Your thoughts on the results of the National Red Angus show in Denver

[TPX]

TPX , I think I am missing something , how can one breeder continue to breed a carrier while another could not ?
Or is it a new rule that just came in?

The rule came in after the bull was born and used thus they were able to continue to use him in Canada.  Carrier animals born before a certain date can still be registered in Canada but all there offspring need to be tested before they can be registered.  If any new calves are tested as carriers they can't be registered.  I know 6 mile had some really good bull calves out of that bull that tested positive and could not be registered with the CAA. 

 

[TPX]

Not against registering heifers that are carriers, especially in a breed that is small in numbers with a limited gene pool. But a bull that is a carrier just breeds more carriers. So I don't think they should be registered. Make him a steer!

I have bought clean cattle produced from dirty dams (that is a breeder, solving a problem).

SD
<alien>

So this bull with a unique pedigree that has produced some outstanding CLEAN offspring is not a breeder and doesn't provide any benefit to the breed?

 

[aj]

You dumb bastards that keep rationalizing........and accepting genetic carriers......are going to drag the whole beef industry down. You gotta draw a line somewhere. Please don't let the Red Angus breed go down that road. Keep the trash in the club calf industry......and the Maines.....and shorties.

 

[TPX]

You dumb bastards that keep rationalizing........and accepting genetic carriers......are going to drag the whole beef industry down. You gotta draw a line somewhere. Please don't let the Red Angus breed go down that road. Keep the trash in the club calf industry......and the Maines.....and shorties.

Before you start calling people names you should know the facts.  When the owners bought the bull he was believed to be clean and they used him that year, during that first breeding season they had interest in the bull so they got him tested in the event they decided to sell semen on him.  When the tests came back positive they in no way tried to hide it from anybody.  The owners of the bull have not tried to sell semen, embryos or carrier offspring from this bull.  They did get some very good CLEAN calves out of this bull and they have already sold some of the heifer calves off of him and will be selling the CLEAN bull calves in their sale.  If they want to show the bull to help market his offspring that they are selling in their sale then all the power to them. 

 

[aj]

I don't know who the bull is but how could he have a unique pedigree? Does he go back to RCN Canyon Chief 092 120186 born in 1980. I assume a ton of cattle can do that.

 

[TPX]

I don't know who the bull is but how could he have a unique pedigree? Does he go back to RCN Canyon Chief 092 120186 born in 1980. I assume a ton of cattle can do that.

Here you go.

RED BASIN EXT 1925 RA786702 OSF
RED BASIN EXT 5233 RA1051861 MAF OSF
RED BASIN PRIMROSE 2043 RA848410 OSF
Sire: RED BASIN EXT 45T5 1429484 AMF NHF OSF
C A FUTURE DIRECTION 5321 867594 CAF NHC AMC
BASIN ROSE 710P RA1006811 AMF NHF OSF (RC)
RED BASIN ROSE F521 RA589553 OSF
Animal: RED BENCHMARK BETTER BEEF 1563937 NHF MAF OSC
RED RD DIVIDEND 7F 905057
RED COMPASS DIVIDEND 467M 1134249
BLACK SSS MISS NEW QUICK 208E 835196 (RC)
Dam: RED FAYETTE OF BENCHMARK 424 1197244 OSC
RED MOOSE CREEK SLICK 61H 933867 OSF
RED FAYETTE OF BENCHMARK 262 1117541
RED BRETON FAYETTE 79C 758356

 

[aj]

1563937 came up different animal on the usa website.....and I couldn't get the name to bring anything up. Is this a new line of defect?

 

[aj]

None of the reg numbers match up. Are they Canadian numbers?

 

[TPX]

yes those are canadian reg #'s. 

 

[aj]

Key rice'st......I can't read French.

 

[blackdiamond]

I don't know who the bull is but how could he have a unique pedigree? Does he go back to RCN Canyon Chief 092 120186 born in 1980. I assume a ton of cattle can do that.

Here you go.

RED BASIN EXT 1925 RA786702 OSF
RED BASIN EXT 5233 RA1051861 MAF OSF
RED BASIN PRIMROSE 2043 RA848410 OSF
Sire: RED BASIN EXT 45T5 1429484 AMF NHF OSF
C A FUTURE DIRECTION 5321 867594 CAF NHC AMC
BASIN ROSE 710P RA1006811 AMF NHF OSF (RC)
RED BASIN ROSE F521 RA589553 OSF
Animal: RED BENCHMARK BETTER BEEF 1563937 NHF MAF OSC
RED RD DIVIDEND 7F 905057
RED COMPASS DIVIDEND 467M 1134249
BLACK SSS MISS NEW QUICK 208E 835196 (RC)
Dam: RED FAYETTE OF BENCHMARK 424 1197244 OSC
RED MOOSE CREEK SLICK 61H 933867 OSF
RED FAYETTE OF BENCHMARK 262 1117541
RED BRETON FAYETTE 79C 758356

that pedigree isn't unique, it's black...  hell anyone can do that.. EXT is all over the place.

 

[Show Dad]

So this bull with a unique pedigree that has produced some outstanding CLEAN offspring is not a breeder and doesn't provide any benefit to the breed?

I my opinion, I just don't see that EXT and Future Direction are that unique that I could get past his defect status.
SD
<alien>

 

[cowman 52]

If you had ever had a draft of them in a cow herd, you'd be looking for a bramer bull and send them to the way back 40

 

[aj]

Where did the os come from? Can you get to the Canyon bloodlines in his pedigree? Did it come from Black Angus? Is it a new mutation?

 

[TPX]

Where did the os come from? Can you get to the Canyon bloodlines in his pedigree? Did it come from Black Angus? Is it a new mutation?

Its quite a ways back in the cows pedigree. 

BECKTON STORMALONG 751-626 RA8605 MAF OSC

 

[aj]

Thanks.

 

[RedCowsRule]

I've never met the Six Mile crew but have the upmost respect for them as a true BREEDER of some of the best quality Red Angus cattle you can find. The story I heard was they bought him, thinking he was clean. When he turned up a carrier after being used, I don't think you have to throw him away. His clean progeny they had on display proved he can have a useful place. I have never seen them advertise semen or embryos for sale out of him. In my opinion, and that's probably not worth much, they are handling him in the right way, only offering offspring that are tested clean. I don't know what they are doing with the offspring that test as carriers but everything I have seen or heard about their operation leads me to believe they are being cut and the females getting fed out. You don't stay on top as long as they have been around by not doing things the right way.

I don't think all carriers need to be thrown away, just used carefully and it seems so far that they are doing just that. 

 

[cowman 52]

Not selling semen makes the offspring worth more,

 

[aj]

Red cows......the Shorthorn people said the same thing on th. At first we were scared a dna test wouldn't figured out. Then the Shorty people said well.....we will keep them......breed around the deal. The only thing is you never get rid of the deal. It bounces around registered herds and club calf herds. Then females get shuffled through salebarns and they end leaving carriers out in a commercial herd. then some ole boy has awreck 50 years later and it is explained that it is a Shorthorn deal. |It hurts the breeds image.

 

[cowman 52]

It hurts every body, the guy who buys the 10th generation heifer for his grandkid to start a cowherd from really needs that crap floating around.  When she has a calf that is crippled, or even worse, doesnt bring in a calf and no body has a clue why not, that gentlemen is why we all ought to be more vigalant as to what we breed.