SALE REQUIREMENTS

[joey219]

Our county 4-H is hoping to make some changes to the requirements to sell at the Market Animal Sale during the fair.  We have sheep, swine and beef sold during the sale.  We seem to have an increase in more kids doing less.  It seems we are doing these exhibitors a disservice by allowing them to continue this behavior.  What requirements does your 4-H have in order to sell?  Is there some things that seem to work better than others?  The point in raising an animal should be providing a good quality product  but the focus seems to be more and more on how much money they receive. 

 

[4sistersshowingwhatwegot]

I don't know if there's a way to sort it out unfortunately... We have a similar situation at our fair. Numbers seem to increase or steady off every year, but we do have a TON of hogs that show... usually over 200! Our exhibitors are only allowed to sell one animal, regardless of how much they work with them, you just hope that the buyers can tell and reward those kids that work their butts off!!!!

 

[advocate]

Make it so they have to place in the top half of their class

 

[WIBeefgal]

We also have beef, swine, and sheep in our county, but our numbers have been really high these past few years! The way our county fair Market Animal Show and Sale works is that we have to earn a certain amount of points to be eligible to sell. These points are earned by going to sponsored meetings by the program, competing in state competitions and going to practices for them (meats judging, livestock quiz bowls, skillations, etc.), and other various livestock-related activities meant to teach the kids. Each activity is worth a certain number of  points. Each member had to earn 10 points per year, but there are rumors it might increase since this is fairly easy to get. We also have to fill out an education log stating what we learned or did at each event. Bidder slips and the education log have to be turned in by a certain time, or the members are ineligible. The animals have to meet rate of gain and weight requirements, but the judge is the one that decides which ones will be in the sale. After judging, exhibitors are able to decide which animal they want to sell, if they had more than one, and have to fill out a form stating which one they will sell one hour after hog juding (they are the last ones judged). Also, in order to be eligible, they also HAVE to  show in a showmanship class and place well in it. After the sale is done and over with, we also have to fill out "Financial Summaries." This (hopefully) helps the kids realize the costs of raising the animal.

 

[WBar Farms]

Wow beefgal that's a lot. Ours is do well make sale and be done I really don't think id like it if they did it the way yurs does. Simpliest way to make the kids step up is id say not let every in.

 

[blindsquirrel]

my county fair growing up was top 30 steers top 30 hogs and top 15 lambs made the sale.  Nothing was guaranteed now i
live in a county where every one can sell one animal and the shows are not nearly as competitive.

 

[Ms Ray]

Our fair you can sell 2 animals but only one can be beef,  at other local fairs you can sell 2 animals if one is a beef, if no beef you can sell 1.  We have sheep, pigs, goats, beef and some small animals

 

[taylor tay]

In our show and sale, we have sheep, beef and swine and rabbits and chickens some times.  Over the years there has been less selling in lambs and more in swine.  Our fair you can only sell one animal, you can give an extra animal but you don't get money for them.  We also added that you have to make a total of 6 meetings or else you will have to pay commission on your animal.  We also have to go to MAQA-(Meat Quality Assurance Program).  You have to own the beef animal for 4 months or since day of birth, 2 months for sheep and swine, there are also weight requirements for market, there is a minimum in sheep and swine, maximum in swine, you can sell it it just will be sold at the maximum weight, not the other weight.  We also spread the champions every ten so that the buyers can look at more animals then just waiting and leaving

 

[joey219]

We also have beef, swine, and sheep in our county, but our numbers have been really high these past few years! The way our county fair Market Animal Show and Sale works is that we have to earn a certain amount of points to be eligible to sell. These points are earned by going to sponsored meetings by the program, competing in state competitions and going to practices for them (meats judging, livestock quiz bowls, skillations, etc.), and other various livestock-related activities meant to teach the kids. Each activity is worth a certain number of  points. Each member had to earn 10 points per year, but there are rumors it might increase since this is fairly easy to get. We also have to fill out an education log stating what we learned or did at each event. Bidder slips and the education log have to be turned in by a certain time, or the members are ineligible. The animals have to meet rate of gain and weight requirements, but the judge is the one that decides which ones will be in the sale. After judging, exhibitors are able to decide which animal they want to sell, if they had more than one, and have to fill out a form stating which one they will sell one hour after hog juding (they are the last ones judged). Also, in order to be eligible, they also HAVE to  show in a showmanship class and place well in it. After the sale is done and over with, we also have to fill out "Financial Summaries." This (hopefully) helps the kids realize the costs of raising the animal.

I like the idea of the point system.  Right now the education requirements are only a Meat Quality Assurance Class and a yearly mandatory meeting.  You do have to make weight, but there aren't any placing requirements.  In previous years the sale order has been chosen by a lottery -- you pick a number from a container at the weigh in.  My children have always been the worst pickers!  I don't believe there has been a time that we haven't been the last beef sold.  Sometimes this has worked in our favor other times not so much.  We are proposing a change that you would sell in the order the judge has placed you.    Do you feel that the point system has benifited the project?

 

[COd]

If poor quality is a problem the sale committee can put a rule in the fair book that hey have they right to remove an animal from the sale.

 

[BGF]

We also have beef, swine, and sheep in our county, but our numbers have been really high these past few years! The way our county fair Market Animal Show and Sale works is that we have to earn a certain amount of points to be eligible to sell. These points are earned by going to sponsored meetings by the program, competing in state competitions and going to practices for them (meats judging, livestock quiz bowls, skillations, etc.), and other various livestock-related activities meant to teach the kids. Each activity is worth a certain number of  points. Each member had to earn 10 points per year, but there are rumors it might increase since this is fairly easy to get. We also have to fill out an education log stating what we learned or did at each event. Bidder slips and the education log have to be turned in by a certain time, or the members are ineligible. The animals have to meet rate of gain and weight requirements, but the judge is the one that decides which ones will be in the sale. After judging, exhibitors are able to decide which animal they want to sell, if they had more than one, and have to fill out a form stating which one they will sell one hour after hog juding (they are the last ones judged). Also, in order to be eligible, they also HAVE to  show in a showmanship class and place well in it. After the sale is done and over with, we also have to fill out "Financial Summaries." This (hopefully) helps the kids realize the costs of raising the animal.

Can you PM me your requeirements they sound good.

 

[vc]

Our club as has requirements that the kids must meet to be eligible for the fair. The club has a minimum of meetings and weigh days that you must participate in to be able to exhibit your animal at the fair.


The County Fair has the minimum days required to own the animal 120 steers, 60 for lambs, goats and hogs.
The animals must also receive a blue ribbon in their class to go on to the sale, you may only sale one animal through the sale, unless you have more than one champion, all champions must sell.

Here is the requirements for a blue ribbon.

MARKET BEEF SCORECARD
Blue Ribbon. Market Ready: Market steers projected to have sufficient fat deposition to meet the marbling specifications of USDA Prime, Choice, or Select+ quality grades.
Red Ribbon. Not Market Ready: Market steers lacking evidence of sufficient fat deposition to produce a desirable consumer product. Steers projected to grade USDA Select- or lower.

MARKET SWINE SCORECARD
Blue Ribbon. Market Acceptable:
U.S. No. 1 and No. 2 hogs of average or greater conformation that are acceptable in leanness, muscularity and production traits.
Red Ribbon. Not Market Acceptable:
Any hog of below average conformation including U.S. number 3, U.S. number 4 and utility grade hogs.

MARKET LAMB SCORECARD
Blue Ribbon. Market Acceptable:
USDA Prime or Choice quality with 12th rib back fat range .16-.35, average conformation and cutability.
Red Ribbon. Not Market Acceptable:
Good or lower quality grade with 12th rib back fat range <.16 or >.35; underfinished lambs grading USDA good or lower, below-average conformation and cutability.

 

[WIBeefgal]

I like the idea of the point system.  Right now the education requirements are only a Meat Quality Assurance Class and a yearly mandatory meeting.  You do have to make weight, but there aren't any placing requirements.  In previous years the sale order has been chosen by a lottery -- you pick a number from a container at the weigh in.  My children have always been the worst pickers!  I don't believe there has been a time that we haven't been the last beef sold.  Sometimes this has worked in our favor other times not so much.  We are proposing a change that you would sell in the order the judge has placed you.    Do you feel that the point system has benefited the project?
[/quote]

For our sale order, I'm unsure as to how they pick it, but they do spread out the champions to help keep the bidders there longer. We also have to go to a Meat Quality Assurance class and they also have a mandatory meeting to start off the new project year...As far as the points go, I personally have benefitted a great deal from doing the activities to get points. When I first started showing, I became involved and joined the meats judging, livestock skillathon and quiz bowl teams because if you went to 3 practices and participated in the state contest, you earned 5 points. So, even by just doing 2 of them , I easily got the 10 points. I don't know if you have competitions like that in your state, but I would definitely recommend doing them because so many opportunities can come from these. I have been able to go to Denver, Omaha, and will go to Louisville to compete in the National Contests for those three teams I am on, and that is an experience that one can be VERY proud of and use to put on a college application, and the knowledge gained from those activities can be used in the showring during showmanship or even in the career one will pursue, which in my case, is a veterinarian. Even besides me, if you look at the other youth that have also participated in these activities, they are having the same success. This last year, our county swept the state quiz bowl competition, winning in all three age divisions. And our county consistently does well in most all livestock competitions. So I think that the points have benefitted the project a lot. Not to brag or anything, but we are always complimented as being the best county in the state because of the quality of our animals and how the youth in our county represent ourselves at state or even national competitions. And I think it all goes back to how our youth are educated because they have to go to the clinics or participate in these competitions, and they learn what they have to do to compete at our county because we have a really tough county fair where there are families that show at a national level, so that means they need to step up their game in order to compete with them.

Hope you can understand my viewpoint, I might have rambled on in some places... :-\

 

[joey219]

I understand your completely.  I think that providing as much opportunity to educate exhibitors is the best.  When do you have your Mandatory Meeting?  When is your weigh in?  At this point we have our Mandatory meeting at the end of January and the weigh in is in December.  Does your county put on any show clinics themselves?

 

[WIBeefgal]

Our mandatory meeting is usually the first saturday in December, but since basketball and other sports might have tournaments, they do have a make-up meeting in January on a weekday evening. The beef weigh-in is the first Saturday in February, hogs in April, and sheep in May. Our fair is the first week in August/last week of July, depending on how it falls on the calendar. It goes from a Tuesday to Sunday. They always have it so the beef rate of gain is calculated at 179 days. I think they had some sort of show clinic this year, but it included other species like dairy, rabbits, chickens, etc. Otherwise, three feed mills in the area put on some real nice clinics. The one in February is taught by students currently attending UW-River Falls that show or have shown. They usually talke about how you would select your animal and how you would prepare it for showing and they do a showmanship demonstration too. There is another one in spring, but I haven't gone to that one, think that one just focuses on feed. And I guess there was one in January, but we didn't go to that one either. Think that's all we have for clinics...I know the state puts on a big show clinic that lasts a few days, so the kids would actually stay in the dorms at the state fair grounds, I believe. But that should be it as far as our county goes...

 

[vc]

Our sale order goes Grand and Reserve, Division Champions, Class winners, 2nd, 3rd and on down, they rotate 4-H and FFA and jump all over the weight classes, so a class winner at 1330 -1350 would sale and then a 1150-1175 class winner may sale next.

I think it would be better to make it more attractive to work hard with your project, than to penalize those that do not. Some do this by have an ADG contest, or We have a bred and fed contest pays out 500, 250, 150, 100, 50 for calves bred and fed in our county. Local breeders kick in the money. Reward the kids who are the hard workers and let the slackers finish where they finish.

There are always going to be kids just in it for the money, they usually don't place high or they get a red ribbon and do not sale through auction.

Side Note: our county used to require all exhibitors to meet a monthly Club general meeting requirement and a monthly project meeting requirement, then some one did not meet the requirements, got a lawyer threatend to sue and ,yep you guessed it, they got to show. What you are trying to accomplish is right, but sometimes you can only do so much, and adding more rules or requirements isn't always the answer (see our government for example)

 

[katie_k]

ours have to make a certain weight, 1100 for beef, 130 for pigs and idk about lambs.  we dont have to much trouble selling underweight animals, the guy who hauls them to the feedlot to be killed off just buys them and finishes them off