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Offline mark tenenbaum

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JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« on: May 22, 2020, 08:29:32 PM »
Yes here he is friends and neighbors,North Of 49- 0 BW EPD-lotta performance-real thick-with a ghetto butt and a different mix of Canadian Australian  and the right kind of US breeding INCLUDING A HAUMONT BULL AS HIS MATERNAL GRAND PA HOW YOU LIKE THEM APPLES IDA LEE-I liked him when JIT first pictured him-hes pictured on this blurb only a couple days after a 3000 mile journey to Ryan Wernicke in lena Ill Hes being collected-Cattle Visions has some but hes selling fast-Just by word of mouth-The breed needs some alternatives-I see him (if he works) as another step in the performance with CE-and THICK-DIRECTION-like Dales Homeplace Hot C -who incidentally is SOLD OUT O0
« Last Edit: May 22, 2020, 08:46:04 PM by mark tenenbaum »

Offline Gargan

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2020, 08:36:53 PM »
Welfare's purpose should be to eliminate, as far as possible, the need for its own existence.  -Ronald reagan

Offline Doc

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2020, 05:11:04 AM »
 I like his pedigree and the way he looks. The bad thing for me personally is that he is DSC. I'm not saying that I won't use a DSC bull, but when I do I want to make sure that rewards are worth the risk. On an unproven bull, I don't know that rewards are there. Hopefully he works out the best.   JMHO.
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enough to take everything you have.   -- Thomas Jefferson

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2020, 08:10:17 AM »
Hes being used on good ones so it wont be a mystery for long I dont see very many other Shorthorn bulls that arent full of Sullivan- Cates -WHR-etc genetics Like the Daddys money Hot C sons in Indiana forgot the Firestorm son-There again no one uses one like that for CE  BWS are important to me-and no onetime shot of Hot Commodity is EVER going to eliminate those linebred  Solution etc hardoing cow killer genes-And DS is so overblown that if one is clean or is not DSH or DS  and PHA I dont worry about it Matt in California and K Kim along with Jungels and a ton of people linebred Proud Jazz etc-how many of them even saw a DS? Ill risk it over 150 pound calves anytime-Obviously not the case for TH or PHA O0
« Last Edit: May 23, 2020, 08:42:56 AM by mark tenenbaum »

Offline -XBAR-

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2020, 09:23:57 AM »
What exactly do you mean by, again.   


Whos using him on good ones?

The only calving ease in this pedigree is the one shot of hot commodity-  hows this any different!? His sire is a +3 bw- same scenario.

Its also paramount to note that when he was displayed in Canada, his birth weight was presented as being 93lbs.  Which is more in line with his genetics.  We all heard the bs excuse about not having a market to correct the stall sign- but we all know thats bs.  At a minimum, the incorrect 20lb heavier weight would have just been marked out and nothing put there if you didnt have a marker.   No no  in Canada where 70 pound birthweights are looked down upon the calf was 93, in the US where 93 is looked down upon the calf is 70. 

Offline idalee

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2020, 09:48:31 AM »
I'm not sure why I was mentioned as liking apples,  but this is not a bull I would be particularly interested in using!   His EPD numbers are only mediocre and based on almost NO information.   He has a substantial influence from Maine genetics and Trump.   Trump has his own problems independent of the Maine aspect.   He has an incomplete pedigree so we don't really know what is behind him.   Then,  I would want to know his Myostatin status.   Finally,  I don't have much use for pictures of a fluffy show calf.   Let's see what he looks like after a summer serving cows

Offline knabe

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2020, 01:27:17 PM »
ad looks like he's being promoted as a terminal/show calf bull.


i think i could use a little more flatness/ruggedness with regard to his rear bone structure.


sorta has that i don't want to grow but i will hold forever look.




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Offline aj

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2020, 01:57:18 PM »
Has anyone sent in a straw of hot commodity to test for myostatin. I know that most people don't care but it would be nice to know.
People can't believe we have such a big moon for such a small town.

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2020, 08:34:28 PM »
Wernickes have helped JIT fit etc here and there for years-Off Road was a bull they produced that did well for some people including Rockdale-a few years ago-was the highest selling bull in the history of the ohio beef expo for awhile, and more or less sold out of semen -WERNACRES have been behind national champion and quality  cattle for 100 years-They have good ones-You are out of your league if you want to compare cattle and history in general versus what they have done since the turn of the century The Haumont breeding  commercial cow WILL CERTAINLY BE CALVING EASE thats why I mentioned Ida Lee-she has some of  that kind of breeding-I would assume from comments Ive read Hes a  completely different type-and certainly too massive for the people that tout that kind of breeding thus the comment-CF PROSPERITY IS one of the more documented calving ease bulls in the breed considering hes been around since 1997-and was used extensively on heifers by Huckfelt-Backenhus and lots of little breeders like me (starting in 1997) That leaves a Hot Commodity grandson  son of Shadybrook Hot Shot with some real performance-beef cattle that were well documented including a Proud Venture and Australian performace bull So theres more REAL NUMBERS right or wrong there compared to the everyday purebred Shorts I see-So I would think that with any accuracies that might be missing from the commercial cow in his pedigree (who most likely has a lot of Canadian ce -performance cattle-which are documented too) would still support CE and his CURRANT  EPDS on the ASA of .06 BW along with his dams -.3 or whatever Almost wondering if the DS came from the Haumont bull even dairy cattle have bad days-not to mention NO THICKNESS Given the Enticer and somewhat Canadian based cattle you have TEX-how many of your pedigrees are basically 75% calving ease-You need to know the cattle from experience as well as counting beans and calling it quality by numbers alone  Im not at all afraid of a 93 pound bull thats real-and if the calves are shaped right What do the 70 pound bull calves (if they really exist) look like in a year?  Today- Hes 1 year and two months old off a long journey So as far as him not growing or having any mass-for the first time on here I have to say-THATS A REALLY STUPID COMMENT-YOUR TURN-lets see your long yearling yearling bulls I DOUBT ANY  OF YOU HAVE ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY CLOSE TO A YOUNG BULL LIKE THAT  Yea- hes actually been fed-just like Toby Jordans -paint Valley Byland Jungels etc-Ive seen skiiny hardoing ratty Shorthorns laughed out of the ring all my life brought by  so called purists who think a half starved 850 pound yearling is the commercial deal There might be a course made high gutted maine that has a butt thats close to his with calves that come out shaped like a football If its an oldschool fulblood maine- I GUARANTEE he wasnt 85 pounds or less at birth and run in the desert  to look like this one as a long yearling - A while back I was e mailing back and forth about ratty hardoing dairy looking cows i didnt like-with no thickness at all oddly enough they were down in the country where cattle are thick-we did LMAO-Maybe I should post some of them next as examples of documented (by pictures) scary BWS  and no performance to speak of .I for one need them to be at least shaped right at calving,to grow and be thick Because commercial people buy bulls from me when I have them O0
« Last Edit: May 25, 2020, 01:19:57 PM by mark tenenbaum »

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #9 on: May 23, 2020, 09:21:57 PM »
Has anyone sent in a straw of hot commodity to test for myostatin. I know that most people don't care but it would be nice to know./// Send me 300 then I might bust one-He really doesnt have the apple butt look though neither have any of the progeny Ive seenO0

Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #10 on: May 23, 2020, 09:23:37 PM »
ad looks like he's being promoted as a terminal/show calf bull.


i think i could use a little more flatness/ruggedness with regard to his rear bone structure.


sorta has that i don't want to grow but i will hold forever look./// Hes terminal looking because hes thick? You are in the wrong breed-you need native cattle O0

Offline knabe

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2020, 10:53:21 PM »
Hes terminal looking because hes thick? You are in the wrong breed-you need native cattle O0



it's easier for people to read your comments if you put the previous quote in "quotes", then follow outside with your comments. i get it you won't do it. any time a bull is presented as a show steer, one plants the see that he's a show steer bull, not a breeding bull.
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Offline knabe

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2020, 10:56:05 PM »
Send me 300 then I might bust one-He really doesnt have the apple butt look though neither have any of the progeny Ive seen

the apple butt comes from being homozygous for double muscling, not hetero. this is genetics 101.

there is speculation that if an animal is hetero for double muscling that they might appear slightly thicker and more cut in their muscle.

the owners of the bull these days promoting bulls should provide results on dna defects that are relevant for the breed.

it's not like its still the 50's and the angus folks just began hiding defects until 5 years ago.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2020, 10:57:49 PM by knabe »
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Offline knabe

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2020, 11:00:26 PM »
lets see your long yearling yearling bulls I DOUBT ANY  OF YOU HAVE ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY CLOSE TO A YOUNG BULL LIKE THAT LETS SEE YOURS


if you knew where to look, you could find one.


all cap letters is defensive.
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Offline mark tenenbaum

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Re: JIT AND WERNICKE STRIKE AGAIN
« Reply #14 on: May 24, 2020, 07:23:21 AM »


 The Strathore bull  is what an apple butt appears like to me I bet he was myostatic-yuck yuck  Belgian Blues look sorta like that too I could care less about the specific scientific terminologies -And why should I look to find a picture of another Shorthorn  bull somewhere like this one ? Like there is some great mystery bull out there I dont know about-Must be at the next No-Bull sale or the big one coming up in indiana-THATS WHERE THE SOLUTIONS LIE (LYE ?)Hes thick-hes been clipped,hes standing in a lot - whats that got to do with the whole Laughtner type steer jock  deal? -Hes the same  type of bull  he was last December at the Canadian expo whatever? I showed a picture of a long yearling who must be considered useful-because people are trying him just the facts mam-Why should I  try and  research your cattle,the Ex Lax, and the other dairy influence cattle  to support the fact you may have a young Shorthorn bull like this because NONE of you do that I have seen -unless you can prove otherwise I looked and looked: and found  this one He was tied at a show  from last December - He"s  the nearest young bull in type that is similar to the one pictured in the thread  O0
« Last Edit: May 25, 2020, 01:24:16 PM by mark tenenbaum »

 

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