Advice on who to breed to

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maverick

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Feb 24, 2008
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Western Colorado
We have a commercial herd of Angus cross cows, we are trying to produce some winning steers for are two sons to show at our country fair. We have kept some heifers the last few years out of an Ice Pick/Draft pick bull (I had him tested and he is pha free).  For the most part all of our cattle have a nice profile, they need thicker tops and thicker and more muscle in their lower quarter.  I would like to breed some for heifer replacement and other only for terminal cattle. We purchased a New Era bull from Bushy Parks Sale that I will also be using.  Some bulls I was considering are:

Gigolo Joe (I saw some heifers and a bull at the NWSS in January and was impressed.)
Hard Drive
Total package
White Chocolate
Almost Famous
Carnac
Some Sires I would like some more information or opinions
Blue Blood or Hired Man (I thought they may add the thickness to the lower quarter)
Hired Man
Tinman
Orange Crush (I was impressed with him at the NWSS)

Sorry about the long list, any input would be appreciated!!!
 

knabe

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Hollister, CA
i haven't seen any steers out of total package.  he may have too much growth in him for show steer.  he throws thick tops, but a lower quarter may be an issue?  have you thought about tyson?  this is an intersting collection.  why total package and gigolo joe?  you said you were impressed with gigolo joes heifers and bulls, have you seen any steers.  not knocking either bull, but they are a PB bent, while the others are mostly not?
 

maverick

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Western Colorado
I picked Gigolo Joe, Hard Drive and Total Package for possible heifer replacements – I liked their WW and milk EPDs. Total Package also looks like he is going to add tenderness and feed efficiency to his offspring.  If I bred them to the Maine cows I have they would be ¾ a Maine. Maybe I would get lucky and get some nice steers.  I have not seen any steers out of Gigolo Joe but the bull I saw at Denver had a nice front end.  I have not considered Tyson but he definitely looks like a strong possibility.  I have two straws of Ali left; I can not decide what to do with them.  I have one nice cow that I flushed to Ali last year; she is out of a bull named Full Boar. Does any one know anything about this bull? The other bulls I picked to produce a show prospects for my boys.
 

knabe

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sell the two straws of ali and buy your complete list.  and if you really want an ali daughter, just buy one you like rather than trying to create one you like for a variety of reasons.

seems like full boar is crossed on cunia based or black gold cows at MCF

MCF MISS FULL BOAR 152J  267744 is a semi interesting one.  she's smithbuilt times angus on the bottom.  there's a couple to crossbreds there as well.  he's polled and 50% maine. 

and here's one for telos

MCF MISS FULL BOAR 4WDN  330379
 

maverick

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Knabe,

Thanks for all of your input. Have you seen any Tyson steers? Does Tyson add thickness to the top and lower quarter?   Do you have any suggestions on what bull to breed the Full boar cow to, I am hoping for show steers.  My son showed a steer out of her and our Ice Pick bull last year, he still needed a little more finish at show time. I can not remember the proper show term, but he also was too high in the flank. Below in a picture of him: 
 

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afhm

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parts unknown
The jury is still out on White Chocolate as this spring is his 1st crop.  Carnac has structure issues, but will pretty and hair them up, but might not add the thickness you want.  Almost Famous won't add any thickness, but they will be hairy, hairy.  Blueblood and Hired Man don't do much for me.  Blue Blood is weak in his top, but that could be to his being so long sided.  Hired Man and shoulder issues.  The other bulls you mentioned are worth trying, 2 of them are rookies so we don't know what to expect.  For raising steers it is hard not to go with Heat Wave or one of his clones.  The Get It Done bulls looks like he would add the thickness you desire, I haven't seen enough of them to know for sure yet.  Friction and Paddy O'Malley would work as well.
 

Jill

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Full Boar is a bull out of Jolt, both of these bulls have been great producers for Mid Continent Farms.  I agree with Knabe, sell the Ali and buy your list.

I guess if you're breeding for teminal cattle, I don't think you can beat Heat Wave.   I have heard good reports on Sunseeker, Almost Famous and Carnac have had some nice ones out there.  We went through a phase where we tried every new bull out there and I can tell you from experience that you will make more money and have more success in the long run if you stick with the bulls that have a track record.

I like Gigolo Joe and we will be using him, not really sold on Total Package, don't see anything else even remotely maternal on the list.
 

maverick

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Western Colorado
I am going to try again with the picture - does anyone know how I can delete the first picture I Posted? Jill thanks for the imput - unless I come up with a better idea I will fush the Full Boar cow to Heatwave.  We show at a small county fair and I was wondering if you think people would hesitate to buy a steer to eat out of a clone?
What do you think of Golden Child, I have read that the birth weight can be high. afhm - thanks for your information especially on Blue Blood and Hired Man.
 

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Jill

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maverick said:
Gigolo Joe (I saw some heifers and a bull at the NWSS in January and was impressed.)
Hard Drive
Total package
White Chocolate-82
Almost Famous-84
Carnac
Some Sires I would like some more information or opinions
Blue Blood or Hired Man (I thought they may add the thickness to the lower quarter)
Hired Man-87
Tinman
Orange Crush (I was impressed with him at the NWSS)
Heat Wave-92
Clone-89
Tyson-87
Golden Child-85
Sorry about the long list, any input would be appreciated!!!

I listed the birthweights, they are pretty much consistant, most any of the clubby bulls will give you calving issues simply by design, not so much the birth weight, we have not had calving issues with Heat Wave, but most of the calves we have out of him are from 100-110. 
Most of the buyers at our auction don't actually take the meat they are buying the project and the floor buyer takes the steer.  I don't think 95% of the kids in our county would be able to tell you the breeding on the steer they show, a clone shouldn't be an issue, our floor buyers walk through and puts a floor on the steer from visual inspection, they don't ask any questions about breeding, may not work that way everywhere.  Don't really have information on Golden Child, I would call Greg Stewart and ask what his opinion would be on the Full Boar, he should be able to tell you what clicks with that bull.
 

CAB

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http://www.goldrushshowcattle.com/

  This is a Simi/Angus bull that I think may be good enough to consider trying. I think that there seems to be almost too much hype over Star Power. No one even has calves out of him yet and of coarse he is a purebred SM. Some of the hype comes from Steel Force, 3/4 sib to star Power. Star Power has a full blood sib named SVF Starbucks S801, Go take a peek @ him. There is also a pic of Star Power B4 Sinclair's bought into him, page 176 of the April 2007 issue of the Show Circuit.
 

red

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Pohlman's no longer own Salutation. They are coming out w/ a new bull. Photos will be available soon.

Red
 

CAB

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  I'm sorry the post that I put up above for the Dreamline bull was supose to go in the best Simi/Angus bull topic. Brent
 

maverick

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Western Colorado
Thanks to everyone for all of your advice. I will use Heatwave on the cow  I am going to flush. I would like to pick out about ten more cows to bread to Heatwave I,  Sunseeker or maybe Golden Child for show prospects.  I am concered abourt getting a calf that is too big.  Our cows calve  in the trees in a pasture, we both work so we can't keep a real close watch on the cows. .  I have a varienty of Angus cross cows to choose from and some 1/2 maine cows. Anyone have a opinion on the frame type of the cow to use on these bulls. The birth weight of calves from these cows ranges from 80-95lbs. Thanks for your Help!
 

Jill

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Our recips are all purebred Angus, Maine and Maintainer, I wouldn't use any of those bulls on ones you have been questionable on in the past, but we haven't had any problems with mature cows on Heat Wave, haven't ever used the other 2.
 
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