Quantcast Show Posts - Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR

Sponsors







Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR

Pages: 1 ... 35 36 37 38 [39] 40
571
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 19, 2012, 06:10:53 AM »
I hope Shorthorn Tres Hojas doesn't mind me sharing their pictures. I really like their cattle.


This is the pic of bull calf that you liked. He was Palermo Champion on 2012


572
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 19, 2012, 05:43:43 AM »
https://www.facebook.com/shorthorn.treshojas?fref=ts

I have been friends on facebook with Tres Hojas for a while now, even chatted on occasion. Their cattle are very good. The bulls they have are just incredible and I would love to own one of them but we cannot import to USA. They also cannot use any USA genetics with an * because of registration rules.

Tres Hojas are great people.


This is not true. Argentina Herd Book have at least 5 or 6 appendix bulls on register, some already with progeny. The pedigrees are not well check and many appendix were entered there as W.Coopertop 464, W.Gold Card 5042, W.Prime Minister to list a few. The same occurred in Brazil many years ago, were by a code mistake Austin S4 entered here, after that lots entered in Brazil. The S.American countries have restrictive rules, but not check it accuratelly...things of third world!

573
The Big Show / Re: Some herd sires from the past
« on: December 18, 2012, 08:09:26 PM »
Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfields and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8Js sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the DN Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Duries Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carters in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfields in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfields F ls Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texass two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.



No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees  :o :o!! Any info about it?
 :-\ :-\

I have never heard any rumours about Eionmor Mr. Gus 80C and am absolutely positive it is nothing more than a rumour. I was very familiar with the herd at that time and saw 80C shown as a calf, yearling and two year old. His sire Gafa Mohican was sired by Crowfoot Flag a son of Mandalong Super Flag and out of the Diamond Dottie 2nd cow. The dam's side is all old poled and beef genetics.

http://www.clrc.ca/cgi-bin/extended_pedigree.cgi?_breedcode=MS&_countrycode=&_regnumberprefix=M&_regnumber=464139&_regnumbersuffix=&_association=21

There is a rumour abuot the dam of Winalot Big Mac and some of the people that claim that never thought it important enough to report at the time ???


Suppose that the rumor is about him be son of a Maine cow from Melbros herd!
Do you know some info about bulls that are not what pedigrees show? Can list it for me and what infusions are there!
 (thumbsup)

574
The Big Show / Re: Some herd sires from the past
« on: December 18, 2012, 06:23:17 PM »
Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfields and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8Js sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the DN Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Duries Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carters in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfields in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfields F ls Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texass two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.



No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees  :o :o!! Any info about it?
 :-\ :-\

575
The Big Show / Re: Some herd sires from the past
« on: December 18, 2012, 06:09:03 PM »
I have :

Cumberland Gay Lad
Scotsdale Rodney
Ready Go
Weston Secretariat
Glenford Curt( 1980 US National Champion in Fort Worth)
Ayatollah
Cactus Flat Ringmaster ( Ayatollah son who was  Champion at 1980 World show in Louisville)
HC Changing Times 85K  ( Senior Champion at the 1980 American Polled Congress in Kansas City
Huberdale Mastercharge
Deerpark Leader 13th ( Dividend)
AF Dividend Dealer 2
Mandalong Super Flag ( 90 vials)
Four Point Major  ( 100 vials)
Banner Royal Oak
Mandalong Super Elephant ( 1)
NVS Shadrack
IDS Duke of Dublin  ( about 1200 straws)
Highfield Irish Mist ( 5 straws in Canada also about 12 straws stored in the US)
Gotho Signal 3rd  ( imported Lincoln Red  - from England)
Meadowbrook Prince 16th
Meadowbrook Roan Chief
Claydene Everreddy
HUBS Director
Kenmar Lancer 58L
Green Row Dominator ( by Hillview Hobo)
Seagrave Royal Imperial ( dual purpose Shorthorn from the 60s)
Diamond Captain Mark 27C   (not sure if he counts as a sire from the past )
Marc 1V


I know I am forgetting some, so i will have to check my inventory book which is not here right now. I lost several sires from the past, a few years ago when I had a tank rupture. I lost over 100 straws of Pheasant Creek Leader 4th, and semen from 4 different Gloriadale sires from the 60s, including  the only 20 vials of Gloriadale Bonaparte in N America, as he was exported to South Africa.I also lost 32 embryos in that tank. There are 6 full tanks here at the farm, along with a few thousand doses stored in three different studs. My wife says that day 2 of my dispersal will be just semen and embryos. She may be right!
I also inherited Craig Andrew's semen tank after he passed away, and I haven't gone through it yet. I imagine there may be some gems of old sires in it as well.



 (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (lol)
OS WONDERFUL INVORY!!! MUST GET AN OLD 100% COW (NATIVE) TO ORDER SOME EMBRYOS FROM YOU WITH THESE SIRES.
 (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping)

I'M JEALOUS!

ALSO OWN 9 LINCOLN RED OLD BULLS FROM 60'S

576
The Big Show / Past Shorthorn sires...a new topic!
« on: December 18, 2012, 06:04:06 PM »
 (clapping) (clapping) (clapping)

By Sue suggestion, was reading an old topic about Some herd sires from the past. Also an very interest topic for me as I love read and know about old times bulls and cattle.

So I would like ask some info about a Bull called Scotsdale Tradition that was sent to UK.

Also would like ask for exactly (names) bulls are pedigree fakes or what herds did it, so in UK as North America. Please, private messages if wish. I wish have this info as Im trying to select some accurated 100% genetics and wish not loose time with some mistakes from past times.

As Im historic matter Love, wish ask for people that can help me, if possible   donate me old Shorthorn magazines, as old possible. Its very hard get it on internet and some times are reprints or wrong material. By private message or mail can support my postal address.

 <beer>

577
The Big Show / Re: Some herd sires from the past
« on: December 18, 2012, 06:02:47 PM »
My father who will turn 81 in June....  saw alot of the bulls in the post in person. He visited Louada twice a year and used alot of western canadian bulls too.

When he sees old semen or embryo matings  listed he just chuckles and says " have we screwed things up that much"?  I often wonder if he's right . But he argues the muscle vs white meat and no milk .
 Heres a guy that lived through the 80's calving the "monsters" and frankly was better then most vets getting "one" out alive.

My recent visit(s) this past summer/ fall would solidify some of what he says is right. There is a reason some of those old cows look so "chubby" .... the nurse cows were feeding the calves. All I can say is be careful before you plunge. I personally have lost interest.

But hey I have Leader 9th semen for sale ;D

Also have lots of Leader 9th semen (not for sale), some old bulls also are on my tank, unhappily few straws.
Thanks for suggest this topic is amazing!!!




578
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:57:59 PM »
I hope Shorthorn Tres Hojas doesn't mind me sharing their pictures. I really like their cattle.

I'm sure that Guillermo will appreciate your pics.
The bull calf (18 months at pics - 2011) was Champion on this year (2012). It's a massive beast, with a good frame (around 6 - 6.5) very large loin and back. Very strong bones. On last year after finnish the show I told for owner that he would be the next Champion, I was right. I'm trying to import some semen from him to use on my argentinian line that embryos will produce.
The last bull - Sandokan - is a very good one too. High framed too, but perfect to improve size and add bones. Saw some progeny, isn't a perfect improver as some calves are not exactly what we expect, but is very useful as is an open line here and there. Semen isn't available for export as him died unfortunatelly.

579
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:52:28 PM »
Lincoln Red were widely used on Argentina, Uruguay and Brazil for 15 years at least. I can tell you, 100% sure, that ALL Shorthorn cattle on these three countries show some Lincoln Red infusion. Today, of course, this influence is on back generations on almost all cattle. But ALL show Lincoln Red on the pedigrees. Direct use on Lincoln Red is impossible today due register rules, but use of animals with LR percentage that are already on the herd book is permitted. So I can use a half blood Lincoln Red bull on my cows since this bull is on herd book. At true I own semen of some bulls wih this case, the heterosis is increadible and the progeny show a very good type, specially to put meat on some US lines.
Lincoln Reds were included in the Canadian herd book for almost 25 years. One of the reasons the breeders of pure Lincoln Reds withdrew was to breed more 100% pure animals and protect the breed. It is considered a rare breed in both Britain and Canada. Shorthorn breeders used several of the Lincoln Red sires and their influence is still seen in some Canadian animals. The registration numbers of Lincoln Red influenced animals carry a LR in the registration numbers.

I like of registration system found on UK, US and Canada were we can check the pedigrees and through symbols (% or *) found easily the influenced cattle. Here in Brazil, unhappily we not have none symbol to discrimine the influenced stock. Must know the pedigrees and bulls, sue to this I'm a specialist on Brazilian Uruguyan and Argentinian pedigrees as was necessary study deeply all pedigrees many generations back. I have an excell copy with full Shorthorn and Lincoln Red register on my computer, so is very easy check where is what I need find.

580
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:48:39 PM »
Lincoln Red were widely used on Argentina, Uruguay and Brazil for 15 years at least. I can tell you, 100% sure, that ALL Shorthorn cattle on these three countries show some Lincoln Red infusion. Today, of course, this influence is on back generations on almost all cattle. But ALL show Lincoln Red on the pedigrees. Direct use on Lincoln Red is impossible today due register rules, but use of animals with LR percentage that are already on the herd book is permitted. So I can use a half blood Lincoln Red bull on my cows since this bull is on herd book. At true I own semen of some bulls wih this case, the heterosis is increadible and the progeny show a very good type, specially to put meat on some US lines.
/// One of my favorite functional bulls is GB Daybreak Express-who was by Byland Dazzler and went back to Licoln Red and Maine. Did they ever use any Maine Anjou in the Southern Americas-that were not dangerous calving? I would think Maines would work on the deep-stout cows like the roan from Argentina-in JustIn Times thread. O0
Yes, Maines were used only in Brazil. In Argentina and Uruguay recently (*) bulls were imported, so will find Maine, Holstein and Chianina there through (*) bulls. In Brazil Maines were used by limited numbers. Why? Don't know exactly....I suppose that for purpous looked by breeders Lincoln Red show more efficiency than Maines, as breeders were looking for to add polling factor and red coat on cattle, not only size. Also the British Lincoln Red breeders did very incisive marketing, bringing lots of bulls and salling it here at low prices. None Maine Anjou breeder did it or thinked on it. Maine blood enter here through AI bulls as Cunia, Scottish Echard, Dindonno, Bysantin, Plurenden Goliath, etc..... Lincoln Red were introduced through semen and live animals and each Shorthorn breeder in Brazil got your own Lincoln red bull for personal use. No data regarding birth problems.
MAine will not work well on roan cow on pic, as she is exactly what we are looking for, not is necessary add size and loose easy birth, motheing ability, meat quality and all Shorthorn characteristics. Would be one or two steps behing using Maine Anjous here again. No place for Maine influence cattle as Trump.

what about maines like the bull I posted pics on today?  He's as far from a trump deal as anything ever could be.. muscle in that bull, and his females will be good, calving ease too.l

I understand that are different kinds of M.Anjou bulls and genetics. Surelly not like and never will use Trump or similar genetics as Club Calfs. Bad color, bad type and bad performance. The Maines used on UK are differents, they are original lines, big of course, but acceptable at some point. Your animals are also acceptable too. The "acceptable" means to me an animal able to survive on GRASS, and not improved grass, but native grass, that is my enviroment. My cows are 500 to 580 kg, some ones reach to 700 kg, but this is the high limite. I sale fat cattle, cows only, for slaughter with a medium weight of 520 kg on 6 months grass. So, my business operation must work and give me money on native grass, and a big cow will not five me calves or finnish approatelly on a 6 months (november-april) season to become fat enough for abattoirs. You must raise what your ranch allow!

581
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:40:01 PM »
echard is still available in brazil but not in north America.

Wish some would show up. I have plurendin Goliath.  Bysantin is still around though minimally.

Too bad

I own some semen of Echard. The last old Maine Anjou straws in Brazil. A guy from Canada is trying to reintroduce Maine Anjou in pure status here in Brazil. Offer some embryos to a partnership (free embryos and 50/50 progeny), but the brazilian responsable by program is a hardy to talk. Don't know what can happen. But I'm open for partnerships here of course.

582
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:37:04 PM »
Intestine take on the Lincoln reds. They don't get any love in the north.

Understand, is easy to feel it as are very rare the LR influence on US. More influence on Canada. LR did your work here in S.America. Some bulls gifted us with hardy shed and big teats. But some ones did a very good work. On that time I was a child and personally I believe that use LR or Maine Anjou here was a mistake, more fashion than true reserach. Believe that some genetics of pure Shorthorns could to be used for improve the characteristics that breeders would like to improve. But, was did and not has as turn back! Due to this I'm very very cautions with some "absolute trues" read today for some "researchers".

583
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 18, 2012, 03:32:18 PM »
I like how they are showing in the mud.

On that year, 2011, I was there and wa sinvited to put the 3 best female prize. Good heifer! Mud, lots of mud and cool very cool. But mud is part of business on show or on ranch! Not a problem.

584
The Big Show / Re: What do you think of this Shorthorn female?
« on: December 17, 2012, 08:28:41 PM »
Count Willy and Estrella are my two favorites you have Pictured.

GB


On next saturday will collect four cows with both ones. Estrella have better progeny than Willy. Saw Willy personnaly, impressive bull at two years.
Some outstanding Argentinian bulls (for me of course) will to be add soon.
Thanks for your comment GB.

585
The Big Show / Re: Schrag sale
« on: December 17, 2012, 08:25:04 PM »
 (clapping) (clapping) (clapping)
Very interest topic! Starts with a light discussion regarding a determinated herd and finds with a very very good interpretation from a Hereford breeder (not Miniature suppose), some times an outside unparcial view have good value!
Understood and learn some topics today:
- On US/Canada show cattle are fake beasts but are good for sold, and real cattle are bad for sold but are real!
- Shorthorn EPD's are ALL fake and unuseful numbers only used for occupy space on sale catalogues, as breeders in general lie the real values or do a pr clean on data.
- For some people a 110 pounds calf is better than a 80 pounds calf....but on reality both ones will to be weaned and go to a feedlot and this show no meaning for me, as grain will finnish both on same time.
- Sale catalogues show BW EPD's, not the real bull BW. So a bull that born with 110 lbs and show a -1 BW EPD is preferred for one that show BW EPD of + 2 lbs, even born with 80 lbs.
- Scottish like of big animals (saw it on local), don't know how many time....maybe until Prime Minister cut off all subsidies and Scots/Brits must bred real cattle that will born, grow, work, conceive and birth on grass as real cattle.
- US and Canadian breeder are like Brazilian...each one blindly believes that your operation, in consequence your genetics are the true one.

Interest topic!
 (pop)

Pages: 1 ... 35 36 37 38 [39] 40
Powered by EzPortal