Buying older cows

[RankeCattleCo]

A neighboring farm who I have gained a strong relationship with produces club calves and has some PB Shorthorn cows. One of the cows, now 14 years old, raised a Mind That Bird heifer last year who is looking better and better each day, and currently has a Womanizer bull calf on her side who is a stout little buggar. Both are crazy colored as a bonus, and at the minimum that calves would be Shorthorn Plus. This cow again is 14 years old, but has great condition and hind legs that are still in pretty good shape, plus she's THF. Her only problem is her milk. She only milks on 2 quarters and he doesn't want to have to bother supplementing a calf with a bottle and is going to most likely ship her come weaning time. For someone who is just starting up, would it make logical sense to breed her this June then buy her for market price, then supplementing her calf until weaning, and ultimately shipping her. Yes, lots can go wrong. She has has no issues calving clubby bred calves the last 2 years and she is probably a 1600 pounder. Would this idea be worth the effort, or is she better off being retired?

Thank you in advance for your opinions.

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Cow right before calving

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Womanizer calf at 7 days old

Mind That Bird calf at 1 year old (never clipped)

 

[Okotoks]

I am probably more likely than most to keep an older cow around, they would not still be in the herd if they were not great producers! It doesn't always work out but I have always been able to salvage the cow (except once) Years ago my wife went looking for some bloodlines we wanted. She ended up purchasing 3 cows, 2 nine year olds and a fifteen year old. The deal was we had to take all 3 and the seller got their heifer calves back and we were able to breed them. We had the 9 year olds until they were 15 years and the 15 year old until she was 18. One of the 9 year olds was Crowfoot Dottie 9F. Her dam, Diamond Dottie 2nd, had been my first choice when we got our original Diamond cows but we had second choice and took Diamond May 5th. We still have descendants of both these cows in our herd. Dottie 9F was a maternal sister to Crowfoot Flag 6H, the sire of Gafa Mochican. Mohcican being the sire of the Eionmor Mr Gus bulls. 9F also produced Diamond Dottie 22X the grand dam of Diamond Helena Dottie 12H.
I would probaably chance the old girl if you are willing to supplement her calf. My one concern would be her udder, I would want to know at what age it became a problem.

 

[RankeCattleCo]

This is her first year not producing on all 4 quarters. With only a few head, supplementing a bottle per day to get a good calf would not be a problem or inconvenience for us.  Also, we have Lautner's new PB Red, White and Roan bull and we have access to bulls like No Worries, BIM, etc. If you were to keep her, what would you breed her to?

 

[RyanChandler]

If you've got the room and don't want to or don't have the money to invest in a long-term breeding piece, I would definitely take a chance w/ that cow.  Good chance she'll produce enough that you won't have to supplement the calf anyways.  I don't have any clubby suggestion but I would say could handle something pretty stout. 

 

[RankeCattleCo]

XBAR, what do you think of this rookie PB bull out of JPJ X Double Stuff x Diamond Legs. The bull is TH/PHAF

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Anyone else have opinions on the cow or calves?

 

[RyanChandler]

what do you mean, "we have lautner's red, white, and roan bull?"

 

[RankeCattleCo]

We have a few sticks in our tank. Common sense does not prevail here I guess..

 

[Okotoks]

We have a few sticks in our tank. Common sense does not prevail here I guess..

I'm not sure what you mean by that as I was also wondering what you meant by the statement "we have lautner's red, white, and roan bull?" Shorthorns are either red, white , roan or red and white not all four at once. If you are referring to the bull you attached photos for he is a roan! I'm not a clubby guy but Launtners have quite a few bulls so I have no idea what bull you are referring to.

 

[Shorthorns4us]

I would say that if you can get her bought right in the current cow market environment in your area-- She looks like she has at least one maybe two more seasons in her.  I wouldn't get upset about the 2 quarters in the udder-- she will probably do ok with them-- but then for me, going into a deal with a cow that is down 2 quarters makes her time as temporary at my farm-- that old adage of  " if I can get just one more calf out of her.....".

Actually looking at her picture-- I would use a black angus or a red angus on her to see what she will do.  You could get a really awesome calf. 

EF

 

[CJB]

We have a few sticks in our tank. Common sense does not prevail here I guess..

I'm not sure what you mean by that as I was also wondering what you meant by the statement "we have lautner's red, white, and roan bull?" Shorthorns are either red, white , roan or red and white not all four at once. If you are referring to the bull you attached photos for he is a roan! I'm not a clubby guy but Launtners have quite a few bulls so I have no idea what bull you are referring to.

Lautner's have a bull named Red, White and Roan.  Here's a link.  http://www.mattlautnercattle.com/red-white-roan/

 

[Okotoks]

We have a few sticks in our tank. Common sense does not prevail here I guess..

I'm not sure what you mean by that as I was also wondering what you meant by the statement "we have lautner's red, white, and roan bull?" Shorthorns are either red, white , roan or red and white not all four at once. If you are referring to the bull you attached photos for he is a roan! I'm not a clubby guy but Launtners have quite a few bulls so I have no idea what bull you are referring to.

Lautner's have a bull named Red, White and Roan.  Here's a link.  http://www.mattlautnercattle.com/red-white-roan/

Ok then  ;D makes perfect sense then, my bad (dog)
I would think the old girl is worth the risk !

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Thank you for the opinions. Okotoks do you have any experience crossing your shorthorns with clubby bulls for composite calves?

 

[Okotoks]

Thank you for the opinions. Okotoks do you have any experience crossing your shorthorns with clubby bulls for composite calves?

No I have not crossed ours with Clubby. Friends of ours have had good success with a couple of our cows bred to Master of Puppets. Also Frostback has crossed some of our bloodlines with with Clubby, not sure which worked the best for her.

 

[RyanChandler]

We have a few sticks in our tank. Common sense does not prevail here I guess..

Generally when someone says they have a bull-- it means they own they own him.  I reserved my opinion of the bull because, being the little punk kid you are- I figured you get enough abuse elsewhere, I didn't wanna hurt your feelings. But now that I know you're a hard ass, I think that bull is average at best. When comparing the two photos above, you notice the aspect ratio has been altered on the advertised photo to make the bull appear stouter / more compact.  The downside to this approach is that it will also make one appear shorter spined. 

Over that cow, a clubby bred Char bull is what I'd be leaning towards-

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Thanks. May go back with Mind That Bird on her to get a full sib to the crazy roan pictured above. Otherwise I figure you can't go wrong with Monopoly...

 

[RankeCattleCo]

Over that cow, a clubby bred Char bull is what I'd be leaning towards-

Are you familiar with Chopping Wood? Would he work?

 

[RyanChandler]

My concern w/ using a char cross bull w/ dark pigment would be that he wouldn't throw the diluter as often as I'd like- 

His half brother: Steam roller might be a better option.  He's not a carrier either

The Maine Man bull looks like a pretty good choice as well.  Notice I say "look" as in from the pictures as I've never seen any of these bulls nor any of their offspring.