ok.. wwyd..looking for input

[JoeDirt]

no it isnt a typo. she is 775 @ 16 mos. 10/07.   Wow, I have obviously not been feeding her enough.  I dont think she is small weight because she wont eat. We feed her about 15 #'s of grain per day.
and only give her hay occasionaly.  ( I was told in the begininng, hay was a treat) BUT, I also just had another heiffer weighed that is 11mos old and she weighed 625. We have held her back thinking that  is what makes them look feminine. how much do you think I'm off on her weight ?  I think maybe the person that i've getting "help" from might be off a little. When I told her about the hair regimine we used ( the recipe here w/ vin/ks and inf- she laughed- but when she saw our  O0 she was like  WOW)

So, I need to backup and regroup, re calculate and move forward.  )) thank you all for the help. you're the best. You REALLY have no idea how much you've helped our family getting this litle "operation of ours" going.

P.S. jasper is a "she" (lol)

Give us a picture of your heifer that is 16 months old that is 775 lb  then we can make the right choose for you.

 

[CJC]

You could use Lautner's Highlander http://www.lautnerfarms.com/bullpages/highlander.html

 

[dori36]

Honestly if that is all the bigger she is, I'd probably sell her and get something else.    If you do decide to keep & breed her - get her pelvic measurements and if it is sufficient.. talk to Dori & TJ about going Lowline

I threw out the Lowline possibility in my first post.

 

[jasper]

well first thing first.. NO HEATWAVE for us. THANK YOU.. I certainly dont want her to die or get hurt trying to calve. I will get some pics of her and post them tonight or in the a.m.

we gave her a little more feed lastnight and this morning , along with hay.  Should I get her appetite express ? to quickly  try to add some more weight on her ?

SKF- do you remember the little red heiffer ? we didnt bring her to WPB.. ETA: this picture is very old but may give you some idea

 

[jasper]

also yes the weight was a scale not a tape.

 

[CAB]

  I guess that I think that you necessarily hurt the genetic potential of your heifer. Is your heifer cycling yet? I think that with free choice of a good mixed hay and the current grain level that you can get her caught up pretty easily to where she needs to be. Try to do most of the catching up the 1st 2/3s of gestation then evaluate where her body condition is @ that time. I would not use the Highlander bull on her. He has not been prooven to be calving ease. I would think about Northern Improvement, a Red Angus calving ease bull, or one of the Lowline bulls. JMO. Brent

 

[vc]

She looks like a normal 6 month calf at 180 days,I would guess 450 to 500 pounds in that picture.She has a good top line and adequate muscle, maybe a little light on the bone but not bad. I would of thought she would be black being a lim-angus cross.
does not look stunted at all in that picture.

 

[jasper]

She looks like a normal 6 month calf at 180 days,I would guess 450 to 500 pounds in that picture.She has a good top line and adequate muscle, maybe a little light on the bone but not bad. I would of thought she would be black being a lim-angus cross.
does not look stunted at all in that picture.

yes, she cycles.  I think the problem is her feeding. Obviously, we have completed got that screwed up. 

 

[LazyGLowlines]

Then I would definitely recommend lowline, at least for the first calf. We have semen available from several bulls as well as Dori & TJ.  That's aboiut the only way to guarantee a low birthweight.

 

[CAB]

Don't be so hard on yourself. Hind site is 20/20, but we can't change that. Make your decisions on what you know today for tomorrow. I still think that you can make a good cow out of your heifer. Brent

 

[TJ]

The pictures were taken on 4/16/08... that was about 10 months ago.  So the heifer was 6 months old.  She'd be 16 months old now.  With that said... I wish that we could see a recent pic of her to see what condition she's in, etc. 

With that said, SKF is correct... Florida cattle do tend to be smaller & usually don't perform as well... I've seen it with my own eyes.   Just look at the wild animals... the farther north & west the bigger, the further south & east the smaller.  Cattle are exactly the same way.  An old joke among Canadian Chi breeders was, "the quickest way to downsize was to cross the border into the United States."  A lot of truth in that statement!  I've seen a lot of big, thick, massive, high performing Canadian genetics (Montana & North Dakota genetics too for that matter) show up in this area & not do nearly as well here in KY & further south, as they did up north.  Our climate is different, our grass is different, etc.  And I can tell you that the difference between Missouri/Kentucky compared to Florida is like night & day too!       

YOU MAY NOT HAVE SCREWED UP AS BADLY AS YOU MAY BE THINKING!!   775 lbs. is not as terrible as some are making it sound.  For a show heifer, yes, it's not great at all... no sugar coating that.   HOWEVER, for a commercial heifer or a Florida heifer, it's probably not too bad.   FYI, a heifer should weigh approx. 2/3 of their body weight by breeding age (14-17 months).  For example an 800 lb. heifer at breeding should end up weighing 1,200 lbs. at maturity.  If this heifer weighs 775 at 16 months, she should be around 1,175 lbs. at maturity.  For Florida, 1,200 lbs. is a pretty good sized cow... 1,200 lbs. isn't a "dink" or "stunted", especially in Florida.  I know several commercial guys around here with 800 something lb. breeding age heifers.  Again, I'd really like to see a current picture. 

Grass hay (grass not legume) needs to be fed everyday & not just as a treat. 


jasper... she probably needs more feed, definately more hay, but be careful & DO NOT push that heifer too hard or too quick.  Best wishes with your project!

 

[TMJ Show Cattle]

You may also need to WORM your heifer. Sounds like you have little experience. That's ok,cause we all started not knowing too much. You might also want to check/test her for hardware. If you have the age correct on your heifer,she is really behind the eight ball. Follow the advice of any experienced breeder,most woukd be glad to help. Also don't be afraid to tell anyone you have minimal experienceand always remember,it's better to ask dumb questions,then to ask nothing,lose your heifer,and leave no doubt about your abilities.

 

[CAB]

  We have starting putting a magnet in all of our replacement heifers as a precation. We feed a lot of processed feed and I think that $2/2.50/magnet is money well spent on a replacement heifer. Brent

 

[TJ]

You may also need to WORM your heifer. Sounds like you have little experience. That's ok,cause we all started not knowing too much. You might also want to check/test her for hardware. If you have the age correct on your heifer,she is really behind the eight ball. Follow the advice of any experienced breeder,most woukd be glad to help. Also don't be afraid to tell anyone you have minimal experienceand always remember,it's better to ask dumb questions,then to ask nothing,lose your heifer,and leave no doubt about your abilities.

I also think that parasite control would be a good place to start.  One reason (not the only reason) why Florida cattle are smaller is because of all the potential parasites (internal & external).  Liver flukes are a concern in FL, but not so much so as you go northward.  Show calves need a lot more parasite control than a typical commercial animal. 

 

[JoeDirt]

The pictures were taken on 4/16/08... that was about 10 months ago.  So the heifer should look 6 months old.  She'd be 16 months old now.  With that said... I wish that we could see a recent pic of her to see what condition she's in, etc.  

With that said, SKF is correct... Florida cattle do tend to be smaller & usually don't perform as well... I've seen it with my own eyes.   Just look at the wild animals... the farther north & west the bigger, the further south & east the smaller.  Cattle are exactly the same way.  An old joke among Canadian Chi breeders was, "the quickest way to downsize was to cross the border into the United States."  A lot of truth in that statement!  I've seen a lot of big, thick, massive, high performing Canadian genetics (Montana & North Dakota genetics too for that matter) show up in this area & not do nearly as well here in KY & the further south, as they did up north.  Our climate is different, our grass is different, etc.  And I can tell you that the difference between Missouri/Kentucky compared to Florida is like night & day too!      

YOU MAY NOT HAVE SCREWED UP AS BADLY AS YOU MAY BE THINKING & SHE MAY NOT BE STUNTED!!   775 lbs. is not as terrible as some are making it sound.  For a show heifer, yes, it's not great at all... no sugar coating that.   HOWEVER, for a commercial heifer or a Florida heifer, it's probably not too bad.   FYI, a heifer should weigh approx. 2/3 of their body weight by breeding age (14-17 months).  For example an 800 lb. heifer at breeding should end up weighing 1,200 lbs. at maturity.  If this heifer weighs 775 at 16 months, she should be around 1,175 lbs. at maturity.  For Florida, 1,200 lbs. is a pretty good sized cow... 1,200 lbs. isn't a "dink" or "stunted", especially in Florida.  I know several commercial guys around here with 800 something lb. breeding age heifers.  Again, I'd really like to see a current picture.  

jasper... she probably needs more feed, but be careful & DO NOT push that heifer too hard or too quick.  Best wishes with your project!

Jasper

GEt a picture of her TODAY so we can compare the differents of 4/16/2008 and now

Thanks
Chris

 

[jasper]

ok.. so i got a new camera and here's a pic. sorry for taking so long.

 

[worthabit]

Obviously you took her to a show, how did you do? What were the judge's comments? How did she compare to the other animals in the class?

She looks to be in good health and you can tell that young man takes good care of her. She does seem very small for her age.

 

[jbzdad]

Man, a picture is worth a dozen words... I think that female is malnourished, her head really looks big for her body and her leg bones seem really small, I am afraid she probably has lost quite a bit of bone growth potential....  ...... I think see if you can sell her and start over with a new project, if you can sell her for 500 and find a decent 550-600 weaned and started  heifer you could try over... could you buy afford to buy a new heifer ?

 

[jasper]

Obviously you took her to a show, how did you do? What were the judge's comments? How did she compare to the other animals in the class?

She looks to be in good health and you can tell that young man takes good care of her. She does seem very small for her age.

she placed 4 or 5th in her class of 12. he won 3rd for showmanship. judge said she needed to be a little heavier in the front.

Man, a picture is worth a dozen words... I think that female is malnourished, her head really looks big for her body and her leg bones seem really small, I am afraid she probably has lost quite a bit of bone growth potential....  ...... I think see if you can sell her and start over with a new project, if you can sell her for 500 and find a decent 550-600 weaned and started  heifer you could try over... could you buy afford to buy a new heifer ?

yes, I can get him another heifer. She will not be sold. 

 

[jbzdad]

OK ... so if you are bound and determined to keep her I would do as some others suggested, worm her, Hay,mineral and a little grain, I would go ahead and AI her to a lo birthweight bull.. we use OCC Homer... even though she probably wont grow much more she might be a decent mama