What to do with this calf? Thoughts?

[JTM]

I voted that you should keep him as a herd bull and let him grow. This bull calf has a lot to offer for a Maine Anjou. Hopefully he is a purebred. The only thing he lacks is depth of rib but that is typical with maine anjou genetics at this age and with the traditional genetics. Length of body, thickness, width on top, bull looking head, powerful foot and bone, and a powerful hip. I think I would keep that calf a bull for sure if he was a purebred Maine and was born unassisted, birthweight decent, and I didn't have a bunch that were better. I definitely like him better than the other bulls you posted. I helped sell a bull that looked a lot like this to LinnetteJane a number of years back. I believe he was a DJ Databank son.

 

[blackdiamond]

Knabe, I'm not interested in learning--- but I want to learn about the people.

I guess the true cattle evaluators stepped to the plate- the rest couldn't pick a diamond in a pile of ****.

Well, I'll go ahead and close the poll.  20 people just cut a bull that has calves on the ground, and looks as good as any mature bull has ever looked.

Here's the life story of the bull with the picture above.

Born April 2010.
Pictured Oct. 2010 (1st above, and 1st below)
Turned out with cows, and his first calves started arriving middle of Jan, 2012. (2nd pic below is at ~16 months).  Ended up siring 15-20 calves born Jan - July 2012.
Lived through the drought of 2012, 3rd photo below taken in August, with no supplemental grain.
Got another 10 or so fall calves, plus plenty more arriving daily. pictured next Dec 2012
Updated picture, and tell me this bull lacks masculinity, muscle, rib, or fleshing ability.

Thanks for playing

I will give you my honest opinion... This calf is long from end to end, big, stout boned, strong over his top line while displaying some excellent slope hooks to pins.  HOWEVER, he wants to turn in on his toe on his back right foot (could also be the way he is standing).  When you get back and really look at this side profile he seems to be a little hard sided, not to mention he gets pinched in his for-rib, maybe just a little  straight in that back hock. Looking past the hair that is pulled down in his flank, I would like to see him dropped down more.  For me has does not have enough belly at all.  When I look at a bull I want them to be big boned, soggy in the middle, deep flanked, a little more set to the hock than this guy has, cleaner through that front 1/3 on his brisket.  The are just my opinions, knock them down however you want to but I am not changing them.  You asked for honest, well here you go.  Also, if I have a calf that I am questioning whether or not to keep him a bull I usually end up cutting him.  I think if you look at your own cattle everyday and you see one that screams bull then keep don't cut him.  Now that said, everyone looks at cattle a different way.  All that matters is what you think this bull could do for your herd.  IF you end up selling semen on him then, yes, you should seek other opinions.

Yes, I think you pretty much nailed him.  Thanks!

 

[shortyjock89]

I would have cut him. I'm glad you like him, but to me he's just not that good. You're still contradicting yourself by the way.

 

[frostback]

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Re: The bull that wasn't in Denver

« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2013, 09:29:16 PM »

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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I do appreciate all the comments on our bull, both good and bad.  I know any time  you put and animal up on this forum, you are setting yourself up for criticism.  I have seen people ask over and over to see a top bull in their working close, and not all covered up in hair, and fat, and whatever else is done to these bull when they are presented.  Well I am doing just that, and presenting a real world bull for the world to see. The public can see the progression of him from being a calf until present, and there has been absolutely no funny business in his presentation.  Some may not the outcome, but this type of transparency is how we do business.

Thanks again for everyone that have viewed our bulls pics and videos, and also thank you to all for your honest feedback






This is how a real man asks and takes criticism. Not saying that the ones who agreed with you are right and anyone else is wrong.

 

[Sassy2899]

your so welcome blackdiamond.  Maybe if you wanted a different answer you should have posted those pictures first.  But like I said before I stand by what I say and I still don't like him as a bull.  Still has the same things wrong with him in my opinion. FYI he does lack rib and flash in my eyes.  You asked for opinions if you don't like it, well then don't ask.  Sucks when you ask for "The Truth".

 

[ROMAX]

Why is this idiot still here? He posts a pic of a bull that we all have seen on here before and then asks if he should be cut?HE IS OBVIOSLY FISHING FOR SOME CONTROVERSY! I called you a DOUCHE in another thread and i will call you a DOUCHE in this one as well.

 

[thunderdownunder]

As a calf and as a three year old.... he shouldn't have nuts. I'm sure he'd taste good though.

 

[GM]

Its like deja vu all over again - http://www.steerplanet.com/bb/the-big-show/any-interest-in-red-purebred-maines/msg340661/#msg340661

 

[trevorgreycattleco]

Jody, if nothing else, maybe posting less with more substance in each post is a better avenue. You have your enemies but you also have folks who relate to you. What happens now is up to you. In my case progress is painfully slow. One step forward, two steps back. But you can't quit. If you believe in it, go for it. Let your cattle do the talking. The problem with cows is it takes so damn long and we have to much idle time to bitch at each other.

 

[showsteerdlux]

As a calf and as a three year old.... he shouldn't have nuts. I'm sure he'd taste good though.

If we are judging by pics neither should the bull you were praising on another thread today.

 

[vc]

I said cut him, knowing it was probably a set up, he did turn out better than he looked like he would. I will bet you dollars to donuts that it would not have been the first calf that was steered that may have turned out, just like bulls that were left whole when they should have been steered.
Most producers would love to have a crystal ball so they could see what a bull calf would look like at three when they were making their "should they stay or should they go" decisions.

I guess you got me.

 

[blackdiamond]

I said cut him, knowing it was probably a set up, he did turn out better than he looked like he would. I will bet you dollars to donuts that it would not have been the first calf that was steered that may have turned out, just like bulls that were left whole when they should have been steered.
Most producers would love to have a crystal ball so they could see what a bull calf would look like at three when they were making their "should they stay or should they go" decisions.

I guess you got me.

Just have to know the genetics at hand.

In the true linebreeding operations, they can tell you on day 1 if that animal is unique or herd builder status...  Too bad that the crossed up mongrels can't do that. 

Personlly, one bull pops into my head as should have been a steer-- was actually geared to be a $1200 steer for a county fair...  and look what he did.

 

[Stargell8]

Testicles? How are they?

 

[blackdiamond]

Testicles? How are they?

]
big enough.

 

[aj]

You can not judge cattle by photos.....you can't, you can't, you can't,. You can evaluate what your eyes perceive but it is seldom accurate. Professional photographers will spend a day....and all kinds of lighting.......angles.........backgrounds and thousands of dollars to photograph a hamburger for a Wendy's hamburger. Different exposures.......different lighting.....micky mouse with colors. YOU CANNOT EVALUATE CATTLE BY PICTURES. |It is fun and it is convenient....but NO.

 

[shortyjock89]

When somebody constantly asks me to, how am I gonna tell him no?  I agree, but sometimes that's all we have to go on.

 

[frostback]

I love the photos on this place. Yes it is not the best way to judge cattle but it sure does give you a idea of what someone needs help with. More than the cattle I love looking at the backgrounds. I have seen some places I may never see in person.

 

[renegadelivestock]

You can not judge cattle by photos.....you can't, you can't, you can't,. You can evaluate what your eyes perceive but it is seldom accurate. Professional photographers will spend a day....and all kinds of lighting.......angles.........backgrounds and thousands of dollars to photograph a hamburger for a Wendy's hamburger. Different exposures.......different lighting.....micky mouse with colors. YOU CANNOT EVALUATE CATTLE BY PICTURES. |It is fun and it is convenient....but NO.

i worked for a well know holstein photographer, and you would not believe to things that get done to make them look good, things that you can see in real life, but you can't see in a photo. did you know that you can not tell the difference between shaving cream, and white hair in a photo? we did many a topline with shaving cream, and made very plain cows a lot more angular, and solid topped than they actually were