multi breed genectic evaluation?

[frostback]

What would it take to get it on a ballot for the Denver annual meeting? Does "A" director have to get it on a ballot. Could the membes vote on it? Would a committe have to be appointed to study it and make a proposal?

http://www.shorthorn.org/contactus/main_jcontactus.html
Are you scared of phones or too cheap to make a call? Ask the people that would know the answer. Then you can come back and tell everyone what they said, and discuss it as a group of shorthorn breeders that want a change, not one that just wishes it would.

 

[HerefordGuy]

Multi breed evaluations are the future of the industry.  Not having them before simply comes down to a pissing match between breeds.  Progressive associations will join what has already started, sure maybe the genomics will be more applicable within breeds. To clarify the associations are not joining together, they are just sharing and comparing data amongst them to make the data more relevant and accurate. 

I love this answer!

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

Agree with Knabe. EPD's are only one more tool on selection system. Many factors shw influence on EBV's as well depending of program used a same bull will to be positive in one and negative in another. Calculating depends of how many animals are on the database, changing year by year.

I buy semen and bulls looking the animal...long, deep, massive, masculine. These are my criteria. Look at marbling (looking for it on my herd) and fat cover (I'm looking for introduce fat cover)  when available as these are direct measuring itens, so that animal show really that index as it was measure on him.

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

To me, MARC studies were always a guide for breeds comparassion. Always used it as example for Shorthorn qualities as BW, marbling, etc... Almost a perfect breed that could be used on both sides as terminal as maternal. But looking the link shared i saw a high BW breed loosing for almost all continentals!!!! 

As was wrote - sorry not remember what member wrote - would be interest see what lines or sires were used and check if they are really a real breed sample!!!  If yes, well work need be done for change it.

How much are the Shorthorn BWs on US?

 

[aj]

BTDT....if the Red Angus would let us in. Would there be an extra cost? Or would there be economic effiencies?

 

[aj]

As of right now....frosbite is in charge of the ASA EPD thinktank deal. Everthing will be run by her. If she approves a discussion call in will be set up and the shorthorn self admiration society will meet bi-weekly to plan strategy.

 

[knabe]

Oy.

 

[frostback]

As of right now....frosbite is in charge of the ASA EPD thinktank deal. Everthing will be run by her. If she approves a discussion call in will be set up and the shorthorn self admiration society will meet bi-weekly to plan strategy.

I could give a rats ass what any association does or doesn't do. I don't rely on any association to sell my stock, or give me info to do it. I am not even a member in any of them. If you want a change and answers to your questions DO IT YOURSELF. You want to talk about something talk but you can get all the answers you want with a phone call. I've already looked up the numbers for you, half the job.

 

[aj]

Well OK. I have talked to a couple people. We may set up a facebook page on the deal. I hate the mandatory reporting part of the deal but I am convinced that we need to get Shorthorn EPDs set up on say the say level as the Angus. "Making the label easy to read" so to speak. We fogure it would take two years to get it changed. I doubt anything will happen because we are out hear in fly over country. I hate the computer part of the facebook deal.....but maybe this wild media sources could help.

 

[aj]

The more people we can get looking into it the better. It may not be do able. Information needs to be collected and digested.

 

[knabe]

so why don't you identify herds that report and purchase from them, report and build inertia, accumulate traits you want like acceptable growth, acceptable rib eye, increased marbling, low bw.  you have $16,000 of registrations of progress or whatever it was.  surely you've made some progress.

 

[irishshorthorns]

It wasn't clear on how to use the rod page but is deerpark improver really 2nd in marbling?

That could be possible. I think Galloway are excellent at marbling.

 

Hmmmmm, yes quite possibly. They are also very docile animals too. Maybe you could cross them on the Wolf Willow Major Leroy daughters!

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

It wasn't clear on how to use the rod page but is deerpark improver really 2nd in marbling?

That could be possible. I think Galloway are excellent at marbling.

 

Hmmmmm, yes quite possibly. They are also very docile animals too. Maybe you could cross them on the Wolf Willow Major Leroy daughters!

Sarcarsm?  ???  ???

Not understood?

 

[aj]

Are the red Angus and the black Angus essentially on the same EPD system. With some blacks crossing over to Red this would be handy. Another question. Since the red angus was essentially the red headed step child initially......how did their epd develop? Did the copy the black angus formulation at any time. Thanks in advance.

 

[knabe]

Sarcarsm?  ???  ???

Not understood?

not sarcasm to me.  that's exactly what i would do.

in fact, that's what i would do with xbar's bull with a daughter by leroy out of a 57 cow that i knew had marbling.

i don't see how it's that hard.

everything is there for anyone to do.

i don't really see what utility creating obstacles when there are none does.

 

[cbcr]

NO, the Red Angus and the Black Angus are not on the same EPD base.

I know the main question on here was looking at the multi-breed evaluation with the breeds that joined with Simmental, even their base is not on Angus nor comparable to Angus.

Even though their are different evaluations performed by different groups, everyone still uses their own base for calculations, so they still are not comparable to Angus.

Look at the BIF adjustment tables and you will see.  Angus, with BIF is a zero and all of the other breeds then have adjustment factors that need to be used for adjustment to compare to the Angus

http://www.beefimprovement.org/PDFs/2012/Across-Breed-EPD-Factors.pdf

 

[aj]

brc......Ahhhhh man.....total rained on my parade. You are probably right. But I do know my favorite Red Angus bulls from a 60 to a 100 yearling epd this last year. I was told that it was some kinda adjustment due to the Simmental hook up. If I start my Shangus breed.......I am going to set it where my yearling epd figures will bang in around plus 200. Just to out due the Angus 110 plus yearling epds. steer planet grin.

 

[aj]

I wonder how they work the deal when a black angus line gets shoved over int0 the Red Angus side?

 

[cbcr]

AJ,

With the Black Angus, he will get an evaluation thru the Red Angus (Simmental)

So to give you an example look at Connealy Consensus 7229

Simmental is CED 12, BW -1.0, WW 74.2, YW 120
Angus      is CED 5, BW +2.0, WW 65, YW 107

Now using the BIF adjustments for the Simmental
BIF Adjusted BW +4.2, WW 99.1, YW 142.4

Now using the Bif Adjustments using the Angus EPDs
BIF Adjusted BW -2.2, WW 40.1, YW 84.6

If these adjustments were right, then using the BIF adjustments the numbers should be comparable, are they? NO

AJ, if you get ready to start your Shangus breed let us know!!

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

Thank you Knabe.
Some times is hard understand what exactly is posted.
Here in Brazil black and reds are on same herd book, and they are evaluated together.
Many red breeders are using black bulls for dissimulate some color and structure faults.