Steroid use and implants

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chambero

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kobo_ranch said:
I meant I know I need something--personally!!  LOL

I just really wanted to know what does go on.  It's just hard to compete fairly when there are those few that do whatever it takes to win!!
But I guess that's the world we live in today--certainly not just in the show cattle!

I've been around showing steers in Texas since the mid 80s.  Back when you could pretty much do what you want - and we followed along and tried some of the stuff mentioned previously in this thread along with some other things.  NONE of them made a hill of beans difference in the calves.    

Back then, we didn't have access to the legal things we do now.  You can put as much or more muscle than most calves can stand using Revalor implants and Optaflexx.  The legal stuff does just as much as anything else they might be trying.

Whoever is telling you that these "substances" are the reason you are getting beat doesn't know what they are talking about.  If they didn't tell you what those things are specifically, there is a 99% probability they are talking out their ***.  The people that really use them have enough sense to keep their mouth shut.  I'm sure some people try plenty of things I don't know about now, but they are primarily wasting their money and taking unncecssary chances.  Drug tests at major shows are the proof.  Although Texas shows keep things pretty confidential, there aren't many at all DQd.  One of my high school classmates is the official vet for one of our majors.  He says by far the most common thing caught is dex with antibiotics being a close second.  And even those usually only amount to a calf or two per show per year.

It is an easy crutch for people to think they are getting beat because they aren't cheating.  Don't fall into that trap - it won't help you.  In reality, there are just some really, really good calves out there.  It's not easy to raise them or even find them to buy.  You can do everything right, spend lots of money, and it still doesn't always work.  There are hundreds if not thousands of people, each with anywhere from a few to a few thousand cows, trying to raise these steers.  The best of the best find their way to Texas.  That's what is beating you.  Just enjoy the "trying".  Or, you can go spend a bunch of money with one of the prominent steer jocks and improve your chances, but don't think that's a guarantee for anything.

When you see a calf that is dwarfing yours in thickness, etc. - more often than not you are looking at a spring born calf showing against your fallborn.  People pull them back hard for the prospect shows so the show weights are similar.  That's what a lot of the monster calves at Fort Worth are - spring borns, regardless of weight.  Things even out in a hurry by the time you get to San Antonio and Houston.

The implant/Optaflexx combination is pretty stout.  A few may have access to the other feedlot additive out there (the really, really expensive stuff).  I was tied across from two breed champ/reserve steers at Houston this year that were obviously pretty hopped up on hormones.  Not that I was staring, but I was impressed that both (along with some other calves from their area) were able to have full, prolonged erections.  That was the first time I'd run across that to that extent.  However, whatever it was had to be legal because it was obviously still in their system and more than one of those calves placed in the actual carcass contest.

A New Orleans Saint football player two or three years ago got caught with Clenbuterol in their system.  I knew another football player at a small college I went to that tried the same dose of Lasix on himself that he used on his pigs and nearly killed himself trying to make "weight" that a coach set for him.  He was a lineman of course.  I figure some of the stuff associated with the Balko investigations you hear so much about got tried on steers at some point, but don't think for a second folks aren't a lot more careful after the authorities got serious on the Clenbuterol.
 

knabe

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simtal said:
If consumers are concerned about consumption of hormones, my concerns are with phytoestrogens in plants.

which is why the chinese feed soybean to prisoners.  vegetarians have the same designs.  discrimination is their core value.
 

DLD

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sw Oklahoma
Some great perspectives throughout this thread, especially from OH Breeder and Chambero.  Really can't add much to that...
 

RDelesandri Cattle

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Jul 4, 2009
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I would say Chambero just about nailed it. Epecailly the third paragraph. You dont get any closer to the truth than what he stated in that paragraph.
 

yuppiecowboy

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Jun 3, 2007
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Chambero you made me laugh out loud! You are so right! I am in Iowa and I am putting CIDRs in cows for may calves  the southern boys are going to call fall borns!

Couple things my daddy taught me...

"Those that talk, dont know. Those that know, dont talk."

"people that brag are full of it. If you are good other people will talk about you."

"Only way two people can keep a secret is if one of em is dead"
 

SPL

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Apr 19, 2009
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Georgia
In reference to Balco as mentioned by Chambero, I have heard that "The Clear" was trenbelone acetate.
 

DL

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Jan 29, 2007
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yuppiecowboy said:
DL could help me here, but I am near positive it is not a steroid. In fact if you really wanted to, you could make the same compound by reducing Aspirin, Coca-Cola, and diet pills woth Ephedra. Caffeine, Asylacitic (sp?) Acid, and Ephedra.

YC - you are correct - clenbuterol is not a steroid - it is what is called an alpha 2 agonist - alpha receptors are part of the sympathetic (vs the central) nervous system and are important in controlling lots of things (heart rate, blood pressure, breathing, sweating etc) - clenbuterol effects the alpha 2 receptors - - in the respiratory system of most mammals stimulating alpha 2 receptors improves breathing but also has effects on the heart - so can lead to heart problems and death - one of the "side effects" is increased muscle which is why it has been used illegally both in cattle and body builders - I don't think it has any hair effects ;)
 

Steer4Caddy

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Jun 28, 2009
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Texas
There are good calves out there that never have a chance and many times it is because the feeder doesn't use implants, etc.  Revalor makes a big difference. 

The "more expensive feedlot ingredient" Chambero was talking about is what is producing the freakish stout ones you see at San Antonio and Houston today.  Although they won't always win depending on the judge's preference.  That product is not available to most people even though it is legal to feed.  Those select few that have access to it have a big advantage.  Just ask the goat and sheep guys about that one.

Buy a calf from pretty much any prominent Steer Jock in Texas and they'll flat out tell you they'll air your calf anytime....if you ask.  I'm sure there is probably more they can do I just don't know about.  If football players have figured out how to beat tests, I'm sure they have also.

On the positive side however, it's pretty nice when you still just raise a better one and beat em anyway..... doing it the right way. 

Yes. All the good ones at Fort Worth are Spring Borns from up North sold as August steers in Texas.
 

blackcows

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Steer4Caddy said:
Yes. All the good ones at Fort Worth are Spring Borns from up North sold as August steers in Texas.

We have showed a few steers at county fair but breeding cattle are more our thing so I don't know a lot about the steer deal.  What would be the purpose of changing the birth date of a steer?  We all know some people forget to check pastures and may be off a month or two on heifer birth dates which could give them an advantage as females are shown by birth date but since steers are shown by weight who cares what the birth date is?

Mike
 

simtal

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Champaign, IL
Steer4Caddy said:
The "more expensive feedlot ingredient" Chambero was talking about is what is producing the freakish stout ones you see at San Antonio and Houston today.  Although they won't always win depending on the judge's preference.  That product is not available to most people even though it is legal to feed.  Those select few that have access to it have a big advantage.  Just ask the goat and sheep guys about that one.

Zilmax. Legal to feed, however in the above example is off label.
 
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