Breed societies- what is their role?

[thunderdownunder]

Now, this could open up a whole new can of worms, but..... I'm interested to hear what people believe the role of a breed society is.

I'm raising this issue because I recently read an article which basically dismissed societies as a waste of time. One quote included 'breed societies spend too much time worrying about the colour of the cattle'.

Now, my opinion on this is that breed societies are there to maintain the integrity of the breed and the BRAND that is reperesented by that breed. It is the society's role to promote that brand, and to ensure it maintains those traits and qualities for which it has been known. This of course is only one responsibility... of course there should be efforts made to advance the breed, but not by compromising the aforementioned brand. There are many other responsibilites for a breed society, but I believe maintaing this integrity is one of the core missions.

What's your opinion?

 

[simtal]

breeds assocs are supposed to sell the breed.  It's what your selling is what most people get up in arms about.

 

[Okotoks]

Originally breed associations were formed to record and verify the ancestry and transfer of the animals. Today they provide performance records and promotion. The promotion can be very successful like with the Angus. Having sat on both provincial and national boards in Canada as well as being a director of CLRC (Canadian registry for 52 breeds of multiple species) I can tell you no matter who is running an association there will always be people unhappy. Most often those that are unhappy never attend any annual meetings or perform volunteer work
In my opinion breed associations may become more important as a means of promotion and collecting info to back up the pedigree records including DNA, marker tests etc.
On another thread we discussed breeders that let their pedigrees lapse. Unfortunately these animals usually end up being lost to the breed in the long run. In a way the expense of getting them brought up to date in a registry is justified as others have kept up their memberships and registrations thus keeping the breed association running.(there is usually a lot more time spent registering lapsed animals as records have to be verified and gone over)
Most registries set the standards for the livestock being registered. This is probably least true of the beef cattle breeds today. It seems to me if you want an animal that looks like  say a Red Angus then you should probably breed Red Angus, same for any other breed.
Breed associations may be the only thing that will prevent the complete mogrelization of the cattle herd.

 

[thunderdownunder]

Breed associations may be the only thing that will prevent the complete mongrelization of the cattle herd.

My thoughts exactly!!  (clapping)

 

[aj]

I think they should register cattle and transfer pedigrees. After that is done you can worry about other things. The Angus has alot of programs like the CAB and the like. A bureuracy in itself cannot make a breed. The commercial industry will take care of itself. It doesn't need breed people sitting in ivory towers explaining things to them. If breed asscoiations didn't exist, interprising commercial people would develop lines to crossbreed with. They wouldn't do the cattle show mickey mouse stuff. Breeds should occur because the beef industry needs them.Breed associations do not occur because the industry needs guidance. The breeds need guidance from the industry. That is where 50% of the problems occur in my opinion.

 

[justintime]

I do not think that breed associations are a waste of time, but I do think that some breed associations are guilty of wasting time on some things. IMO, breed associations main role is to maintain the registry and establish the boundaries within which it's members can maintain their herds and still register or record their cattle. These boundaries vary from breed to breed. Some breeds require performance records before full registration of animals can occur. Other breeds have more than one herd book so that it's breeders can have a more diverse breeding program. Breed associations also provide some forms of glue that keeps the members together. There can be several different beliefs as to which direction a breed should be going, but the breed association should try to provide common ground for all members, no matter what bloodlines they use, or what their beliefs are.

I also believe that breed associations have a responsibility in general promotion of a breed in the industry, but this does not include promotion of specific bloodlines or breeding programs. I know some breeders who think the breed association should do enough promotion, that they do not have to do any or at least get by with a minimal amount of promotion themselves. I do not agree with this. Promoting your own breeding program is the owner's responsibility and no one elses. I know other breeders who blame breed association personal, or the breed association itself, for their lack of success. I think that breed association personal, have to walk a fine line as they all have their personal preferences and opinions, and they have to try not to appear to favor specific bloodlines or promote them over others. I know this is a fine line, and I also know that many breeders rely on breed association people for advice and assistance in their breeding decisions. Yesterday, while delivering cattle from our sale, I received two phone calls on my cell, from US breeders who told me that a breed association employee had recommended one of my bulls for them to use. While I appreciate this recommendation, I also wondered where that magical line was that these association employees have to walk on. This is only a major issue if it gets out of control but it does give me food for thought, and I am undecided yet as to what is truly proper in this situation.

Breed associations basically are as good as their board of directors and their membership. They are like any other democratic organization, where majority opinion rules. I know lots of people who grumble and complain about everything done by directors of a breed association ( I am referring to ALL breeds with this remark) but do nothing positive themselves to work for change.Like any political organization, if you don't like what is happening you lobby and campaign for change and if you are serious enough about your convictions, you run for the board yourself, and put some effort into getting elected.

Like Okotoks, I have spent many years on provincial and national boards, in three breeds, and I will say that they all had many similarities. Many of the issues discussed are exactly the same... just the color of the breed is different. In that regard, I have a complete set of Canadian Shorthorn herd books going back to 1877. From 1877 to about 1928-30, the annual meeting minutes were printed in the front of these books. I have read many of these, and it always amazes me how these meetings could be mistaken as being held in recent years, if you just changes the names that are mentioned. Same issues.... only 100+ years difference in time.

 

[knabe]

That is where 50% of the problems occur in my opinion.

the sale yard and fast food is where 50% of the problems are solved.

 

[aj]

I agree with you totally knabe. 50% of the showring cattle need sent to the salebarn(instead of being embryo transtransplanted).good post

 

[r.n.reed]

I think one of the big challenges ahead for breed associations is the DNA arena.Deciding who owns it being the main issue and possibly one of the reasons that herds that have developed distinct strains like Shoshone and Dover have ceased to register.It is also interesting to me that there are herds within breeds that have more office and field personnel than many breed associations.

 

[aj]

I noticed that on page 8 in my November Shorthorn country that the ASA throwed out all epd's that two herds had submitted information to "protect the integrity of epd's" in the breed. Not sure who the herds were but apparrently policing is another function of boards. It'll probably be one of the sweet hearts of this board. ;D

 

[aj]

And not to out done by jit......I was a state director 6 years,did a bang up job on their directory. I am president on the Llanos township "DAMM" group.......drunks against mad mothers. I also had a subscription to the "Howard the Duck" comic book. Before I was put into the witness protection agency I was a official taste tester for Jack Daniels and ran a "home for near sighted wayward women" in France.I agree that not listing bwt's in sale catalogs and other magical lines need adressed. Not only by the Canadians mounted morality and ethics commision but also the black hided myth association along with the National Football League. We must police the magical lines and become involved. A honest-c in advertising blue ribbon commision should be recommended and if possible two FBI funded representitves to cover Canada and the great midwest states. jmo

 

[thunderdownunder]

What are some of the other things you think are an important aspect of breed societies?

 

[aj]

I think the Red Angus association is historically interesting to study. As I understand it it was formed in 1954 by 7 Red Angus breeders. It was more of a performance registry than a "society". They had mandatory performance data requirements. I wonder about all the composite cattle now adays. Take the Mainetainers. I think a 25% maine 75% Angus bloodline that was bred at that level could eventually make it as their own breed and would be palatable to the commercial industry. It would be a similar to the beefmasters and the Santa Gertrudis breeds. All breeds had a starting point. The maines had their start in France by crossing 2 breeds. There is a black Herford association in Kansas I hear about now and then. Don't know much about it. The balancers,limi flex,black simis are kinda riding the same boat. In my opinion a combination of the Red Angus and the Shorthorn breed, in theory could stand up and possibly become a new breed. The breeds traitsmatch up so well together. The Durham Red is just a fancy name for a crossbred but if you would take half bloods and mate them to half bloods over say 4 generations I think you could almost develop predictable cattle that would be worthy of scrutanization. I don't have any idea what it takes to start a new breed. But in my opinion you can make composite cattle more predicable than "purebred cattle". There are breeds of cattle that jump all over the place with different birth weights and on an on.Isn't the Red Angus breed the fastest growing breed out there? Are they a model? Its not really a big social event deal with them because of the Mandatory performance deal. Has anyone thought about forming say a mangus breed(maine and angus)?