I need some help, please

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Joe Boy

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Jan 31, 2007
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Today when I went to feed a heavy bred PB Maine was late for the feeding and a little “stand-off-ish.”  I led them up, as I wanted to move all the pregnant cows and heifers home and move some cows with calves to this pasture and open the gate to the wheat field.  This place is 30 miles from our home place.  I hauled three trailer loads of cows and calves and clean-up bull to the wheat.  When I hauled the Springer cows home, the same cow did not want to move into the trailer.  She was the last to the lot by 15 minutes.  She rode in the front section of the trailer with 4 others.  When we got home, one hour later, as I wanted to be very careful hauling heavy bred cows, she did not want to get off the trailer.  This cow lacks 10 days until she is to calf.  She acted like the flashlights blinded her.  She then staggered.  I let her into a little pen and she stood for a good while.  Then I drove all of them out into the main catch pen and gave them a bale of hay.  She went and stood in the drainage water from a pipe break earlier in the day.  She acted a little better when she walked out with the others.  I have never had a cow to act this way unless the head gate was too tight, or she got too hot.  I have seen sheep act this way with what we called “pregnancy toxemia.”  We would give them a doze of propylene glycol.  I tried to call the vet and could not get anyone, so I would like to have some input fast.  Thanks.
 

shortyjock89

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Disclaimer: I'm not a vet, just beginning to study to be one, but here is what I found.

Your cow seems to be exhibiting some of the symptoms of pregnancy toxemia/ketosis, and the treatment for cattle and sheep is pretty similar.  Propylene Glycol (oral drench), and IV glucose and B vitamins are what is recommended treatment for this.  I've also learned that if the cow is very close to calving, then inducing her would be a wise choice, but I haven't seen the cow. Keep trying to get a hold of your vet, and  DL can give you a little better insight on this than I can..but I did the best I could. 
 

Cowboy

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Joe Boy -- every one knows I am not a vet either -- but having said that - I have seen hundreds of cows over the years do this. Most likely this is one of your better cows, probably a real heavy milker too.

There seems to be two variants to this dillema. One  -- the cow that is getting really close to calving is WAY down in BS frm where she needs to be this time of year -- and the calf (calves??) are taking more out thanshe can put back -- thus a negative energy balance. They will get listless and weak -- some times they will have a hard time walking and always be last to do anything. That is one scenario -- I rather doubt you would let one get like that though.

Second and more common -- that very same cow who is going to be a heavy milker and very maternal will have what equates to Milk Fever in dairy cows. They have a rapidly decreasing calcium level as the udder rapidly starts making colostrum and the blood level are very low.

Treatment  is vey much the same as a dairy cow -- Cal-Dexto and some variants IV will perk them up with the energy the need, as well as the much needed calcium rapidly back into the blood supply. Be advised, SOME cows can get shocky by too fast of an IV drip -- be prepared if you do this by having a bottle of Epinenphrine on hand.

Joe Boy -- there would be no better route than to have a vet look at her if possible -- even though yo umay be the best qualified to do so -- an outside observation is always good. There are several things that can go wrong at this time -- a partially twisted uterus, possibly even a partial DA is not out of the possibility. Obviously -- there is something wrong with te cow or she would look and act normal.

I am betting on Calcium defficiency right at this point -- but there could be other things too.

Sorry if I can't hit every option, but all the signs do point to what we both have talked about  since your post -- I tihnk you and I and the above are all on the same page.

PS -- I for some reason have never used or heard of Mineral Oil being used to help treat these --  that seems to be more of a rumen fix than anything --  but then I am old school.

Good luck Joe Boy -- most likely it is an easy fix being caught early like this!

Terry
:-\
 

DL

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Joe Boy - diagnosing a complicated problem in a cow over the internet is fraught with danger - what you describe could be metabolic, neurological, nutritional, hematopoietic (blood cells), or infectious (and probably others if I thought about it). Milk fever is exceedingly rare in beef cows especially prior to calving.

As I recall you have a vet you like and trust, I would call him, good luck, DL
 

Joe Boy

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I want to thank all of you.

The cow was leaning on the fence t his morning and was raising her back leg up and down.  I still have not been able to contact my vet.  I called  the second one I use a great deal but she is gone for the week-end.  I did get to talk to her partner and he said it was hardware.  I gave her 50cc of penicillin as I was instructed.  I do not think that it is hardware.  I cannot figure why she is staggering.  I have wondered if she ate something on pasture that she has had a reaction to...  This afternoon she is down and cannot get up.  She has no appetite.  I gave her 2 bottles of 50% dextrose and 15 cc's of vitamin B complex.  She weighs 1400 or more.  She has runny eyes with 2 degrees temp....104.  I gave the dextrose in the gut.  I do not have any propylene glycol and went to a neighbor that I gave the last I had to, but they are gone for the week-end.

Thanks again for all the advice.  She is important to me, as she is the first PB heifer I bought from from Jerry Gibson.  Her first daughter calved a month ago with a heifer.  She tested clean on PHA and TH.

Yesterday, her hair on her nose was raised up, like she had had a halter on.... or was scratching herself.

When I left, she tried to call out to me with a little moo....  I think she was thanking me for trying.

Again, THANKS.
 

ZNT

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Joe Boy,

I know nothing about what's going on with your cow, but wanted to let you know that I'm hoping you can get this figured out and have a healthy calf and momma!!

Keep us posted!

*Traci*
 

Show Heifer

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I hope my post finds the cow recovering...but...I have 4 clinics that I deal with.....if I can't get my 1st choice,  I call the second, and so forth down the line. I have never exhausted all 4, but if I did, I would get out the yellow pages! I would call until SOMEONE looked at my cow. I would never "oh darn, looks like I will have to wait till Monday...".
Like DL said, could be a number of things, and again like she said, milk fever is rare in beef cows.....

Keep us posted and wish you and your cow well.

By the way, if you are out of propylene glycol, I have used corn syrup diluted about 1/3 with warm water...supplied quick calories and energy.
 

justme

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Having for large animal vets to choose from must be wonderful!  I can think of only 2 that will travel to our farm. 

Hope your cow and calf are healthy and doing well today!
 

Show Heifer

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Not really....just means that the large animal vets around here are so busy, if I need one NOW, it may take me calling several vets to get one to show up within 2 hours.
Did I mention the one clinic I call is 45 miles away? They charge me $75 for a trip, but they also know when I call, IT IS AN EMERGENCY. I don't call for fickle reasons.
The vets (usually one for each clinic - usually don't like 1 or two at each clinic) also realize that I call them because I need help that isn't "common". And (this is important) when I get the bill, I pay with a smile. (Unless of course they haven't made me happy - which doesn't neccesarily mean the critter lived, and then I discuss it with them.)

Joe Boy - how is the cow doing? Have you treated her?

 

Jill

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You don't realize it, but you ARE very lucky.  If you want a small vet, we have I'm guessing 500 within an hours drive, but our nearest large animal vet is 35 minutes from here and he is the only one in the clinic, he doesn't like doing farm calls and if it is serious enough for him to come out, it probably isn't going to live anyway, the next one we have used is a little over an hour from home.
 

Joe Boy

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I forgot to say that I gave her the calcium, too.

She died early morning Sunday.

The vet who advised me that she had hardware does not normally see such thick breasted cows with thick necks. 

In my dry cow pasture I have kept Crystalix 40% for the cows on dry grass.  I have fed the cows twice a week hay, it is wheat with winter peas mixed.  I also feed them 20% cattle cubes (natural proteen) at a rate of 8 lbs per week for the cows.  I have mineral salt also available with fresh water and tank water.  Recently the winter grass has put out but might not be large enough for them to get much value from it.

The pasture has a large amount of broom weed from the rains last Spring, some older dry grass.  There is 140 acres with between 15-11 cows on it all winter.  No other cows have acted in this manner.  This cow was heavier than most as far as fat is concerned.

I want to thank everyone for their concern and thoughts.

My 85 year old Dad told me, "I saw this in cows a long time ago and it was called mineral deficiency and you might as well drag her to the back forty." 

I personally, have never seen a case just like this. 

Had I known how to perform surgery to try and save the calf I would have when I knew she was not responding.

I did not post her and hope that I will not regret that with another episode.

Thanks again.
 

ZNT

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Joe Boy,

We're really sorry ~ and hope you don't see a repeat!! 

It seems that sometimes, "these things just happen"

ZNT
 

Show Heifer

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Sorry to hear about the loss....but....I would STRONGLY encourage that anytime you have a dead animal for "mysterious" reasouns that you post it. Not only will it answer questions, but if it was your fault you can correct the problem, and if it wasn't your fault, then it will take away your quilt. Sometimes even if they don't find the exact cause, they can eliminate some of the diseases. Hardware would have been easy to diagnosis by posting....
But remember, if your going to raise'em, your going to lose'em.
 

kanshow

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Sorry about your loss but like SH says, get her posted so you know.   

Large animal vets are getting to be rare ...  we are pretty fortunate to have a couple in our area but it seems like when we really need one - they are all busy.   

Milk Fever in beef cows is pretty rare but not unheard of, about 2 years ago - really mild winter - we had 2 of our heavy milking  mostly Simmi cross cows go down with it.  The vet at the time was able to diagnos and treat them.  Then we had another cow go down in the same manner but that vet was not available, so we go to choice number 2, and then 3...  Well third choice could come out and he was not going to treat her for milk fever because "Beef Cattle don't get milk fever."  We explained what the other cows had been like and how they had been treated and finally got him to administer the treatment - she was up and fine... This particular vet is our vet of last choice for a number of reasons..

I guess what I'm saying is that yes your veterinarian is a professional who is trained in this area but they are only human and are not always right - so don't be afraid to question them.         
 
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