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Author Topic: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT  (Read 5450 times)

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2022, 09:28:17 AM »
Mark,

  Maybe you need to give me a history lesson but I'm currious about your comment of Maine influence in Echodale Top Draft?

By memory I remember there being a bunch of Irish breeding as well as some Dual Purpose influence but I don't remember Maine?  ///// Could have been back in the Alden end not Reg Daileys side Ed and Robert bought him for a reason -I saw him in 1991-or 2  at Louisville -struck up a conversation with Ed and lawrence about how different he was made etc They threw a few hints and we hit it off We also talked about the "GR Exclusive " daughter Exclusives Show Girl- they had there for Harold Hoskins She went right back to Flash (Vistas Sentra 18 U ) And her daughter Top Dradts Show me was an absolute beast -looked more like a maine than anything I ended up later having a herd with them till Lawrence passed in an accident years later  O0

Can you explain?
« Last Edit: January 09, 2022, 09:45:22 AM by mark tenenbaum »

Offline knabe

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2022, 12:14:03 PM »
vistas sentra 20U?
https://maine-anjou.digitalbeef.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=_animal&file=_animal&animal_registration=119458

his sire, zta magnum 44 by cunia and horton helena was a very stout bull and prominent for a while in the club calf deal in the 80's.

on the bottom, dollar II was pretty stout, and the feraine cow was supposedly a hand picked cow.

throw in dalton, stout, big boned (in draft pick)

and... looking stuff for this, found a cow i've never seen.

https://maine-anjou.digitalbeef.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=_animal&file=_animal&search_value=&animal_registration=54&member_id=
« Last Edit: January 09, 2022, 12:14:36 PM by knabe »
"The generation that told us to question authority, has now become the Authority we cannot question!"

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2022, 08:34:45 PM »
Thats Flash-I always get his number wrong-We had a pretty growthy bull out of him -and Ive seen many daughters of him that were called something els He must have been a very big bull Exclusives Carrie was reserve at the national Jr Heifer show but the association removed her because she was actually sired by Flash-She was the second biggest female Ive ever seen A cow called "flashes 2975 " appeared a few years later as the Mother of Studley-who won Louisville and Denver It was her  O0

Offline oakview

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2022, 09:28:40 AM »
Maybe it's not such a bad thing the ASA is now requiring bulls to be used for breeding purposes be DNA tested.  I read that  the "mis-sired" rate is about 10%. Evidently was much higher is some herds in the past.  I understand accidents happen, but when it's intentional, is it an accident?  Should we be accusing folks of misrepresenting pedigrees if they're not here to defend themselves?  'Common knowledge' is sometimes not 'common knowledge.'

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2022, 09:59:22 AM »
I used to stay with Harold every time I went to Kansas for alot of years starting in 1991He was a wildman back in the day Harold would laugh when people asked him what the cattle were Tell you they were sired by forget me not or SWINGER (flash) Id say-thats a Flash-hed say I guess anythings possible Ha Ha etc I always wanted to know what flash looked like and he was always pretty vague But I ended up with a pretty good idea what things were  He would not do anything about Carries real lineage-And could care less, thought it was funny. Ed Grathwohl was really mad about that because it involved him too  So Harold (known as Slick ) got sued by the family that paid $30000 for Carrie-THAT WAS ALOT OF MONEY IN THOSE DAYS He took her back is all I know-I saw her numerous times for maybe 8 years I could pick a flash a mile away-Because I had a couple and Deertrail had a few Later I took Carrie and Primos lady to Trans ova and flushed both  O0

Offline Duncraggan

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2022, 10:53:15 AM »
Maybe it's not such a bad thing the ASA is now requiring bulls to be used for breeding purposes be DNA tested.  I read that  the "mis-sired" rate is about 10%. Evidently was much higher is some herds in the past.  I understand accidents happen, but when it's intentional, is it an accident? Should we be accusing folks of misrepresenting pedigrees if they're not here to defend themselves?  'Common knowledge' is sometimes not 'common knowledge.'
Fortunately we now have DNA testing as a standard to prevent 'accidents'. My concern is for those breeders who put their faith in the integrity of their bull breeders and now, unknowingly, have tainted genetics!
I believe social media is a cancer, and I therefore feel sorry for talented breeders who produced outliers and that may now possibly be labelled as a result. They are not here, in many cases, to defend themselves. See above post.
To have 'anecdotal' accounts of breeders bragging about their, possible, genetic manipulation makes my blood boil!

Offline knabe

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2022, 01:32:36 PM »
i feel one shouldn't make the pedigree what it says on the paper no matter the circumstance.

this ruins epd's.

social media is a cancer.

mistakes happen, and that isn't good enough to keep the pedigree wrong.

if dna is available, there should be no reason to accept a past pedigree if proven wrong.

i seem to remember some cunia cross bred whose pedigree was wrong.

didn't seem to hurt anyone.

it mostly doesn't matter anyway since the offspring these days will probably generate their own epd's that are more accurate than their parents.

if anyone wants to use their parents that are based off a limited set of offspring and the papered animal is wrong, it won't matter much anyway.

not saying it is, but would anyone really care if irish whiskey was wrong?

legacy plus supposedly had two different sets of papers.  does anyone really care?  only the original litigants care because the animal was supposed to be dead.

where it really starts to matter is if some high dollar animal is wrong.  these days, it simply doesn't make that much sense to not verify parentage if that matters.

bulls that sell for $2500-5000 with no intended semen use, it probably doesn't matter.  how the calves perform matters, and if they don't, that probably matters.

for dna verification, if one is looking for something specific, then it does matter. these people, if they don't dna parentage, are probably not best suited to look for stuff and they will disappear.

etc.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2022, 01:32:57 PM by knabe »
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Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: Got lost in cyber space-up pops JIT
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2022, 02:07:58 PM »
Maybe it's not such a bad thing the ASA is now requiring bulls to be used for breeding purposes be DNA tested.  I read that  the "mis-sired" rate is about 10%. Evidently was much higher is some herds in the past.  I understand accidents happen, but when it's intentional, is it an accident? Should we be accusing folks of misrepresenting pedigrees if they're not here to defend themselves?  'Common knowledge' is sometimes not 'common knowledge.'
Fortunately we now have DNA testing as a standard to prevent 'accidents'. My concern is for those breeders who put their faith in the integrity of their bull breeders and now, unknowingly, have tainted genetics!
I believe social media is a cancer, and I therefore feel sorry for talented breeders who produced outliers and that may now possibly be labelled as a result. They are not here, in many cases, to defend themselves. See above post.
To have 'anecdotal' accounts of breeders bragging about their, possible, genetic manipulation makes my blood boil!  ////// That went on for years in ALL BREEDS-The periods we are talking about are the late 80s AND VERY EARLY 90S AND a LOT OF PEOPLE KNEW IT just by looking at the cattle IF ANY ENTICER BLOOD EVER GOT TO YOUR COUNTRY YOU ARE UNWITTINGLY GUILTY TOO AS FAR AS Harold went- If you said something to him about it and hed had a drink or two-hed tell you to F!#$^*(k off and didnt care what you thought. I like to know what I can about breeding cattle-So Id listen to what people said-And some of those cattle were very good because of "progressive" breeding pratices. O0

 

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