Recip contracts/programs

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lynle1234

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Oct 9, 2008
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146
We are thinking about contracting out our cows as recips and putting other people's embryo's in our cows.  I know there are many different types of programs used- such as who pays for what, when money is paid, and other guidelines. 

I'd like to hear from both sides- the people who own the embyo's and the people that contract their cows as recips.  Who pays for what, when do you pay the recip owners, etc.  What do you think works?  What would you suggest? 

Thanks!
 

cdncowboy

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Jan 20, 2009
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Flintoft,Saskatchewan, Canada
A big purebred operation 'round here has been contracting cows for their embryo's the last few years.  They are paying $1000/live, weaned calf.  They supply all the CIDRs and drugs to sync. Plus the last two years they also come insert and remove CIDRs and do the needling, I think they are doing this due to some issues they had the first couple years.  A friend has put some of his cows into their program, had his first calf crop with them this year - I never asked but I believe he gets paid when the calves are picked up.
 

justintime

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May 26, 2007
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Saskatchewan Canada
There are several different options from the supplier of the embryos paying for every calf weaned, to agreements where the resulting calves are split at weaning.
Here is one I know of: the breeder supplies the embryos, and pays the associated ET costs ( drugs and implantation). The co-operator herd supplies good young recip cows. Co-operator herd supplies all feed, vaccinations, vet supplies , vet costs and creep feed for the calves until weaning. At weaning the breeder can purchase all the ET calves at $900 each, or he has the option of only taking 80% of the ET calves and leaving 20% with the cooperator herd.

Another option is to simply split the ET calves 50:50 which results in no big output of cash on the breeder's part, and it allows the co-operator herd to market his share of the calves( 50%) any way they want, or they can retain them for their own herd. One of the parties splits the ET calves into two groups, then the other party gets to take first pick of which group he wants. The person who splits the calves gets the remaining set of calves. This method eliminates one person from stacking all the good ones in one group. Another way is to simply alternate selections until all the calves are selected. If it goes into year two, whoever had first pick the previous year, gets second pick the following year.

I had an agreement with a neighbour here to use a few of his cows and I simply paid him $.25/ LB over top market price on October 20th each year for the ET calves. I had the option to pick out up to three calves in each calf crop that were paid for at fair market price if they were inferior such as calves that had pneumonia, scours, injured, etc.

To me the person you are getting involved with is as important as the  costs involved. The co-operator has to be honest, reliable, provide good management and keep commumication lines open with the breeder who supplies the embryos. If either party is not happy in the deal, it will not work.

Where are you located? I may be interested myself in something like this. I have over 300 embryos in inventory after implanting 40 here and will implant another 8-10 yet in a few weeks. Right now, I am looking at my options, and may be interested in making an agreement with the right person.It may be only a few for the first year, until we see how it goes, but it could grow if things work out right.
 

jackpotcattle

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May 26, 2009
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Miller, SD
I have been involved with two coop herds who each did things a little different. The first one I worked for put in both purebreds and clubby embryo's. They got paid $100 the day they put the embryo's in and then $900 at weaning time for EVERY weaned calf.
The 2nd breeder put in mostly clubby embryo's. They got paid $850 at weaning time for EVERY live calf.

The 2nd place paid for all the drugs I believe now that they get paid $100 up front like the other one.

The biggest reason for getting the $100 when you put the embryo's in is because it is like insurance. What most pple don't account for is that the cows that don't stick or cant be used get set back a whole cycle if not more. That should be worth something IMO. I know the purebred guys pay better for live calves.

 

steer-guy

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Mar 3, 2009
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133
if any one is in the central texas area, I'm in need of a few recips for some #1 embryos I have. Would like to work something out that doesn't involve me purchasing the cows.
 

herefordfootball

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Apr 10, 2009
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Northern, Indiana
steer-guy said:
if any one is in the central texas area, I'm in need of a few recips for some #1 embryos I have. Would like to work something out that doesn't involve me purchasing the cows.

Same here I'm located in IN. Thanks!!!
 

FJLranch

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May 10, 2009
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Location
Groesbeck, TX
steer-guy said:
if any one is in the central texas area, I'm in need of a few recips for some #1 embryos I have. Would like to work something out that doesn't involve me purchasing the cows.

Call this Guy: Brad Wright 979-219-4599 cell 979-8283450 . He's in Franklin TX.
 

FJLranch

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May 10, 2009
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Groesbeck, TX
Camp Cooley Genetics/Ultimate Genetics has a good program. They have hundreds of recips and you don't have to buy them. Just pay for your calf at six months old. They split the payments up something like 65.00 when the embryo goes in, 300.00 palpated with calf at 60 days, 300.00 when calf is born,300.00 when you pick up your calf. I may be a little off on the price but not by much. I have used their program and was happy with the way everything went. campcooleygneetics.com or google ultimate genetics

Larry
 

herefordfootball

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Northern, Indiana
I just looked it up. Might be touch pricey for me though, I'm farther away too. 1200 for a live calf, or 1750 for a preg. recip at 90 days. But looked like they had a really good program.
 

jbzdad

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Jan 21, 2009
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783
Location
southwestern Kansas
since I don't have my own embryos I made a deal to coop with a producer for embryos. Last year I bought embryos elsewhere and put them in...this year we are putting in 5 embryos and I am setting up the cows and paying 1/2 of the implant costs.. we will own equal shares of the calves , either of us can buy out the other if we agree on price or we can put the calves thru the producers sale... the fact that the producer has a sale and let me pick matings comfortable with my goals helped me decide to go this route
 

lynle1234

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Oct 9, 2008
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146
We are located in Indiana. 

I've heard of a variety of different "options".  Locally, we've seen the set rate between $1000-$1500 per calf weaned.

I think the ones that we'd be interested in would be: Owner of the embryo's would pay $200 upfront, pay for the Cidrs, shots, bill inserting the eggs.  Owner of the cows pays for creep feed.  Then once the calf is weaned and picked up, the rest of the money is paid.

Who would pay for any vet bills during calving?  Who would pay for vacinnations, etc?

Anyone have any good/bad experiences?  Any recommendations? 
 

herefordfootball

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Vaccines and vet bills at calving are usually the responsibility of the recip owner. And I dont have any recommnedations because I'm in Indiana and looking for recips too.  ;D
 

luv2show21

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May 5, 2009
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West Central MO
$1500, plus embryo costs, to "buy back" your own embryo calf?  How does anyone but the cooperator make any money with this scenario?  I've heard a number of scenarios dealing with cooperators, and many of them deal with paying the cooperator X cents over market for the weaned calf.  To me, that seems like a more reasonable way for it to be "worthwhile" for both people.
 

justintime

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May 26, 2007
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Saskatchewan Canada
luv2show21 said:
$1500, plus embryo costs, to "buy back" your own embryo calf?  How does anyone but the cooperator make any money with this scenario?  I've heard a number of scenarios dealing with cooperators, and many of them deal with paying the cooperator X cents over market for the weaned calf.  To me, that seems like a more reasonable way for it to be "worthwhile" for both people.

I tend to agree .... $1500 does seem to be a bit pricy for me, but if someone is willing to pay it, go for it. Like I said previously, I look at these recip programs as if you were leasing cows. If either party is not happy... or does not make a little money, the agreement will not last long. I also like the agreements where I pay a premium over market price... say $250  and the owner of the recips pays the costs of feed. I have no problem paying the implanting costs and supplying the embryos. I like the premium over market, as it also acts as an incentive to the recip owner to take special care of the ET calves.  $1500 is OK if you are getting extra special calves from every embryo, but I think we have all seen ET calves selling in sales that are not that special. Sometimes the genetics simply do not click well.
I was thinking a  co-operator herd may be an option, to produce more calves and not have to own more cows. If the prices get too high, I think I am better to buy the cows and have someone custom feed them.
 

yousesteers

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Oct 25, 2008
Messages
192
Location
Emden, MO
There are a couple guys live about 5 miles north of me run about 600 cows putting in around 125 embryos and were last I knew getting $300 over market price for embryo calf owner of embryo pays tech fee and all synch costs cow owner takes care of everything else calf has to weigh so much at weaning and I think the embryo owner had choice to take calf or not if they dont want the calf he goes to the feedlot with the other 500 calves. THey were cooping with a angus ranch seems to be working good for both parties
 

ROAD WARRIOR

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Jun 9, 2007
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Iowa
I have been torching RA sale cattle for a dispersal on June 20th. There are 70 some odd purebred lots as well as 160 bred commercial heifers in this sale. Some of the purebreds are spring calvers and some fall. This sale is in Bloomfield IA at 1:00 pm Saturday June 20th. If I can help anyone PM me. RW
 

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