The 5000 year leap

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Well-known member
Jun 11, 2007
I am only 50 pages into this book and have learned more about our nations founding than I did in 16 years of schooling.

I think it would do many people some good to actually read our founders words and understand that our country and constitution was based on Natures law IE Gods law.  This country would be much better off if people actually had to read the Constitution rather than just told what it said.

How many of you have actually read it, had to study it in you high school government class.

Did you know that left and right are not to mean Socialism vs conservatism.  its tyranny vs anarchy. 

Below are some quotes from our founders writings.  I bet you were never thought these!

"but neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.  He therefore is the truest friend to the liberty of his country who tries most to promote its virtue , and who, so far as his power and influence extend, will not suffer a man to be chosen into any office of power and trust who is not a wise and virtuous man," Samuel Adams

He then went on to say that public officials should not be chosen if they are lacking in experience, training, proven virtue and demonstrated wisdom.

"If their be no virtue among us? If there be not, we are in a wretched situation.  No theoretical checks, no form of government can render us secure.  To suppose that any form of government liberty or happiness without any virtue and in the people, is a chimerical idea.  If there be sufficient virtue and intelligence in the community, it will be exercised in the selection of these men; so that we do not depend on their virtue, or put confidence in our rulers, but in the people who are to choose them."  James Madison

" Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports.  In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism, who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens....Let it simply be asked, where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the oaths which are the instruments of the investigation in the courts of justice?  And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion.  Whatever may be conceded to the influence of refined education... reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle." Washington's farewell address

" I thank God that I have lived to see my country independent and free.  She may long enjoy her independence and freedom if she will.  It depends on her virtue."  Samuel Adams

"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people.  It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." Samuel Adams

"The sum of all is, if we would most truly enjoy the gift of Heaven, let us become a virtuous people, then shall we both deserve and enjoy it.  While, on the other hand, if we are universally vicious and debauched in our manners, through the form of our constitution carries the face of the most exalted freedom, we shall in reality be the most abject slaves."  Samuel Adams


Well-known member
Feb 7, 2007
Hollister, CA
i've read 3 or 4 books with those quotes in them, including the federalist papers, the anti-federalist papers and a couple of others.

to me, this is the central reason why the constitution will at some point die.  the constitution itself is a biased document, and for some reason, any bias is bad.  the move to remove bias is as bad as bias in the extreme.  some cultures are just not compatible with the constitution's bias.  of course people will bring up slavery, but most of the founding fathers knew it wouldn't last (slavery that is).  they also knew the constitution wouldn't last either, which is why they set it up so that as little as possible could get done.  now that most of those barriers are almost removed, look for change.