Have you ever had calves killed by packs of dogs?

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cowz

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Jan 10, 2007
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Hey Guys!

I really missed all of you!!  I'm sorry I have not been around......It has been a rough couple of weeks around here.  We had a nasty winter storm that dumped 2 1/2 feet of WET snow....lost calves....no electricity......YUCK!      I'm even more bummed because my kitchen calf I wrote about a couple of months ago did not make it.

My father is quite up in years and still keeps a small package of cattle around to keep him busy.  A couple of days ago, in broad day light,  a group of labrador retrievers attacked a 4 hour old calf and just ravaged it.  You should see the hole the heifer essentially dug trying to fight these dogs off.  Of course my dad went out on his 4 wheeler and did not have a gun.  The dogs had eaten off the ears and nose, and the calf actually was still alive.  The mamma was exhausted and had laid down next to her calf.  The three dogs where laying down around the cow and calf,  I guess resting up for round 2. 

What an outrage!!  Anybody have this happen to you?
 

knabe

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my uncle lives southeast of wichita near hazelton.  most of the neighbors chain their dogs up at night for this very reason, particularly during calving season as the smell is just too hard to resist.  my two dogs could not get enough of the placenta, even after i threw it away, they smelled and rolled in the ground where the calves were born for a week, then switched to poop like normal and always just before they want in the house for the night.  my uncle had dalmations, totally ferocious, which most people i have met can't believe.  both had their tales yanked from chasing cars.
 

red

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We had sheep when I was in 4-H. A girl was riding her horse down the road w/ her dog. The dog attacked one of the lambs & killed it. The people acted like it was our fault that the dog was tempted by the lamb in it's own field.
Cowz, I'm so sorry for all that you've been through. I was wondering about you when I saw that CO had a record snow fall. Our thoughts & prayers are with you & your entire family.

Red
 

justme

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Missouri
Our neighbor had 2 labs and a heeler attack a cow and a calf.  They killed the calf and ran the cow into a mud hole.  She was stuck in deep and the dogs were on her back attacking her.  He let off one warning shot (the dogs had a collar and he knew they must belong to someone) and they just growled at him.  He shot the 2 labs the heeler got away.  These dogs traveled almost 7 miles to his pasture. He lost cow and calf.  Eventually he found the dogs owners.  They were outraged that he shot the dogs.  COME ON!  they didn't even offer to compensate him for his losses.  They are "big shots" in are community and he was afraid to press the issue.

These people are lucky that it wasn't my cow or calf.  Big shot or not I'd be getting paid!

Sorry about your loss...I'm a dog lover, but I have no use for a dog that bites or kills livestock.
 

farmboy

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ONCE HAD AN EXCELLENT CALF STOLEN :mad: NEVER HAD A DOG KILL CALVES BUT DID HAVE A CHICKEN KILLER.SHOT THAT DOG 2 TIMES AND DRUG HIM UNDER SOME HONEYSUCKLE SO MY UNCLE WOULDN'T KNOW. HE HAS 0 COMMON SENSE AND WOULD MERELY SCOLD THE DOG. THIS DOG ALSO INFLUENCED OTHER DOGS TO KILL.ONE NIGHT HE KILLED 14 CHICKENS...WORTHLESS :mad:MY UNCLE...A CITY SLICKER AS YOU WOULD SAY...ALSO HAS A DOG THAT HATES ME AND I CARRY AN AXE HANDLE TO PROTECT MYSELF...ONCE ATTACKED ME YET THE OLD UNCLE WON'T LET US SHOOT HIM. HE'LL SEE WHEN SOMEBODY SUES HIM
 

knabe

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Hey farmboy.  had the same experience with chickens.  lost two to my very timid kelpie.  took one of the dead chickens, rubbed her all over while i was holding her down and yelling.  kinda like the stupid thing of rubbing a dog's nose in his poop or urine in the house.  a moment of fury.  temple grandin probably wouldn't recommend that.  dog doesn't bother chickens any more, and doesn't give the sneaky look either.  made sure to bring dog around the chickens and to reinforce my growling when she looked at chickens, but it's ok to look at them, etc, but no "stalking" posture, just herding at the most.  my other dog herds them into the barn and away from the garden.  taught them to do that too.  there is a grid of a dog's face with cartoon representation of muzzle length and facial expressions, can't remember if that's the combination.  basically, the more shortened the muzzle and puppylike in appearance, the less the dog will chase, grab kill, eat.  the more wolf like, ie longer snout, the more toward the end of the spectrum they will actually eat the thing they kill.  the timid dog won't grasp a squirrel unless my other dog grasps, shakes, kills and breaks skin.  so when they kill 14 of them, they are not getting the reinforcement of the full stomach to tell them to quit, they are doing it for fun and don't understand what they are doing as there is no boundry reinforcement.  I have a fence with a small gate  in front i leave open.  i taught, reinforced my dogs NEVER to exit, and to bark if anyone even looks inside from anywhere on the property.  yes there are beware dog signs etc. had stuff stolen from the barn, short cut walkers etc, and yes have blanket or whatever it's called insurance for that.  my wife is a stay at home mom and we live near where gangs roam and cut across property, so i'll take a bite lawsuit before i'll take a sorry wife and daughter dead any day.

sorry, post too long as usual
 

shortyjock89

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Cowz- I'm really sorry about your calf...its a horrible thing to have happen. 

Last year I was at a friends house and we heard alot of noise coming from the cow barn which is toward the back end of the property.  So, we grabbed a couple of heavy stick (more like limbs, but you know what I mean).  We got back there and there were 4 dogs attacking a group of calves.  My friend didn't even hesitate.  He jacked one dog straight in the head and it dropped right there.  This is the time in the story where I tell you that my friend is one strong dude.  He wrestles and all that so he's definately buff.  After he smacked that one, I got in on it.  The only dog killed was the first one hit, but we got all of them pretty much knocked out and we knew where they came from so we took them to the guy's place and dumped them on his yard.  We haven't heard anything from the guy so I guess he either doesn't let his dogs run around anymore or they don't come around my friend's place.  It's too bad that some dogs have that instinct to kill so strongly ingrained in them.  Our heeler used to chase cats, but after gettin a scratch or two across the nose, he doesn't bother them anymore. 
 

DL

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cowz - really sorry about your calf
- sounds like the 3 S's were in order

Two stories - have a friend with lots of sheep, working oxen, cows etc  and a few donkeys (sheep guards) - foolish city people with German Shepherd bouthg a home that backed up to  their fence - one day the friend watched as the donkeys went out into the field and "herded" everyone - sheep, lambs, cows, calves and working oxen up to the barn - then went back out to the fence where the dog ( - can't call the dog foolish - but the owners were plenty stupid) was still sitcking his head thru the fence and they tried to stomp him (go donkey!!). The neighbor had the nerve to come over and say something like "your donkey's were trying to kill my dog" and the reply was "and if your dog ever gets into my pasture they will kill your dog"


Story 2 - the guard horse - my front pasture follows the drive with is about 750 feet from the road - and it is divided in half by a singel hot wire - horse on one side - cows/calves on the other (calves go under back and fort h as they please) -  strange dog running loose on the road - horse rounds up all the calves (don't really know how he did it because some were on the other side of the hotwire) and brought them up to the barn (where they stayed) and then went back out to the road -  one night there was this huge comotion and one cow just screaming - drag sorry butt out and all the cows and the horse are facing north (into woods  - horse never faces  north, food is south!) and all the calves were in his pen up by the barn) - I have no idea what it was - didn't see anything but he obvioulsy has a job and does it well. Good horse. Good donkeys!

I have had clients with dairy calves that were maimed by free running dogs - it is an unfortunate case of stupid people and the dog and calf pay the price...

 

JbarL

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s. e. ohio  has a problem with coyotes....not only are they killing stock, but seem to be breeding the local dogs that run loose as well .........the locals have a control program in place......not much help from the DNR....
 

red

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Also another problem is vultures? Not the red headed kind but black vultures. Will kill a calf or attack a down cow.

Red ???
 

showcattlegal

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gallup New Mexico
we haven't had calf killed by dogs in a long time we kinda take care of them when they come on our place ;). One night we had 6 yearlings killed by 3 Doberman pincher's and a pit bull.
 

farmboy

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south webster ohio
knabe said:
Hey farmboy.  had the same experience with chickens.  lost two to my very timid kelpie.  took one of the dead chickens, rubbed her all over while i was holding her down and yelling.  kinda like the stupid thing of rubbing a dog's nose in his poop or urine in the house.  a moment of fury.  temple grandin probably wouldn't recommend that.  dog doesn't bother chickens any more, and doesn't give the sneaky look either.  made sure to bring dog around the chickens and to reinforce my growling when she looked at chickens, but it's ok to look at them, etc, but no "stalking" posture, just herding at the most.  my other dog herds them into the barn and away from the garden.  taught them to do that too.  there is a grid of a dog's face with cartoon representation of muzzle length and facial expressions, can't remember if that's the combination.  basically, the more shortened the muzzle and puppylike in appearance, the less the dog will chase, grab kill, eat.  the more wolf like, ie longer snout, the more toward the end of the spectrum they will actually eat the thing they kill.  the timid dog won't grasp a squirrel unless my other dog grasps, shakes, kills and breaks skin.  so when they kill 14 of them, they are not getting the reinforcement of the full stomach to tell them to quit, they are doing it for fun and don't understand what they are doing as there is no boundry reinforcement.  I have a fence with a small gate  in front i leave open.  i taught, reinforced my dogs NEVER to exit, and to bark if anyone even looks inside from anywhere on the property.  yes there are beware dog signs etc. had stuff stolen from the barn, short cut walkers etc, and yes have blanket or whatever it's called insurance for that.  my wife is a stay at home mom and we live near where gangs roam and cut across property, so i'll take a bite lawsuit before i'll take a sorry wife and daughter dead any day.

sorry, post too long as usual
TOOK CARE OF THAT  ;) BEFORE WE SHOT THE DOG, WE TOOK THE DEAD CHICKEN AND BEAT HIM WITH IT...AND ALSO THE YOUNGER COLLIE.. WHICH WE DIDN'T SHOOT. THAT DOG DON'T EVEN LOOK AT THE BANNY'S NOW :)
 

DL

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Never underestimate the power of a Great Pyrenees to disuade the evil doers (human and animal)  from entering the farm - grew up with them, had them all my life, willl never not have one.....

many years ago my parents were building a house in a remote area and they were living in it while it was being built - there were some shady characters hired by the contractor - my dog was at the house - mother heard a squeaky little voice "help help" there stookd a guy (whose nickname I won't repeat ) flat up against the wall with the Great Pyresees standing on his back legs - front feet just a titch off the ground - nose just a couple of inches from his (precious) crotch - dog never touched him - just growled real low ---- he never came back!  ;D ;D
 

chambero

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Strange dogs that we find in our pastures don't leave.  Hard but necessary for this very reason.

My mom's neighbors have Great Pyrenees.  One old "grandpa" dog loved to come to mom's house to visit (she has a daycare center with kids around all the time).  He also liked my mom's female lab (who wasn't fixed).  We took my mom on vacation with us one year.  My kid sister was home from college at the time and taking care of things.  She called and said mom's lab looked like she was coming in heat.  Mom told her to lock her up in the dog pens.  For some reason my sister decided to lock her in our room.  When she left the house, she didn't shut the front door good.  That old grandpa dog got in the house trying to get to the female lab.  He messed all over that house.  When he couldn't get in, he decided to try to get to her from under the pier and beam house.  The old dog was so big he ripped the water pipes apart trying to crawl under there.  My sister called my mom crying like a baby because of the disastrous mess.  That is my experience with Great Pyrenees.  They are quite determined.
 

sjcattleco

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We too have the Black Vultures... but seem to have a few less every year.. ;) ;)

Rule of thumb around here... If stray/ strange  dog crosses pasture and makes it across well then its his lucky day... If not OH WELL...

We do have alot of coyotes here.. more so than most in Ohio..... Just wanted to tell jbarl that they do not breed with dogs.. If they get that close to a domestic dog they usually eat it. I too once thought that they interbreed but after attending a few extension functions that myth was dispelled... Coydogs are actually coyotes that have lost their fear of humans and start acting more like a wild dog.  I know they can cross breed just that they don't.  
 

knabe

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I have seen one litter from a female half breed coyote mate to a coyote.  popular out here in the early 60's to 70's with the mountain people in CA bay area.  i know that seems weird that there would be mountain people in the CA bay area.  some of these people used to have tigers, panthers etc up in the mountains along highway 9.  they used to have communes out here till the mid 70's and these people loved to mix coyotes and dogs.  lots of dog packs, it was dangerous.  i was in a high school camp once for a month, and twice we fought off a wild dog pack, some with coyote mix,but never the full.  gotta say, the half breeds were VERY beautiful.  kind of a less ferile looking coyote with shorter legs and fuller body and different hair coat with more of a real color instead of the coyote gray.  the one's i saw, pups, only the caretaker could touch them of course.  the mother was almost tame.  you could set down withing 5 feet, but no touching.
 

milkmaid56

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three dogs chased my poor dairy heifer around when she was nine months pregnant and ready to pop.  i was at school and my mom chased them away with a rake...  poor heifer was scared out of her wits!!!  we have a pack of coyotes that walk along the back fence... as long as they dont come up to the cattle we leave them be... but there was one that decided to come up within ten feet of me and the cows... he was shot.  have mountain lions up on our ranch and theyve gotten a couple of cows while they were calving... its a lot harder shooting them though because they camoflage easily!
 

DL

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chambero said:
Strange dogs that we find in our pastures don't leave.  Hard but necessary for this very reason.

My mom's neighbors have Great Pyrenees.  One old "grandpa" dog loved to come to mom's house to visit (she has a daycare center with kids around all the time).  He also liked my mom's female lab (who wasn't fixed).  We took my mom on vacation with us one year.  My kid sister was home from college at the time and taking care of things.  She called and said mom's lab looked like she was coming in heat.  Mom told her to lock her up in the dog pens.  For some reason my sister decided to lock her in our room.  When she left the house, she didn't shut the front door good.  That old grandpa dog got in the house trying to get to the female lab.  He messed all over that house.  When he couldn't get in, he decided to try to get to her from under the pier and beam house.  The old dog was so big he ripped the water pipes apart trying to crawl under there.  My sister called my mom crying like a baby because of the disastrous mess.  That is my experience with Great Pyrenees.  They are quite determined.

hey chambero - another great story - but don't blame the Great Pyrenees - blame the raging testosterone! dl
 

farmboy

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SO GLAD THERE AIN'T MANY BEARS (LESS THAN 80 ) IN OHIO. I COULDN'T IMAGINE LIVING AND HUNTIN' IN THE WOODS WITH BEARS AND COUGARS IN GREAT NUMBERS LIKE OUTWEST. THANK GOD THE ONLY PROBLEM HERE IS A MERE COYOTE OR TWO.SEEN ONE IN THE LAST YEAR ??? WHAT THE HECK. 8) I HERE COYOTES ALL THE TIME BUT JUST SEEN 5 IN 6 YEARS. AS LONG AS THEY DON'T KILL YOUR ANIMALS OR BE MENACERS I DON'T CARE HOW MANY THERE ARE ;)
 

cowz

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milkmaid56 said:
three dogs chased my poor dairy heifer around when she was nine months pregnant and ready to pop.  i was at school and my mom chased them away with a rake...  poor heifer was scared out of her wits!!!  we have a pack of coyotes that walk along the back fence... as long as they dont come up to the cattle we leave them be... but there was one that decided to come up within ten feet of me and the cows... he was shot.  have mountain lions up on our ranch and theyve gotten a couple of cows while they were calving... its a lot harder shooting them though because they camoflage easily!

(welcome)  Welcome to the board, Milkmaid!

Mountain Lions really give me the WILLIES!  This year our kids came home from school with a Div. of Wildlife flyer entitled:  "Living with Mountain Lions". :mad:   Apparantly the family who lives on a nice little "ranchette" next to the school were out on their back porch BBQin when a lion came out of the trees.  They had a poodle and a german shepard.  The shepard was the smart one who hid under the porch!!!   The poodle went after the cat,  poodle got a ride out to the timber in the cats mouth, never to be heard from again!

Periodically, we see "sign" of mountain lions.  It is usually a part of a fawn buried very shallow.....like a snack hidden away for later.   

One of the things I enjoy most in life is being outside on a horse or 4 wheeler checking and studying cows.  Makes me wonder how many times "the lions" have been watching "me".
 
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