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Offline BroncoFan

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #75 on: February 19, 2020, 10:07:49 PM »
Second hand here but I talked to some people and the overwhelming sentiment was that nothing really blew them away. That said Chosen 1 seemed to get some acclaim and Griswolds had a couple that were pretty cool. This was the year for the HIA sons so it should be interesting to see which ones click, if any.
Thank you!
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Offline nkotb

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #76 on: February 20, 2020, 03:29:04 PM »
I was there and feel like that is an apt statement.  Overall, I thought the clubby bulls were underwhelming, a lot of puds for sure.  I thought Chosen 1 was cool, and Wade had a couple that would work, but nothing that just really set anyone apart.  There was some solid purebred/maternal bulls, but I cannot remember names.  It'd sure be nice to see one of the clubbier deals that had a little frame and grow to add.

Online mark tenenbaum

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #77 on: February 20, 2020, 08:13:37 PM »
Thats starting to happen in the shows-people Like Jim Compton, Griener, Gargan,  and a growing number of  others are producing them-Needed change JMO O0

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #78 on: February 21, 2020, 10:32:59 AM »
Im sure breeding the moderate maternal types to framey club calf bulls will only work out for the best

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #79 on: February 21, 2020, 01:01:09 PM »
I think the clubby bulls are getting too moderate and are a dime a dozen. I guess time will tell which bulls will produce champions and which will never stay around.
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Online mark tenenbaum

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #80 on: February 22, 2020, 02:31:25 PM »
Actually its the other way around-The steers and heifers that are thick, show some real substance along with the goodies and are  not flatsided melting machines that cant raise a calf, Are getting more framy, sounder, and are placing Pay Attention its happening: in the Mecca of Club Calves TEXAS Also in Iowa and Wisconsin-Acksarban etc Even in the Shorthorn heifer and steer shows of the last year or so-Where Monte Soules and the click dont dominate anymore  and are starting to  get their asses kicked by cattle (and sons and daughters) of recent outcross non broken record cattle that are also functional in type in respect to the fact they raised the latest calves-and even come back and win cow calf shows at The Junior Nationals etc O0

Offline SEA

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #81 on: February 23, 2020, 11:50:37 AM »
Im sure breeding the moderate maternal types to framey club calf bulls will only work out for the best

"Club Calf" Type bulls have been small framed, short spined, hairy, heavy boned, deep sided and display extreme muscle, for quite a long time.
 
They throw large calves (w/big bone), that are hard to calve out.  Most have little substance and growth.  Most are highly crossbred to the point of Mongrelism, thereby making the resulting calf crop very inconsistent.
They need bred to larger framed and longer spined cows that have some growth and substance to these type bulls work. 
This is why you yearly hear cattlemen complain that "All the Club Calf Bulls on Display in Denver are the Same", each year.

Due to rising feed cost and lower cattle markets, many cattlemen have moved to raising a more "moderate frame cow", that is deep ribbed and can sustain themselves on grass and stalks and less yellow corn $$.  These cows need bred to a different type of bull.  Only a small percentage of calves resulting from club calf bulls actually make "Good Show Steers" (half are heifers), therefore the majority of the offspring still have to be fed out and go to market.  Slow growing, inefficient PUDS just don't keep the banker away!  Also, many cattlemen that raised "Club Calves" 10-20 years ago, have since quit and gotten out.

Many other "Club Calf Breeders" still in the business are searching for a bull that has many of the same characteristics of current club calf bulls with bigger frame, longer spined, some smaller Birth Weights, and substance and GROWTH.

 
 

Offline BroncoFan

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #82 on: February 23, 2020, 05:15:40 PM »
Im sure breeding the moderate maternal types to framey club calf bulls will only work out for the best

"Club Calf" Type bulls have been small framed, short spined, hairy, heavy boned, deep sided and display extreme muscle, for quite a long time.
 
They throw large calves (w/big bone), that are hard to calve out.  Most have little substance and growth.  Most are highly crossbred to the point of Mongrelism, thereby making the resulting calf crop very inconsistent.
They need bred to larger framed and longer spined cows that have some growth and substance to these type bulls work. 
This is why you yearly hear cattlemen complain that "All the Club Calf Bulls on Display in Denver are the Same", each year.

Due to rising feed cost and lower cattle markets, many cattlemen have moved to raising a more "moderate frame cow", that is deep ribbed and can sustain themselves on grass and stalks and less yellow corn $$.  These cows need bred to a different type of bull.  Only a small percentage of calves resulting from club calf bulls actually make "Good Show Steers" (half are heifers), therefore the majority of the offspring still have to be fed out and go to market.  Slow growing, inefficient PUDS just don't keep the banker away!  Also, many cattlemen that raised "Club Calves" 10-20 years ago, have since quit and gotten out.

Many other "Club Calf Breeders" still in the business are searching for a bull that has many of the same characteristics of current club calf bulls with bigger frame, longer spined, some smaller Birth Weights, and substance and GROWTH.
You said it better than I ever could. It amazes me when a clubby bred calf comes out weighing around 100lbs but only weans at 500lbs at weaning. More maternal higher % Maine, Shorthorn etc are working on clubby bred cows to give them some consistency, milking ability, maternal calving ease, growth, etc.
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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #83 on: February 24, 2020, 11:17:16 AM »
Im sure breeding the moderate maternal types to framey club calf bulls will only work out for the best

"Club Calf" Type bulls have been small framed, short spined, hairy, heavy boned, deep sided and display extreme muscle, for quite a long time.
 
They throw large calves (w/big bone), that are hard to calve out.  Most have little substance and growth.  Most are highly crossbred to the point of Mongrelism, thereby making the resulting calf crop very inconsistent.
They need bred to larger framed and longer spined cows that have some growth and substance to these type bulls work. 
This is why you yearly hear cattlemen complain that "All the Club Calf Bulls on Display in Denver are the Same", each year.

Due to rising feed cost and lower cattle markets, many cattlemen have moved to raising a more "moderate frame cow", that is deep ribbed and can sustain themselves on grass and stalks and less yellow corn $$.  These cows need bred to a different type of bull.  Only a small percentage of calves resulting from club calf bulls actually make "Good Show Steers" (half are heifers), therefore the majority of the offspring still have to be fed out and go to market.  Slow growing, inefficient PUDS just don't keep the banker away!  Also, many cattlemen that raised "Club Calves" 10-20 years ago, have since quit and gotten out.

Many other "Club Calf Breeders" still in the business are searching for a bull that has many of the same characteristics of current club calf bulls with bigger frame, longer spined, some smaller Birth Weights, and substance and GROWTH.

Hello captain obvious-

The shitshow will present itself when Tom and sally start breeding their short coupled little clubby cows to growthy bulls with more frame.

Save the economics argument if it were about economics none of these genetics would even exist.  Sure theres a few making money but overwhelming net negative industry for almost all.

Online mark tenenbaum

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #84 on: February 24, 2020, 05:37:31 PM »
HERES SOME CLUBBY DINKS- The 2020 grand and reserve heifers at Badger and Grand and 1st place heifers at Iowa beef expo along with 4 or 5 others I didnt post :are all  out of 2 cows (both ex show heifers)The heifers ARE ALL 1000 pounds plus at a year etc The ones at Iowa-Badger were the right age-and were the heaviest WDAS in the whole show other than a couple escapees of the mayan calender That YW includes the massive white hiefer that won Acksarban last fall pictured as a calf last year at Badger Then there"s the little red wm  Hairball that won Iowa beef expo and previously reserve at badger-hes a calf-and looks like one albeit tremendous real performance and commercial "quality"-State Fair season he will look like a breed steer- PS the BIG growthy roan steer calf is a full sib to four or five heifers from 2019 (the roan in the photo that brought $8500 is one) He brought $17000-Three guesses where he went Texas Texas Texas-if you didnt guess Texas you aint as smart as you act LOL O0
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 06:06:54 PM by mark tenenbaum »

Offline BroncoFan

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #85 on: February 25, 2020, 08:58:43 AM »
We have had to sell out of most of our shorthorn cows because either their feet didnt hold up on our Wyoming summer range or they had too much pink on their udders that got sunburnt when the sun reflected off the snow.

We used Young Money quite a bit in the past who was basically half shorthorn. Hes steers looked great and did well as county fair steers. Most of the cows we put him on could milk like dairy cows and could calve an elephant. YM took away their milking ability and shrunk their pelviss.

Im not opposed to using Shorthorn bulls to make show steers/heifers but give me ideas.
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Online mark tenenbaum

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #86 on: February 25, 2020, 09:24:35 AM »
Look no further than the thread above you DJS OUTSIDER-He goes back to the top Mckkees cow familys-Cherry (most dominant Nat Champ female ever) and Annadells-Along with Arsulu Meg-arguably the top doner in the last 25 years in terms of overall functional cattle that go on to raise calves make herd bulls whos sons daughters do the same same.https://shorthorn.digitalbeef.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=_animal&file=_animal&animal_registration=4208833    There have been at least 10 winners this last year-MANY big sellers-The 3 I pictured above are all by him and full or 3/4 sibs Lately-the champ hiefer at Badger and Iowa Beef expo is one There have been a number of others He wasnt widely used but Jim Compton bought him and those  cattle started it Laughtner has since bought him from Compton and he is a pretty big hit-Semen sales wise The cows in his pedigree including the Stangle dam of 20 20 back there ALL were functional-maternal THICK cattle O0
« Last Edit: February 25, 2020, 09:29:31 AM by mark tenenbaum »

Online Medium Rare

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #87 on: February 25, 2020, 09:50:00 AM »
Is there a mature picture of Outsider?

Offline SEA

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #88 on: February 25, 2020, 10:36:45 AM »
Its all relevant as the underlying theme in any post about bulls is about potentially buying/using them.

The more transparency the industry has, the better off everyone will be except of course for the salesmen.

XBAR:
1. I am tired of your constant negativity on this site towards other posters, me included.
If you cant say something good or add to a post, perhaps it is better to not say/wriite anything at all.
2. The relevancy of this post is...2020 Denver Bulls.  NOT whatever Shorthorn bull you care to talk about.
3. What you did is called Stealing A Thread.  It is an act of posting on someone elses thread and Changing the Subject stated and started by another individual.   It is considered Disrespectful in most circles.  In this case disrespectful to Shortybreeder.
4. Regardless, of your opinion, this site is for all cattle people and their topics.  It is NOT a SHORTHORN MOSTLY site.  If you do not care for a particular post, simply scroll down.  If you want to start a discussion about Shorthorns or something else cattle related.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2020, 01:47:59 PM by SEA »

Offline SEA

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Re: 2020 Denver Bulls
« Reply #89 on: February 25, 2020, 11:24:06 AM »
Im sure breeding the moderate maternal types to framey club calf bulls will only work out for the best

"Club Calf" Type bulls have been small framed, short spined, hairy, heavy boned, deep sided and display extreme muscle, for quite a long time.
 
They throw large calves (w/big bone), that are hard to calve out.  Most have little substance and growth.  Most are highly crossbred to the point of Mongrelism, thereby making the resulting calf crop very inconsistent.
They need bred to larger framed and longer spined cows that have some growth and substance to these type bulls work. 
This is why you yearly hear cattlemen complain that "All the Club Calf Bulls on Display in Denver are the Same", each year.

Due to rising feed cost and lower cattle markets, many cattlemen have moved to raising a more "moderate frame cow", that is deep ribbed and can sustain themselves on grass and stalks and less yellow corn $$.  These cows need bred to a different type of bull.  Only a small percentage of calves resulting from club calf bulls actually make "Good Show Steers" (half are heifers), therefore the majority of the offspring still have to be fed out and go to market.  Slow growing, inefficient PUDS just don't keep the banker away!  Also, many cattlemen that raised "Club Calves" 10-20 years ago, have since quit and gotten out.

Many other "Club Calf Breeders" still in the business are searching for a bull that has many of the same characteristics of current club calf bulls with bigger frame, longer spined, some smaller Birth Weights, and substance and GROWTH.

Hello captain obvious-

The shitshow will present itself when Tom and sally start breeding their short coupled little clubby cows to growthy bulls with more frame.

Save the economics argument if it were about economics none of these genetics would even exist.  Sure theres a few making money but overwhelming net negative industry for almost all.

To Canadian XBAR,

Needless to say, I DO NOT LIKE BEING TALKED DOWN TO BY YOU NOR YOUR USE OF BULLYING AND NAME CALLING!  Your negative comments are unwarranted many times just plain wrong or ridiculous.
Sorry, but my post is referring to your statement in the post above.  Maybe you did not understand the POINT of my post I wrote in response. 

Perhaps I should have written: 

To: Mr. XBAR,
There are NO LARGE FRAMED, CLUBBY BULLS WITH AT LEAST SOME PERFORMANCE AND SUBSTANCE being promoted today.   That is the type of bull the clubby breeders are looking for and trying to find and discuss on this thread.

**** SHOW?!  You have NO KNOWLEDGE of my cows or many other cattle producers.  So, please refrain from your ignorant and remarks about other peoples cattle.  Especially, those which you have no personal experience of. 

The WORST BULLS that I have ever used were SHORTHORNS!  Going back to your infamous DOUBLE STUFF BULLS and his generations of offspring!  TH, PHA, huge shoulders that flail out, small feet that point out, huge boned, high birthweight, no milk, small pelvic areas in replacements, NO GROWTH and Docks at the market are what made the Club Calf Bulls and many pedigrees of Shorthorn, what they are today!  Many cattlemen (not just club calf producers), vets, and  embryologists, that YES, I know personally and of their experiences/stories, have totally stopped using Shorthorn bulls, due to the Train Wrecks that they have EXPERIENCED.

Having said the above concerning Shorthorn, I am not one of the Shorthorn HATERS.  I have used them (and had some terrible results back-in-the-day.  However, not all Shorthorn and Shorthorn pedigrees are the same.  I think they have their place as do most breeds.  I still do use them on occasion.  But only after research, and only certain pedigrees. 

 

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