throwing dirt in the air by pawing the ground and butting the pitch fork but you say he's not mean, just spooky - I am with renegade here - this ain't chicken salad and the most dangerous bovine is a fearful one - even if the kid is big -

Click to expand...

Everything was disclosed multiple times when they came out and visited the calf. The calf ran the pen when they came and picked him up. He was not sold without the buyers knowledge, nothing was hidden. The kid wants some tips and that is all that I am asking for. He paid what our calves that went on the truck went for so it's not like he got screwed over on this. The butting thing is something new and so is the sawdust throwing. I'm guessing that more than a couple of kids have messed with the steer to the point of him learning how to get away with things. If you have any advice we would appreciate it, if not, I'm not asking for your input.

You got my advice, you just didn't like it, guess I should have been clearer - ship the calf and help him get another one. BTW I still don't understand why you would sell a calf to a kid who displayed the behavior you describe - "full disclosure" or not the most dangerous bovine is a fearful one - even if the kid is big -

oakie · Nov 28, 2012

You don't have any advice, you're just being an ass. If you would like to email me feel free to do so.

oakie · Nov 28, 2012

cowpoke said:
The best thing is to have another calm calf with him for companion ship plus it makes them eat better when they have to compete a little.It sounds like he hasnt had the best start to being a gentleman so its time to start over first by feeding out of a pan so he gets rewarded for being friendly.Tieing up one thats tough usually escalates things as it hurts them.I have over 50 years of experience and there are some that just dont want to live the show life.If you tie him up again do it in a chute and have something in back of him so he cant pull too far.If you get to the point of giving him a bath most like that.A donkey works but they work best if they have never been tied.Sometimes a vet prescribed [dont want DL upset] tranquilizer will help.I have bought some really good calves with an attitude and I try kindness first.Just when you have had enough some come around and around 50% go to the feedlot where they do fine usually and as they get bigger they usually just become part of the group and are hard to pick out.They are not much different than really good cow that has an attiude they are not worth getting hurt by .Good Luck

Thank you. He was going to get another lead broke calf the last time I spoke to him (to buddy with him), so hopefully that will help things out. The advisor seemed to brush it off like the calf isn't that bad so I'm hoping it's just inexperience.

DL · Nov 28, 2012

oakie said:
cowpoke said:

The best thing is to have another calm calf with him for companion ship plus it makes them eat better when they have to compete a little.It sounds like he hasnt had the best start to being a gentleman so its time to start over first by feeding out of a pan so he gets rewarded for being friendly.Tieing up one thats tough usually escalates things as it hurts them.I have over 50 years of experience and there are some that just dont want to live the show life.If you tie him up again do it in a chute and have something in back of him so he cant pull too far.If you get to the point of giving him a bath most like that.A donkey works but they work best if they have never been tied.Sometimes a vet prescribed [dont want DL upset] tranquilizer will help.I have bought some really good calves with an attitude and I try kindness first.Just when you have had enough some come around and around 50% go to the feedlot where they do fine usually and as they get bigger they usually just become part of the group and are hard to pick out.They are not much different than really good cow that has an attiude they are not worth getting hurt by .Good Luck

Click to expand...

Thank you. He was going to get another lead broke calf the last time I spoke to him (to buddy with him), so hopefully that will help things out. The advisor seemed to brush it off like the calf isn't that bad so I'm hoping it's just inexperience.

You sit with a calf for an hour and he never stops running the pen? and he runs to the point of panting? You were breaking him but you quit because he was running the weight off? And then you sold him to a big kid - and recently he is throwing dirt in the air by pawing the ground and butting the pitch fork but you say he's not mean, just spooky - and now you say the kid is inexperienced, but everything was disclosed multiple times - PRICELESS

oakie · Nov 28, 2012

DL I sent you an email, if you want to speak to me you can respond. I came on looking for some help, if you don't have any to offer then don't post in this topic.

AAOK · Nov 29, 2012

vc said:
Have him feed him 30 to 40 3mg Melatonin a day, and just spend as much time around the animal that he can for awhile, a pen mate might help as well (one that is really calm).

He needs to continue to tie and rinse daily just not push the animal to fast, we kept ours in a 12*24 pen for the first week or so until they calm down, some took longer. We have found feed and water to be my best friend when trying to get them calmed, he needs to feed at the same time each day and stay around so the calf finds out that he is the good guy, and when he sees it is a good thing.

We had a HW that was like that, He would just get worked up and go off, (we knew he had some trust issues when we bought him, swelled up chin, but that is why he came cheap) we worked with him daily for about a month, we made progress but it was slow. The breeder said to try Glu-coat, it had worked in the past on some calves, about 2 weeks into feeding him the glu-coat, he just stopped, Tuesday, he was climbing the wash rack, Wednesday he just stood there from start to finish and was fine from then on out. (We did feed him the glu-coat for the entire project, but it was worth it)

It seems like some of them can test you more than others but scared calves can seem the worst at first. We had a Angus calf get out the day we brough him home, ran through the gate down the road and found the creek, I followed him for 3 hours until it got dark. Spent the next week tracking him in the creek found him twice just to see him run through junk I could not crawl through, after a about a 10 days being on the loose he found some horses to hang with and got trapped in a pen by the horses owners, we had to have him roped and loaded in the trailer. He spent 3 days in the trailer, we waited until he stopped blowing snot and bouncing off the walls to move him into a corral, he was haltered and getting rinsed a week later. Food and time is all it took.

Tell the boy, it is up to him, he needs to be patient and persistant, and always keep his cool, At least it is a long project and times is on his side.

[b]Real good advice here. Now Kids, let's all settle down and play nice![/b]

marku · Nov 29, 2012

heard of cyber bullying, just never heard of cyber STEERing.....

Spooky Calf

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