Showmaxx vs. Supermix (Optaflexx)

This is our first year and we are 25 days out from show. The feedback on our steer is that he looks great (really fat) just needs some pop in his butt.  We have been advised that Showmaxx is the best out there right now and will do the trick and also have been told to go with Supermix.  So is there anyone on here that has used both that can tell me which is better?  I did research the labels on both and found that the active ingredient is different for each.  I guess I am looking for insight on which of the active ingredients is going to get the best results.  Any input is greatly appreciated.  I gotta purchase one or the other tomorrow.  Oh  yeah, and is Supermix the same thing as Optaflexx?

Showmaxx is probably the "strongest" muscle supplement.  Showflexx contains Optaflex and is marketed by Sullivans, and it is not the same thing (ingredient) as Showmaxx.

I would use Showmaxx and nothing else with it.

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chambero said:

Showmaxx is probably the "strongest" muscle supplement.  Showflexx contains Optaflex and is marketed by Sullivans, and it is not the same thing (ingredient) as Showmaxx.

I would use Showmaxx and nothing else with it.

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OK...looks like Showmaxx is getting great reviews.  When you say feed Showmaxx and nothing else...do you mean feed that as the sole ration or add it to his base feed with no other supplement?

No other muscle supplements.  Some people try to use more than one thing and I believe that is counterproductive.  Zilmax is STRONG stuff.

So those of you that have used Showmaxx, do you get better results then the Revalor S implant and optaflexx together?

Given the fact that showmaxx just hit the market a few months back I wouldnt think anyone has had time to figure something like this out but I can tell you that the differences between showflex and showmaxx aren't even close.  Showmaxx will out perform easily and would prolly be asking for trouble if mixed with a strong implant.  If the showflex/implant combo has worked for you in the past I would stick with what you have confidence in..

Folks with close ties and access to feedlots have been using Zilmax for a few years now.  I'm not 100% sure of their routine, but I think they use the implants as normal and then hit them with Zilmax at the end.  Whether or not they are putting in fresh implants with the Zilmax I don't know.

Zilmax is just economically efficient to get a hold of with the Showmax product.  Always before you had to get it from someone that got Zilmax in bulk at a feedlot.  Very very expensive.

I didn't use it this year due to structure and temperment issues to begin with, but I know that Zilmax is "better" than the Optaflexx.

you mentioned structure and temp. problems, does zilmax exacerbate these problems or did you just decide it wasn't worth it on that/those calves?  Do you find that it truly adds significant muscle or just cuts some fat off?  Does anyone know how it affects marbling?  sorry to hijack the post y'all

Very good questions and very good points.  Zilmax is a superior beta agonist than optaflexx.  It does deliver more lbs. both on the hoof and rail, greater hot yields, less yield grade 3 and 4's, but does lower the grade.  Optaflexx is a beta agonist 1 while zilmax is a beta agonist 2.  Even though they are both beta agonist, the work different at different levels.  Like cousins.  Beta agonist turn energy into muscle.  Muscle weighs more than fat so hence the hot yields.  More muscle mean increase rib eye size.  More size same marbling means less grade.  I have seen zilmax actally put a butt on a Holstein.  The amount of round developed was plain to see to the eye.  At the feedyard, beta agonist are used in conjunction with implants.  Beta agonist are feed forabout  only 20-30 days.  It take 60 days for an implant to pay for itself.  So no fresh implants are used the last weeks prior to harvest.  Beta agonist do stress the joints.  It takes fluid away from joints rather fast.  Animals have to be sound or one can have an animal cripple rather quickly.  I have not seen a temperament problem with optaflexx at all.  I have seen it on many animals on zilmax.  I would be careful on that.  My 2 greatest concerns.  There is no drug withdraw on optaflexx.  There is a strict 2 day withdraw on zilmax.  Feedyards do need to have prior drug approval before they can use zilmax.  They have to be able to prove there is going to be no cross contamination with other feeds made at the same mill or trucks used.  They also need to show how cattle will not be co mingled so proper withdrawls can be monitored per pen.  Does the show industry have a way to monitor this.  Most important is the packer.  There is some packers that will not buy or will segregate cattle on zilamax.  China and/or Taiwan and the European Union have ban the sale of beef with zilmax.  Just a month ago Taiwan found US beef with zilmax and rejected the shipment.  Domestically, some customer do not want cattle fed zilmax.  With the increase muscling, muscle fibers will get thicker and elongated.  This has caused the beef to be a bit tougher.  My concern would be that when show steers enter the food chain, will proper withdraw times be observed?  Will show industry be honest to the packer and declare the cattle that have been fed zilmax?  The beef industry has a great job ahead feeding the world.  Currently we have the lowest cattle on feed since 1952.  At the same time we are feeding a growing population.  I believe there is room in the industry to use beta agonist.  We have to educate and convince a sector in the industry about beef fed these products.  Until then we have to think we are all in it together.  We have to work to have all markets allow us the use of these products.  Until then, we have to respect their views and segregate the beef from them.

Need to clear up some innaccurate info. in the last post.

1. Zilmax (active ingrediant in SHOWMAXX) has a three day slaughter withdrawal
2. You can visit Zilmax manufacturers website,  (http://www.intervetusa.com/products/Zilmax/overview.aspx) and review multiple feedlot trial research to understand what the product does and how it compares to Optaflexx.  In a large scale head to head trial, Zilmax had 21 lbs more carcass weight.  And there was no difference in tenderness.
And you can also review the FDA approved label.  There is no animal safety warnings about joint problems.
3. The Taiwan residue issue was actually with Optaflexx not Zilmax.  You can find multiple website articles on this.  The Taiwanese found trace amounts of Optaflexx active ingredient (1-2 ppb) in some U.S. imported meat.  Of absolutely no concern to human safety
4. Western Europe bans all U.S. beef that has benefited from implants or from beta agonists.  It's a protectionist trade issue.  The result is European consumers pay almost twice as much for their food compared to U.S.. 
5.  Zilmax use is growing rapidly (feedlots and packers), as cattle feeders have gained experience in management to maximize the production efficiency of the product, while delivering consumers the same quality beef eating experience as from non supplemented animals. 
6.  Judicious use of implants and beta agonists in beef production allow the U.S. to meet growing U.S. and global demand, while conserving resources of land, feed, water, animals needed for food and energy needed to produce food.

Southwest.. I really don't understand your concern with the withdraw of Zilmax.. There are a a lot of meds that have a lot longer withdraw periods than Zilmax.  Do you have the same concern with them as well and how well they are monitored?  With only a two day withdraw I would tend to think the amount of residue from the time the steers are moved up for kill would be of less concern.  I have a tendecncy to believe that withdraws are probaly a little shorter than marked on meds just to be on the safe side anyway...In the show world residue from Zilmax would be no concern for me at all because the kids steers aren't gonna go thru the sell or be put on the truck and  killed within two days anyway.

I think he is worried about not observing the withdrawal period, not that it has one.  It is a sad truth that most people in the show industry do not observe withdrawals, they just do whatever is necessary to win, withdrawal periods be danged

We have to observe withdrawals in TX - we get tested at shows.  A two day withdrawal means you leave the Zilmax at home when you head to the show.  Our terminal shows are essentially a week long.

EatBeef, glad you chimed in.  You sound very versed in the use of the product.  I wished you would have chimed in earlier so my post was not necessary.  I spoke of my observations and use on both my family's show cattle and in the feedyard I manage.  I am in no way endorsing one over the other.  I do speak to the packer on a daily basis and visit the plant personally on a quarterly basis to get my own opinion.  I hope everyone takes it as is.  I know there are withdraws on everything.  I know of the local packer not wanting to buy from local fair cause of crazy residue issues.  Thing like that make me quiver with a feed additive and hope all observe proper withdraw time.  The packer will not buy any beef fed zilmax.  It is too hard to keep them cattle segrated.  I still would like for EatBeef to tell me why I had to get trained and approved by Intervet/Schering-Plough for the use of zilmax but sell it over the counter with no questions ask to anyone in the show industry.  I personally participated in the taste test experience sponsored by the Intervet/shering and could tell the difference in tenderness as all that participated.  As I stated, I believe there is a place for it in the industry.  The beef industry has been using this product for a couple of years.  I rather be forth coming about the challenges we have faced.  I wish people will understand them and help our industry grow by being truthful in its use. 

OK....question from the newbie here....because the Zilmax affects the joints (I believe one post said it causes less fluid??? correct me if I don't have that right) can you feed some sort of glucosamine additive (or fluid flexx?? not sure if I have that right either)  to supplement and maybe counteract this particular side effect?  Also, I saw mention of it affecting the "tempurment"....what exactly does that mean?  Sorry if these questions come across as elementary, but this is our very first year (and possibly our last) and we are not having a lot of luck with help from the local guys.  I am sincerely grateful for the replies and the immense amount of input and information that has been given.  It really is a Godsend!!

I know we are getting of topic of original post here but to back up what Chambero said at our county level show here in Texas the Grand, Resever and random drug testing is performed on all species that can be tested via urine..

chambero said:

We have to observe withdrawals in TX - we get tested at shows.  A two day withdrawal means you leave the Zilmax at home when you head to the show.  Our terminal shows are essentially a week long.

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showmom37 said:

OK....question from the newbie here....because the Zilmax affects the joints (I believe one post said it causes less fluid??? correct me if I don't have that right) can you feed some sort of glucosamine additive (or fluid flexx?? not sure if I have that right either)  to supplement and maybe counteract this particular side effect?  Also, I saw mention of it affecting the "tempurment"....what exactly does that mean?  Sorry if these questions come across as elementary, but this is our very first year (and possibly our last) and we are not having a lot of luck with help from the local guys.  I am sincerely grateful for the replies and the immense amount of input and information that has been given.  It really is a Godsend!!

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You can legally feed glucosamine supplements to cattle at Texas terminal steer shows.  I don't know how much it works, but it might.  We used it extensively one year on one that got hurt under vet supervision and it helped him.

Implants in particular make steers think and act like they are bulls - hence it can make one a little ornery - especially if they are already turned that way.  I do not know if Zilmax additives do that or not, but wouldn't be surprised if they did.  I couldn't tell you if Optaflexx hurts attitude or not, we always use Optaflexx and implants together and I know the implants affect it.

rackranch said:

Southwest.. I really don't understand your concern with the withdraw of Zilmax.. There are a a lot of meds that have a lot longer withdraw periods than Zilmax.  Do you have the same concern with them as well and how well they are monitored?  With only a two day withdraw I would tend to think the amount of residue from the time the steers are moved up for kill would be of less concern.  I have a tendecncy to believe that withdraws are probaly a little shorter than marked on meds just to be on the safe side anyway...In the show world residue from Zilmax would be no concern for me at all because the kids steers aren't gonna go thru the sell or be put on the truck and  killed within two days anyway.

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Not trying to stir the pot and was trying not to post on this again BUT if you own or run a feedlot like Southwest does you would be concerned about the withdraw dates too. After the FDA got done with their fines and making it public knowledge you had cattle test positive for zilmax you would be out of business if you owned the lot or fired if you worked for the lot. Alot of feedyards around here have moved away from zilmax and started using optiflex because optiflex doesn't have any withdraw date and is cheaper. The JBS feedyard here puts the floor on one of the county fairs here and feeds those cattle out another 30 days just to be sure all withdraws are ok.

We have done trials on both zilmax and optiflex and the zilmax will put more muscle on than optiflex but will lower the quality grade.
Beta agonists can cause an increase in respiratory rates, can cause bloats and should be used on structurally correct cattle.