Shorthorn Cow Pedigree...Your Thoughts?

OKshorthorn · Jul 12, 2012

We purchased this old girl a long time ago from a member of this board. She was our best cow, hands down. We flushed her 3 times and have embryos put in cooking as we speak. I wanted to get you guys/gals opinion of her pedigree X the 3 bulls we flushed her with and which mating you would be most excited about. Keep in mind we flushed her when she was 13 and lost her shortly after that, we also were not as in tune with genetics at the time we chose the bulls as this was a few years ago and I have learned so much about the breed and pedigrees in that time frame. So be easy on picking our choices apart!!

JM Vortec
DF Tuscaloosa
Jakes Proud Jazz

MA1025 CALBERTA CAPTAIN 32
*MA14823 RHR SNOWBALL 04U
MA90080 HANDYS MISS PARIS

Sire: *sxAR25495 KA'BA COWBOY

3744349 PHA-F TH-F LEN RU T A LEADER
3854680 KA'BA RUBY 87L
3702459 KA'BA RUBY 79 S L

3744349 PHA-F TH-F LEN RU T A LEADER
3854677 KA'BA KEYSTONE
3754033 KA'BA GLDN VICTORIA 82 SL

Dam: sx3902024 CV GLDN LISA KEYSTONE 92

3781884 M&S GOLDEN IMAGE
3818243 CV GOLDEN LISA
x3784739 3F MISS LISA 3J

Doc · Jul 12, 2012

I think it's a pretty good pedigree. It's what I call a Oklahoma , north Texas steer jock pedigree. When you stack TA Leader, Leggs and the Peppermint cow family you should be ok. As far as the bulls go that you flushed her to. I think the Vortec could and should work , the Tuscaloosa could give you some females and of course on the JPJ , I wouldn't pay for the freeze cost on them. But that's just me , I wouldn't use JPJ on anything ( I hope she was a big cow for those, but based on the pedigree I wouldn't think so).
Which ones do you have coming?

kfacres · Jul 12, 2012

The Snowball bull, I hear was the stud of the farm, and produced all the great Ka'ba cattle. He was the solid white Maine bull. My old buddy knows quite about that Snowball deal—said that he sired all the good ones, regardless what they were papered out of- Garris traveled out there a time or two- call him if you want more exact details. The Cowboy deal was a Carl Venable deal—I’d find him on Facebook and ask away, was very good to him. Keyestone was his money bull though, I think. Matter of fact, the Golden Image bull was also a Venable deal.

There is a 2 year old son of Golden Image at my buddies right now. Been getting some really good stout calves from him from first calf heifers… funky colored orange spotted bull. The only complaint about him, is I don’t think those cattle will be thick enough for today’s world. The offspring of the Gold Image bull are thick enough- but they’re too straight. Here’s the Reg of that bull x4173618

I’d find Carl and ask away; pretty sure he owned all three of those bulls.

Interesting to why you choose those three bulls to flush with.. If it were me—they are three completely different kinds of bulls, and I wouldn’t expect any of them to breed or produce calves that look like one another, even though they will be half siblings. I’d say you wanted to hedge your bets- and wanted to see what you’d get-- otherwise, you could have been a little more consistent on your breeding choices if you had a distinct goal in mind. Don’t know what the cow is made like—but if she’s big bodied, moderate, and really deep=-- the Vortec’s will stand out from the crowd.

OKshorthorn · Jul 12, 2012

Doc, our thinking for using JPJ was simple, although maybe not necessarily the most sound idea ever! JPJ is huge around here, a lot of people have had success with him in the show ring, and I personally don't have any problems with him. I think he does what he does really well. Anyway, we figured the resulting offspring with that cow and JPJ would produce a smaller framed, stocky calf, we also figured we would put those embryos in most of our replacement heifers (surprisingly good conception rates for the empryos we put in) and not have to worry about BW or the heifers struggling with having the calf. So far so good in that department. We had a bull calf last fall from that mating, I have put pics of him on here before, from a heifer that had him no problem. We figured that we would have a much more marketable calf on the ground from the embryo pairing of that cow and JPJ than breeding the heifers to a heifer bull.

Jody, Carl is who we bought this cow from. He definitely knows his stuff. You are right in that we were not trying to breed her with like type bulls. When we got out of college and had a little money to spend and get back into this deal several years ago we looked at this cow to give us a couple heifers that we can build around, along with purchasing some genetics (really looking forward to putting in those Lily embryos this fall Doc, when will you have some on the ground from that mating?.) So we did our best to do basically exactly what you said, hedge our bets. I am hoping the offspring are completely different, she was a pretty good ole cow and I am hoping for some females next spring to keep from her.

I've put a pic of her on here before, but its been awhile. Since you were wondering Jody, ill put it on here.

kfacres · Jul 12, 2012

Redwine Cattle said:
Doc, our thinking for using JPJ was simple, although maybe not necessarily the most sound idea ever! JPJ is huge around here, a lot of people have had success with him in the show ring, and I personally don't have any problems with him. I think he does what he does really well. Anyway, we figured the resulting offspring with that cow and JPJ would produce a smaller framed, stocky calf, we also figured we would put those embryos in most of our replacement heifers (surprisingly good conception rates for the empryos we put in) and not have to worry about BW or the heifers struggling with having the calf. So far so good in that department. We had a bull calf last fall from that mating, I have put pics of him on here before, from a heifer that had him no problem. We figured that we would have a much more marketable calf on the ground from the embryo pairing of that cow and JPJ than breeding the heifers to a heifer bull.

Jody, Carl is who we bought this cow from. He definitely knows his stuff. You are right in that we were not trying to breed her with like type bulls. When we got out of college and had a little money to spend and get back into this deal several years ago we looked at this cow to give us a couple heifers that we can build around, along with purchasing some genetics (really looking forward to putting in those Lily embryos this fall Doc, when will you have some on the ground from that mating?.) So we did our best to do basically exactly what you said, hedge our bets. I am hoping the offspring are completely different, she was a pretty good ole cow and I am hoping for some females next spring to keep from her.

I've put a pic of her on here before, but its been awhile. Since you were wondering Jody, ill put it on here.

duh.. I saw the CV-- but it never clicked...

Doc · Jul 12, 2012

Redwine Cattle said:
Doc, our thinking for using JPJ was simple, although maybe not necessarily the most sound idea ever! JPJ is huge around here, a lot of people have had success with him in the show ring, and I personally don't have any problems with him. I think he does what he does really well. Anyway, we figured the resulting offspring with that cow and JPJ would produce a smaller framed, stocky calf, we also figured we would put those embryos in most of our replacement heifers (surprisingly good conception rates for the empryos we put in) and not have to worry about BW or the heifers struggling with having the calf. So far so good in that department. We had a bull calf last fall from that mating, I have put pics of him on here before, from a heifer that had him no problem. We figured that we would have a much more marketable calf on the ground from the embryo pairing of that cow and JPJ than breeding the heifers to a heifer bull.

Jody, Carl is who we bought this cow from. He definitely knows his stuff. You are right in that we were not trying to breed her with like type bulls. When we got out of college and had a little money to spend and get back into this deal several years ago we looked at this cow to give us a couple heifers that we can build around, along with purchasing some genetics (really looking forward to putting in those Lily embryos this fall Doc, when will you have some on the ground from that mating?.) So we did our best to do basically exactly what you said, hedge our bets. I am hoping the offspring are completely different, she was a pretty good ole cow and I am hoping for some females next spring to keep from her.

I've put a pic of her on here before, but its been awhile. Since you were wondering Jody, ill put it on here.

I understand your reasoning on breeding her to JPJ. Just like I've always said , raise what you can sell and what will make you money. I saw a JPJ steer that won his class at our state 4-H expo on Tuesday, he won his weight class and was big for a JPJ. I don't know how old he was , but he weighed 1310. Didn't understand it either because he was out of a cow I sold who was a dtr of JJ Denim , that wasn't a big cow. Denim was a full Irish bull by Improver 57th that I owned with Dr Freed. It doesn't change the fact I personally don't like JPJ. But once again , to each his own.
On the Lily eggs, I won't have my 1st ones until next spring. We kept selling so many that I couldn't put any in, until I finally kept 3 back and said I was going to put them in even if it hairlipped the Pope. I know Sharben Shorthorns have some coming this fall and then several people have some coming next spring. We bred Lily to calve to Primo next spring. Good Luck with yours.

mark tenenbaum · Jul 12, 2012

Double Vision-or 1 of the FREE FOR ALLS-on her offspring

knabe · Jul 13, 2012

Doc-sun should know something about the snowball bull. I would call him.

shortdawg · Jul 14, 2012

Redwine Cattle said:
Doc, our thinking for using JPJ was simple, although maybe not necessarily the most sound idea ever! JPJ is huge around here, a lot of people have had success with him in the show ring, and I personally don't have any problems with him. I think he does what he does really well. Anyway, we figured the resulting offspring with that cow and JPJ would produce a smaller framed, stocky calf, we also figured we would put those embryos in most of our replacement heifers (surprisingly good conception rates for the empryos we put in) and not have to worry about BW or the heifers struggling with having the calf. So far so good in that department. We had a bull calf last fall from that mating, I have put pics of him on here before, from a heifer that had him no problem. We figured that we would have a much more marketable calf on the ground from the embryo pairing of that cow and JPJ than breeding the heifers to a heifer bull.

Jody, Carl is who we bought this cow from. He definitely knows his stuff. You are right in that we were not trying to breed her with like type bulls. When we got out of college and had a little money to spend and get back into this deal several years ago we looked at this cow to give us a couple heifers that we can build around, along with purchasing some genetics (really looking forward to putting in those Lily embryos this fall Doc, when will you have some on the ground from that mating?.) So we did our best to do basically exactly what you said, hedge our bets. I am hoping the offspring are completely different, she was a pretty good ole cow and I am hoping for some females next spring to keep from her.

I've put a pic of her on here before, but its been awhile. Since you were wondering Jody, ill put it on here.

The part of the country you live in JPJ would definitely pay the bills. There are those that like him and there are those that don't but he has done a great job for me. On the right cow he can produce some great ones. I like what you said - what he does, he does really well. Just knowing what to breed him to is the key. He's the only shorthorn bull that I have used that has produced steers that will compete for us.

Shorthorn Cow Pedigree...Your Thoughts?

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