Cathy, we used him this summer all on virgin heifers that are deeper, dirtier fronted looking. Saw some this last spring out of 1st calf heifers. They were smaller and pretty, but maybe could use some more grow. Think that he might work like Ali, but it's too early tell for sure. I heard comments from some that think the calves are very plain also, but I think it's way too early to tell about that. We used some Gig Joe also on virgin heifers. Glad to see that you are up to posting a little Cathy. Sincerely,Brent