embryo flush question
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Doc
Well-known member
Most people will use 2 straws on conventional semen. Hannon & Dixon in IN have had good results on some cows with 1 straw. If you use sexed semen then most everyone uses 3 straws.
GKE Cattle
Active member
The number of straws used will depend on how many fertilized eggs you want!!!! We always use three, 12 hours apart. The last cow we did, it was a good thing we used all 3 straws,,, we had 14 number one eggs but there was an even split of stage 6 - 5 and 4's,,so we might have missed some if we had skimped on the semen. Besides after all the expence of flushing what is an extra $25 for an other straw of semen. The only time I would use 2 straws is if it was rare semen and then hope for the best. Or if you have a history on the cow and know about how she drops her eggs.
Cowboy
Well-known member
Folks, I don't care if you use a hundred units of semen in your cow or not, there is ONE thing that makes those eggs fertile besides semen quality -- and that is very simple -- TIMING.
I breed the donors I am entrusted with ONCE, period -- using two units of semen -- one per side. If you miss the timing, you are screwed. In fact, a large percentage of cows that fail to fertilize come down to one thing -- you went out there thinking that just because she is a donor and is superovulated, you have to start breeding her as soon as she show heat -- that is pure B --- S
Ask any one who has had cows here for the last many many years -- and they will tell you that fertilization is never the issue here. Certain cows will grow thier eggs better than others do, so I usually only have to be concerned for quality issues rather than if they were fertile or not. I quit breeding these donors more than once 20 years ago -- and ever since I quit the early breeding, things have been extremely good.
My point is -- use GOOD semen, breed her on TIME, leave the extra drugs in the bottle -- and she will do just fine! Sorry for the rant here, but I see this so much any more it is agrivating. There is no need to breed more than once, but you must do it at the right time -- GKE mentioned that he had a variance in age, that is only because you had put semen in there early -- and it only got the very first eggs ovulated. Most likely, if you had waited until she had quit riding for several hours, all the eggs would have been fertilized at the same time. They do live several hours after ovulation, and the semen is good for about 20 -- go figure!
Nuf said, I won't bother you any more about it -- but this is what I do here -- and it works VERY well, not changing for nothing. One unit will get them if it is good, but needs to be split between the horns.
Good luck to all -- and I mean that!
Terry
I breed the donors I am entrusted with ONCE, period -- using two units of semen -- one per side. If you miss the timing, you are screwed. In fact, a large percentage of cows that fail to fertilize come down to one thing -- you went out there thinking that just because she is a donor and is superovulated, you have to start breeding her as soon as she show heat -- that is pure B --- S
Ask any one who has had cows here for the last many many years -- and they will tell you that fertilization is never the issue here. Certain cows will grow thier eggs better than others do, so I usually only have to be concerned for quality issues rather than if they were fertile or not. I quit breeding these donors more than once 20 years ago -- and ever since I quit the early breeding, things have been extremely good.
My point is -- use GOOD semen, breed her on TIME, leave the extra drugs in the bottle -- and she will do just fine! Sorry for the rant here, but I see this so much any more it is agrivating. There is no need to breed more than once, but you must do it at the right time -- GKE mentioned that he had a variance in age, that is only because you had put semen in there early -- and it only got the very first eggs ovulated. Most likely, if you had waited until she had quit riding for several hours, all the eggs would have been fertilized at the same time. They do live several hours after ovulation, and the semen is good for about 20 -- go figure!
Nuf said, I won't bother you any more about it -- but this is what I do here -- and it works VERY well, not changing for nothing. One unit will get them if it is good, but needs to be split between the horns.
Good luck to all -- and I mean that!
Terry
WWS
Well-known member
Ccowboy when is the right time? We switched from using 3 straws to now just using 2 straws since we were using more expensive semen. Since we switched to two call it luck but we have had 100% fertilized eggs on 6 different flushes. We breed at 12 and 24 hours after on-set of standing heat and have had super luck, we just check the semen to make sure its good and a.i. normal (we don't horn breed), saves on the real expensive semen and saves having to run the donor through the chute an extra time. When we used 3 straws we bred at 8, 16, and 24 hours after on-set of standing heat. We will still use 3 occasionally if the semen is from a bull we own or if its reasonably priced.
Cowboy
Well-known member
I may be one of the old renegades based on TODAY'S new standards, but I listen to these cows talk to us. By that I mean, they will tell us by thier actions when they are done, and ready to be bred. It is NEVER early -- and I am a firm believer that you never touch the uterus of a cow in active standing heat -- you have ONE chance to release certain hormones, one is Oxitocin.
Breeding too early is actually a negative on the whole project.
I won't go into the great details here, so if you really need some personal info -- just PM me and I will try and help -- in fact just call me.
Here is one tip -- the average cow will not ovulate until close to 30 hours after the onset of PRE-estrous, this is before she will stand. She then stands for at least 12 hours, meybe 15 -- and then another few hours of post-estrous - not standing but still interested in others. I breed WELL after all of this -- just watch em -- you will see. I can almost promise you that the average cow bred 2 or 3 times as mentioned, will invariably fertilize with the last breeding. The 12 and 24 hour breeding you mentioned is both early here as well as late -- it will usually fall somewhere in between!
There ya have it -- PM some time and I will gladly talk all night -- hehehe -- it took a long time to get this right -- but it is not hard to do! (At least for me any way)
Terry
Breeding too early is actually a negative on the whole project.
I won't go into the great details here, so if you really need some personal info -- just PM me and I will try and help -- in fact just call me.
Here is one tip -- the average cow will not ovulate until close to 30 hours after the onset of PRE-estrous, this is before she will stand. She then stands for at least 12 hours, meybe 15 -- and then another few hours of post-estrous - not standing but still interested in others. I breed WELL after all of this -- just watch em -- you will see. I can almost promise you that the average cow bred 2 or 3 times as mentioned, will invariably fertilize with the last breeding. The 12 and 24 hour breeding you mentioned is both early here as well as late -- it will usually fall somewhere in between!
There ya have it -- PM some time and I will gladly talk all night -- hehehe -- it took a long time to get this right -- but it is not hard to do! (At least for me any way)
Terry
Just something else to consider is that more is not often better. Meaning, if you have questionable semen, putting more in there is not the answere. Also every time you AI her you have a chance of getting or putting something in the uterus and killing the semen or eggs there.
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