What would you do??

[Hilltop]

You have bought a bull that is advertised as a 77# BW that is bred and raised by another breeder. Someone you know is looking for a bull for heifers and asks if he would be a safe bet for heifers. YOU tell them yes and they buy an interest in the bull. Calving season comes along and they are having a wreck with heifers and troubles with cows calving him. Females are not fed grain and are noy being pampered. The females that are coming along with big calves do not seem to have any common demoninater as far as their breeding and some other people seem to be calving to him with out much problem. They do not want to use bull again and want their share bought out. Even though you never raised the bull you sold it to them so would you buy back their share?

 

[OH Breeder]

Did you all agree to any terms in writing? That makes it so much easier.
I have a bull that had a 76# birthweight. But i would never use him on heifers. His first calves are way to massive for calving ease. I new that when I bought him. I guess if it were me, did the buyer do any research on the bull in question on dams' side etc? If you guys do not have any terms express etc it is going to be tough situation. For me personally I never consider a bull calving ese an til I see a couple calf crops and even then the cows bred to can throw some biggin's. Allow them to sell their share. If they just didn't get into the cattle business yesterday then they should know about cavling ease on unproven sire.

 

[savaged]

What is the bull's breeding?  If he genetically aligns with the claims of the breeder (e.g., he is a Northern Improvement X Who) then I think you just chalk it up  to an odd occurrence, and you should not have to buy the share back.  If the breeding is contrary to calving ease, even if his true BW was low, then maybe you consider it.  I think ultimately the buyer should be responsible, and understand the inherent risk possible with any bull used on heifers, or their cows for that matter.

 

[olsun]

I am well over 21 years of age.  I bought some semen from the Select Sires bull Hairy because I liked his calves at Wagonhammer. Bred some cows due with 2nd and 3rd calves. Pulled 2 monster heifers, well over 125 pounds and dead.  Can I, or should I get my semen money back ?

 

[ATOZ]

Don't forget that the heifer also determines birth weight on her calf, not just the sire!!

 

[CAB]

Anyone else had big ones out of Hairy?

 

[JWW]

this is the risk in buying cattle, sometimes you get one that sounds really good and think he will work ....then you crap out.... i would not buy the share back. if i bought a high dollar heifer then went to flush her and she has zero embryos.... should i be compensated? that would not happen....same with  what was said early about getting semen back on the monster calves... won't happen

its an event to chalk up for experience.


JWW

 

[BadgerFan]

Life's only guarantees are death and taxes.

 

[Rustynail]

I have a bull and a heifer out of hairy and they both came around 75 lbs.  What were the mothers? 

 

[simtal]

the notion that a bulls acutal BW ( unless it really high or really low--130+ to say 60) has much influence on his progenys bw is false. Whats his BW or CE epd, those are FAR better predictors than his actual BW.

 

[linnettejane]

Life's only guarantees are death and taxes.

so true!

what would you do? well, i think your first mistake is telling your friend that yes, he would work on heifers........... i wouldnt have sold shares or bought into it in the first place if my reasons were based solely on the 77 lb bw and supposed calving ease( i think im startin' to get a little bit of a handle on how this works, lol)...there would have to be LOTS of calves on the ground before i would put my name behind a bull as being a true easy calver...otherwise...you just end up looking like a bull jock tryin to make lots of money at other peoples expense (huge dead calves, csection vet bills, ruined heifers, etc, etc, etc)...sell shares on your bull, but if he hasnt had like...... 20,000 calves...... ,  dont advertise him as calving ease...he hasnt proven anything yet!  :

 

[Hilltop]

I personally used to believe that when someone gives you their word that people are good for it!! I have since learned different and I will admit that some is our fault and I have learned to trust ALMOST no one.

Here is the SCOOP. We bought a share of the bull and did not sell him.I was just wondering how many people would stand behind what they sell. If the only guarantee from a breeder is DEATH AND TAXES I definately would not be doing any business with them.
If a heifer is a dud and will not breed should she not be replaced or money refunded???
He is sired by a calving ease legend but does have performance on the dams side. He supposedly had calves on the ground with light BW and were made right for calving ease. We wanted a red bulls to run with the heifers so we could give the AI kit a rest. So, he ended up at our farm....Probably will not be the last mistake we ever make though it would be nice to say it was LOL!!
Probably the part that hurts the most was our daughters heifer ended up losing her calf that she had planned on showing as a pair with her last years 4-H heifer.
JWW.... You hit the nail on the head saying to chalk it up to experience.