milking question

[Part Timer]

I have a strictly business x cigar/foxy lady heifer that calved on 2/9 and has no udder and small teats. The calf seems to be sucking pretty regularly but he also is consistantly trying to steal from another cow. The calf seems to be doing fine and isn't really interested in a bottle. My question is could this heifer still have enough milk without having a udder?

 

[Till-Hill]

One of the major problems with them clubby bred momma's. I would say if he allready stealing your better off to dump the cow and start bottle feeding the calf.

 

[kfacres]

It's not the size of her udder, or teats.. it's how often she refills it when  it gets empty...  If he's stealing... he's hungry... most of the time they are too block headed to take to a bottle.... untill they get "real" hungry... 

Up to you, the calf will prob live on mom, and by stealing from other cows.. it likely won't thrive though... 

i'd ship the cow before her next calving though... 

you cow/ calf might just be like ours.. Some days, *(years) i think our cows just raise the calves as a community affair.. I also don't know that some cows know which calf is their's, and most don't care who's sucking on them...  We have one cow that just seaks out the wimping, skinniest calf on the place, and takes over as it's mother.. She's raised twins every year doing this, even though one isn't hers, and still sucks it's mother..

 

[Bradenh]

i'd ship the cow before her next calving though... 

i agree with that, you dont want to have those sort of mamas. also the ones that let him 'borrow' milk shouldn't be very high on the list either

 

[firesweepranch]

i'd ship the cow before her next calving though... 

i agree with that, you dont want to have those sort of mamas. also the ones that let him 'borrow' milk shouldn't be very high on the list either

Why is that? I would think that having a few cows around that willingly "pick up" slack on poor 1st calf heifers would be a good thing? If the "giver" gets bred back right away and has no other problems why ship her?

 

[base pair]

I have a strictly business x cigar/foxy lady heifer that calved on 2/9 and has no udder and small teats. The calf seems to be sucking pretty regularly but he also is consistantly trying to steal from another cow. The calf seems to be doing fine and isn't really interested in a bottle. My question is could this heifer still have enough milk without having a udder?

There are actually some decent maternal genetics in this heifer - Midas from Cigar and MSD 50 from Strictly Business - although the Pursuit in SB is not a big maternal seller -is this a DJ Foxy Lady? If so again some decent maternal and milk genetics in VHF Prospect.

What is the heifers BCS? If she is think that could be part of your problem

For crying out loud the calf is 2 days old and the heifer calved 2 days ago - give them both a chance - some calves steal for fun, some because they aren't getting enough from their dam - as long as the calf is fine I wouldn't mess with the situation - I certainly wouldn't ship the cow and bottle feed the calf -

I see absolutely nothing wrong with cows that let calves steal - sure does help out when you are raising orphans - sit back and see how things develop

 

[olsun]

If the cow is willing to let a poor starving little bummer suck, what is to say she won't let a fat healthy one suck, or even a yearling heifer? I have seen it happen. Just a thought.

 

[wowcows]

If a baby is only 2-3 days old and already stealing from other cows indicate that the little guy is hungry, period. I can't believe he is already doing it just because he can at that age. With out seeing your heifer and calf and your management program none of us can tell what is going on other than he is hungry but not hungry enough to take a bottle since he is getting enough to survive by stealing. The heifer might be thin or not getting enough to come into her milk if there is any to make there. Supplement her with more feed and see if there is more milk develop is what I would say to try. If it is nutrition the moma is seeking and there is milk under her she will respond to the feed. This is not to say that these are the kind we want to raise though. IMO, everyone should raise their own calf and have enough to do so or get on the bus.

 

[Part Timer]

The heifer is in good condition, she has free choice hay and minerals. I figure either way she is going to be headed to town. I would hate to go straight to bottle feeding. I bought a peach teat nipple today so I will give that a shot. I have a cow due on tues. that lets anybody steal off of her(I swear she is part dairy). So I guess I will see if I can supplement him with a bottle until her calf gets on its feet.

 

[kfacres]

The heifer is in good condition, she has free choice hay and minerals. I figure either way she is going to be headed to town. I would hate to go straight to bottle feeding. I bought a peach teat nipple today so I will give that a shot. I have a cow due on tues. that lets anybody steal off of her(I swear she is part dairy). So I guess I will see if I can supplement him with a bottle until her calf gets on its feet.

perhaps the cow is too fat.. especially as a first timer.. From my experience.. a "TOO" fat one, will milk far less than a "too" skinny, starving one will

 

[CAB]

The thought that I am having as I am reading this is, if the calf is only a couple of days old and especially if this is a 1st calf heifer, she may come into her milk here in a few days. I would have to give her more than 2/3 days B4 I made a decision to sell her. You have quite a bit of expense getting her to this point. JMO

 

[Bradenh]

The heifer is in good condition, she has free choice hay and minerals. I figure either way she is going to be headed to town. I would hate to go straight to bottle feeding. I bought a peach teat nipple today so I will give that a shot. I have a cow due on tues. that lets anybody steal off of her(I swear she is part dairy). So I guess I will see if I can supplement him with a bottle until her calf gets on its feet.

make sure you dont get all the colosterum out of her because that sure wouldnt be good.

 

[chambero]

We calve out around 50 heifers or so a year within a 90 day window.  When you have groups of heifers with babies running around together, its very common for babies to nurse more than one momma.  Some new mommas just aren't "smart" enough to take care of business and aren't possessive enough of their babies to keep them to themselves.  You hardly ever see that on subsequent calves.  I don't know if that's the case in this situation, but something that definitely occurs with 1st calves and has nothing to do with milk quantity.

 

[CCW]

Milk is supply and demand. If her calf is sucking everything but her it's not creating demand therefore the supply isn't developing. Sometimes it takes a couple of days for a cow and especially heifers to start milking good. The reason for this is that the calf sucking sends a message to the cow's brain to make milk. The hormone oxytocin is released when the calf sucks and tells the brain the supply is going away so make more.

 

[advocate]

More than likely its genetics. Heatwaves milk better than strictly business and cigars were typically not world beaters in the milking area either

 

[Part Timer]

The calf is still going strong so he is getting milk from somewhere. He wasn't interested in the bottle again so I guess time will tell.