Canada Shorthorn People.

[aj]

Trev it's crazy. When I put steers on feed in Oct they were talking about a 80 cent cost of gain. Talked to a feedlot guy yesterday and he was thinking now about at least a dollar. They lay in wet corn in the fall then buy their dry corn as needed basis. Yesterday I sold a cull bull and a cull cow for a 2100$ total at the salebarn. It is getting goofy out there. Very volatile.

 

[justintime]

I googled up some info. Canada has 5 million beef cows and 1.5 million calves are shipped to the USA. Canada has 5 million beef cows where Texas has 14 million cattle in their state alone. Are Canada's cows bigger and better than Texas cows? Where does Alaska rate in cow numbers in the USA? Is there a Alaska Livestock Assn.? What % of the industry is Canada in world wide production?

aj...Welcome back!  I can see that your little " break" from SP hasn't changed your attitude. Please explain to me where anyone said that Canadian cattle are better than anyone elses? Please explain what the number of cows in Texas has to do with what I said? As per usual, you did not read what I said and you just started jumping to a bunch of conclusions ( why am I not surprised?) What has the number of Canadian cattle being slaughtered in the US have to do with what I said about average cow size in Canada?  Anyone who has been in this business any time at all, should realize that the cattle business in the US and Canada is a North American business.  Our packing plants are almost all American owned. Anyone who has been in this business any time, should realize that the large US feeders feed cattle wherever they can make the most money. For the past few months it is considerably cheaper to feed cattle in Canada than it is in the US. As a result, there is a much higher percentage of American owned feeder cattle in Canada than there is normally. We have had several Americans trying to purchase feedlots in the past few months. Why would they do this? Because they see an economic opportunity that is positive. When I was feeding cattle, I had many Americans interested in feeding in our feedlot. I have been out of the feeding business for seevral years, but I know the 30,000 head feedlot a few miles from me, has been packed to capacity with mostly American owned cattle and they are thinking of adding another 20,000 or more to their capacity. The manager of this feedlot, who is one of my bull customers, told me recently that he has had many requests to price the feedlot ... all from American cattle feeders.
It is not news to anyone, that the American beef herd and the US feeding industry is many times larger than those industries in Canada. That has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I have told you many times before that if you need a certain type of cow to remain in business in Kansas, then that is what you should raise. If someone else( your neighbor down the road, or someone in another area) can survive raising another type or size of cow, what makes them wrong and you right?. It could well be that they are making more profits than you are. I would be the first to say that if what you are doing works for you, that is just super... and that is what you should continue to do. So why is it wrong when someone else does the same thing?

 

[justintime]

Trev it's crazy. When I put steers on feed in Oct they were talking about a 80 cent cost of gain. Talked to a feedlot guy yesterday and he was thinking now about at least a dollar. They lay in wet corn in the fall then buy their dry corn as needed basis. Yesterday I sold a cull bull and a cull cow for a 2100$ total at the salebarn. It is getting goofy out there. Very volatile.

Don't you think it is about time we started to see prices like this? I have already heard some producers commenting that we are going to pay for these "high prices". What is wrong with these people? Absolutely everything we purchase in our day to day lives has increased in price many times faster than beef prices. A rancher told me recently that he purchased his first new half ton truck in 1973 from the sale of 18 feeder calves. I always remember that in 1974, I purchased a new 3/4 ton 4X4 and also purchased a new 20 ft gooseneck trailer the same day. I remember driving home and thinking I was totally crazy for having $7800 tied up in these two new items. A few months later I headed for Indiana with 8 head of cattle \i had sold. I had more than 3 times what the truck and trailer had cost me  on that trip and the highest price on that load was $3200. Now what would I have to sell 8 head for today to have more than 3 times what a new truck and trailer would cost? Most everything else we purchase is the same. It costs me as much to fill my fuel tank now, as I paid for all my fuel purhases for the year when I started farming full time.

We are seeing a strong market, but I would say it is about time! North Americans have for generations felt that food should be cheap but this mentality has to start changing... or there will not be anyone left producing it but the large corporate producers.... then watch what happens.  I would suggest that everyone go back into their records and see what they were selling commercial calves for 10 years ago. Then go to an Inflation calculator on the internet and see what you should be receiving today to have the same buying power. I just did this and it said that I needed to receive $4.17 per pound for my calves to have the same buying power as I had in 2001. Our prices today are not even close!

 

[TPX]

Are all the harvest plants in Canada little plants? Do they have any big packers. I was under the impression that 70% of Canadian cattle were shipped to the United States of America to be fed and harvested. Semi load after semi load after simi load if you believe some people. What kind of effiencies do you get anyway in a feedlot in Canada with minus 30 degree temps? Is corn readily available? What is the cost of gain running in Canada feedlots? What is the biggest feedlot in Canada?

In western Canada we don't feed corn we feed barley (you should have googled that to), when you see a steak with white fat on it there is a pretty good chance that it came from Western Canada.  Funny thing when we were in Orlando this past month we went to a fairly fancy restuarant and in there menu there steaks were listed as barley fed Canadian beef and was rated as the one of the best steaks in the state.  Feeding cattle in Canada is fairly easy and with it being a little colder up here it is fairly easy to start cattle on feed and the fats do good b/c they stay on feed better.  I am not sure what the cost of gain is running guys this year but I will find out on Monday.  Anyways its fairly warm here today and I worried that my igloo may melt.

 

[Okotoks]

Canada has about 10% the population of the US and about 12% of the cattle population. Vast areas of Canada are not able to be used for agriculture. Brazil has a large and growing cattle population and their cost of production are very low. Foot and Mouth is the only reason they have not taken over as much as they could.

http://www.thebeefsite.com/articles/2190/world-beef-trade-overview-october-2009


I would assume most Americans realize how big the Alaskan beef production is or actually isn't. The same reason there are very few cattle in Canada in the Yukon and negligble #'s in the Northwest Territories and probably none in Nunavit.

Well it's warm here today too so I too am worried my igloo will melt.

http://usda.mannlib.cornell.edu/MannUsda/viewDocumentInfo.do?documentID=1017

Cattle and Calves: Number by Class, State, and United States,
January 1, 2006-2007
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
: All Cattle and Calves : All Cows That Have Calved
:-----------------------------------------------------------------------
State : : : 2007 as : : : 2007 as
: 2006 : 2007 : % of 2006 : 2006 : 2007 : % of 2006
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
: ---- 1,000 Head ---- Percent ---- 1,000 Head ---- Percent
:
AL : 1,280 1,320 103 700 730 104
AK : 15.5 16.0 103 6.9 7.1 103
AZ : 940 940 100 355 350 99
AR : 1,710 1,750 102 920 940 102
CA : 5,450 5,500 101 2,450 2,490 102
CO : 2,650 2,700 102 780 840 108
CT : 52 53 102 25 26 104
DE : 23 23 100 11 11 100
FL : 1,680 1,730 103 1,050 1,080 103
GA : 1,180 1,170 99 670 660 99
HI : 161 158 98 92 89 97
ID : 2,110 2,180 103 945 975 103
IL : 1,330 1,340 101 550 530 96
IN : 900 900 100 375 400 107
IA : 3,800 3,950 104 1,240 1,280 103
KS : 6,650 6,400 96 1,660 1,610 97
KY : 2,380 2,460 103 1,220 1,300 107
LA : 820 860 105 495 520 105
ME : 92 86 93 44 43 98
MD : 230 220 96 119 110 92
MA : 47 44 94 24 22 92
MI : 1,030 1,060 103 415 435 105
MN : 2,350 2,420 103 835 860 103
MS : 990 980 99 550 540 98
MO : 4,500 4,450 99 2,320 2,260 97
MT : 2,400 2,400 100 1,450 1,400 97
NE : 6,500 6,650 102 1,990 2,000 101
NV : 500 500 100 265 260 98
NH : 39 35 90 20.0 18.5 93
NJ : 42 38 90 21 19 90
NM : 1,550 1,580 102 800 800 100
NY : 1,400 1,420 101 730 740 101
NC : 860 850 99 436 440 101
ND : 1,720 1,850 108 970 970 100
OH : 1,280 1,260 98 570 570 100
OK : 5,450 5,250 96 2,150 2,070 96
OR : 1,420 1,340 94 720 690 96
PA : 1,590 1,600 101 710 700 99
RI : 5.0 4.9 98 2.5 2.6 104
SC : 410 400 98 225 220 98
SD : 3,750 3,700 99 1,800 1,750 97
TN : 2,240 2,310 103 1,180 1,220 103
TX : 14,100 14,000 99 5,780 5,650 98
UT : 800 830 104 410 430 105
VT : 275 265 96 153 150 98
VA : 1,660 1,620 98 830 810 98
WA : 1,100 1,140 104 520 500 96
WV : 410 420 102 217 225 104
WI : 3,400 3,400 100 1,490 1,510 101
WY : 1,430 1,430 100 765 770 101
:
US : 96,701.5 97,002.9 100 42,056.4 42,023.2 100

Read the first figure after each state, and multiply by 1000. Example: Alabama has 12,800,000 cattle, while Alaska has 15,500. The entire US has almost 98 million.

********

 

[Okotoks]

Okotoks:  In your previous example you say that a 750 pound steer should be worth $825, and a 600 pound steer should be worth $810.  Now just for figuring sake lets say that each steer's mother weaned 50% of her bodyweight (good cows right?)  So the cow that weaned 750 pounds weighs 1500 pounds and the cow that weaned 600 pounds weighs 1200 pounds.  The difference in price of the calves was $15, correct?  Do you think you can support an additional 300 pounds of cow mass for 365 days with $15?  I don't!  This is just another example of how more pounds DON"T always mean more profit!  As far as smaller framed calves being "discounted at the sale barn, it has nothing to do with them being smaller framed, it has more to do with them being lighter and requiring more expensive corn to be finished, however if I were buying feeder cattle right now, you can bet your hat that I would be buying the smaller framed, earlier maturing cattle as they require less days on feed and from my experience, days on feed is the single largest factor for profitability in the feedlot.  Those bigger upper 6 and 7 frame cornburners will have such a big hole in your pocketbook by the time they go to the plant, you will never have a chance of seeing any black ink!  

Those numbers  I gave showed the traditional spread in calf size prices. Last week in Alberta 600 lb. steers averaged $1.315 = $789. and 750lb. steers $1.385= $1038.75
The point I was making was the packers want larger carcasses and the feedlots shorter keeps(due to high grain prices). The cow numbers are down a lot in Canada so I'm guessing the only way to keep the volume up is to feed the steers to larger carcass weights. I was not suggesting the smaller framed animals would not fill a need and make you money.
Also if you were to cull 30 cows ayear from a program and they averaged 1200 lbs.x .70 (selling to over 80 cents last week) you would get $25200. Sell 30 x 1500 lb. cows and you get $31,500. an extra $6300 or $210 per cow. If the cows average 8 years then that's an additional $30 for every year they produced. I am not big on measuring by frame, a good deep bodied easy fleshing cow that raises you a big calf will normally do you right by you. Different pasture conditions and feed sources will determine how big you want them in your own herd.
If the price of grain stays high we are going to need better prices than we are getting now for anyone to make money. Trevorgrey will do well if he can grass finish his.
35 Steers (2009) at Western Feedlots, Strathmore AB
Below are the results on some Eionmor steers. I think steers with that kind of performance and feed conversion work up here.
Weight In (Steers)
771 lbs.

Weight Out
1340 lbs.

Gain
569 lbs.

Days on Feed
112 days

#'s of Feed / # of Gain
4.97 lbs.

Average Daily Gain
5.08 lbs.

 

[TPX]

Barley is a great feed. I was with a feedlot that fed flaked barley. It was raised on irrigation and had a better feed value than corn and was cheaper to raise. There is nothing sweeter than meat fed on barley. It helped us get cattle into a higher % CAB back then. There are good cattle in Canada. There are great cattle in Canada. I am a fan of Muri's. I'm not sure who made you and Okytoks spokesman for the entire Canada continent. By the way okie I hope your sun burned nose is ok. I was going to send flowers up for your special dead cow but I didn't get it done. I do challenge you on the cow size deal. Why should anyone use your model of big cows if only 2% of the worlds beef population is raised above the 60 degree latitude? The Canada model is is not relevent. Now if someone in the nebraska sandhills tells me 1600 # cows is the way to go I will consider his arguement.In my opinion big cows are not good. Good cows are not big. That is my opinion. I disagree with your big cow philosophy. Oh my god someone disagrees with the annointed one. Whatever should we do?

No one appointed me the spokesman for the entire country of Canada (by the way we are a country and live on the same continent as you, if you look at a globe you might see that) and all I was doing was answering the questions that you had posted earlier.  I do agree with you that I will never go with bigger framed animals b/c they cost me to much money to raise and at the same time that is when we start to see birth weight issues and calving problems.  We sold all our shorthorn cows 4 years ago and have continued on with our purebred red angus since then and I can honestly say that we haven't helped a cow calve since and our red cattle are atleast 1 to 1.5 frame scores smaller then our shorthorns were.  Muri's have a very good program and there cattle our very self suffecient and I really admire what they have been able to build.  I find it funny that people think that our cattle may be bigger framed b/c in  red angus deal right now we hear alot of comments from americans that our cattle our smaller framed then what they would like. 

 

[coyote]

Posted by: aj "I am a fan of Muri's."

aj thanks for joining our fan club, I will send you the offical fan club certificate in the the mail tomorrow.  <party>
Our cow herd is like most herds, it is not perfect, some cows are to big, some are too small and some are just right. And like most herds we have had a year when the uggliest or smaller cow has brought in the best calf and then a year when the prettiest or largest cow has brought in the worst calf.
But I like a cow that is phenotypically shaped like our Muridale Goose cow, med. framed with pretty good capacity. Okotoks and JIT have cows in their herds that are built just like this also.

 

[aandtcattle]

I tried to put a reply on this thread and dont know where the hell it went.  Okotoks, did I accidentally send it as a private message?? If I did, I meant to post it.  Sleep deprivation is a terrible thing folks, the pendleton might not help either! LOL  Hey coyote, sorry I missed you in denver, I tried to make it but it just wasnt in the cards.

 

[aandtcattle]

Basically what it said is me and okotoks agree to disagree on cowsize.  At our place a "big cow" regardless of body type or composition is going to have a tough time being easy fleshing.  A cow that cant find enough to eat to support her body mass is going to be thin and open in the fall, I have seen it happen at our place.  We have begun running our replacement heifers really rough after weaning and then bangs vaccinating in January to sort the chaff from the grain, so to speak.  The heifers that are thin after running out on winter pasture without supplement for 3 months go to the feedlot, the ones that are fleshy on this program make damn good cows and are always very controlled on frame.  We love our 1000-1200 pound cows and they take care of us well.  I am not telling anyone else this is what they need.  But I have no room for compromise on mature cow size, no matter what.  This will be the last post I make regarding cow size, it has become too monotonous to continue.  Do what works for you, you are the one that has to take care of your cows 365 days a year, they better be what YOU like.
Long live<cowboy>

 

[Aussie]

Do what works for you, you are the one that has to take care of your cows 365 days a year, they better be what YOU like.

Would have to agree with this. (thumbsup)
I would rather have another breed other than Angus but can not justify the lost I would take but in saying that I have built a nice group of cows I enjoy working with and looking at that suit my environment and customers.
A old studman once told me if can walk through your herd when things are bad and they make you happy they are the right cows for you. Maybe a bit idealistic but there is a fair bit of truth in it. ;D

 

[DRB]

Okotoks:  In your previous example you say that a 750 pound steer should be worth $825, and a 600 pound steer should be worth $810.  Now just for figuring sake lets say that each steer's mother weaned 50% of her bodyweight (good cows right?)  So the cow that weaned 750 pounds weighs 1500 pounds and the cow that weaned 600 pounds weighs 1200 pounds.  The difference in price of the calves was $15, correct?  Do you think you can support an additional 300 pounds of cow mass for 365 days with $15?  I don't!  This is just another example of how more pounds DON"T always mean more profit!  As far as smaller framed calves being "discounted at the sale barn, it has nothing to do with them being smaller framed, it has more to do with them being lighter and requiring more expensive corn to be finished, however if I were buying feeder cattle right now, you can bet your hat that I would be buying the smaller framed, earlier maturing cattle as they require less days on feed and from my experience, days on feed is the single largest factor for profitability in the feedlot.  Those bigger upper 6 and 7 frame cornburners will have such a big hole in your pocketbook by the time they go to the plant, you will never have a chance of seeing any black ink!  

Those numbers  I gave showed the traditional spread in calf size prices. Last week in Alberta 600 lb. steers averaged $1.315 = $789. and 750lb. steers $1.385= $1038.75
The point I was making was the packers want larger carcasses and the feedlots shorter keeps(due to high grain prices). The cow numbers are down a lot in Canada so I'm guessing the only way to keep the volume up is to feed the steers to larger carcass weights. I was not suggesting the smaller framed animals would not fill a need and make you money.
Also if you were to cull 30 cows ayear from a program and they averaged 1200 lbs.x .70 (selling to over 80 cents last week) you would get $25200. Sell 30 x 1500 lb. cows and you get $31,500. an extra $6300 or $210 per cow. If the cows average 8 years then that's an additional $30 for every year they produced. I am not big on measuring by frame, a good deep bodied easy fleshing cow that raises you a big calf will normally do you right by you. Different pasture conditions and feed sources will determine how big you want them in your own herd.
If the price of grain stays high we are going to need better prices than we are getting now for anyone to make money. Trevorgrey will do well if he can grass finish his.
35 Steers (2009) at Western Feedlots, Strathmore AB
Below are the results on some Eionmor steers. I think steers with that kind of performance and feed conversion work up here.
Weight In (Steers)
771 lbs.

Weight Out
1340 lbs.

Gain
569 lbs.

Days on Feed
112 days

#'s of Feed / # of Gain
4.97 lbs.

Average Daily Gain
5.08 lbs.

I don't understand your prices on stockers - they are completely backwards of the averages in Ontario.  Generally our avg prices goes down by $0.10 /lb as you go up in stocker weight - so lighter calves and heavy ones don't really bring that much different.

Not sure if this will come out or not:

Week Ending Jan 27th, 2011 Stocker Steers averages:  ( http://www.cattle.guelph.on.ca/markets/weekly_reports/2011/20110128.pdf )

STOCKERS-Large and Medium Frame
STEERS  Volume Price Range Average Top Last week Avg
1000+  437 109.13-120.07 115.15 123.25 112.68
900-999  149 110.68-121.96 118.33 125.25 118.91
800-899  171 105.07-123.54 116.64 131.75 116.64
700-799  416 110.08-131.67 123.14 141.00 121.49
600-699  407 119.81-141.24 131.84 150.00 131.59
500-599  374 127.69-150.98 142.36 160.25 140.52
400-499  152 140.44-162.41 152.93 181.50 145.80
-399  98 115.54-158.24 141.06 184.00 123.06

 

[Shady Lane]

I'm not really sure how this thread turned into an optimal frame size debate?

But there was an interesting article published in the American Angus Journal a while ago on this exact subgect.

Here is a link.

http://www.angusjournal.com/articlePDF/finishweightsaffect.pdf

 

[Okotoks]

[/quote]

I don't understand your prices on stockers - they are completely backwards of the averages in Ontario.  Generally our avg prices goes down by $0.10 /lb as you go up in stocker weight - so lighter calves and heavy ones don't really bring that much different.

Not sure if this will come out or not:

Week Ending Jan 27th, 2011 Stocker Steers averages:  ( http://www.cattle.guelph.on.ca/markets/weekly_reports/2011/20110128.pdf )

STOCKERS-Large and Medium Frame
STEERS  Volume Price Range Average Top Last week Avg
1000+  437 109.13-120.07 115.15 123.25 112.68
900-999  149 110.68-121.96 118.33 125.25 118.91
800-899  171 105.07-123.54 116.64 131.75 116.64
700-799  416 110.08-131.67 123.14 141.00 121.49
600-699  407 119.81-141.24 131.84 150.00 131.59
500-599  374 127.69-150.98 142.36 160.25 140.52
400-499  152 140.44-162.41 152.93 181.50 145.80
-399  98 115.54-158.24 141.06 184.00 123.06

[/quote]
You are right I had reversed the numbers.
It should have been last week in Alberta 600 lb. steers averaged $1.385 = $831. and 750 lb. steers $1.315= $986.25. The bigger steer still brings $155.25 more and my point was the spread between the weight ranges has shrunk instead of being the 10 cents you are showing for Ontario last week and that is traditional here as well. The narrower difference is only recent here and may be an aberration or it may be a trend . Time will tell.

 

[jaimiediamond]

Please give me the rundown on all the recent day (past 20 years or so) herd bulls north of the border that have been fabulous female makers- you know the deep, soggy, easy fleshing kind.  Don't have to be big boned, super stout, or any specific color.  Now worried about BW's either-- something to be used on cows, not heifers. 

Basically, a list of bulls that I would be looking for in the pedigrees of a potential bull to use AI. 

Back on topic since I believe that the question regarded what Canadian Shorthorn Cattle are out there, I would recommend that you should research for yourself on this topic, as everyone has varying opinions (as we have seen).  Mine is that there are so many strong Canadian Shorthorn herds coast to coast that offer a lot for most programs on the South side of the border.  In the end you have to figure out what compliments your own program.  To make your research easier http://www.canadianshorthorn.com/links.htm this link is by no means a good representation of the number of herds but it gives you a starting point.  Then you could use both the American Shorthorn Association http://search.shorthorn.org/default.aspx and CLRC http://www.clrc.ca/cgi-bin/query.cgi?_association=21 to see what each animal that suites your program has done. This is the tool I use when I am looking for cattle.

 

[sue]

Shazam? How can this be. (clapping)

Regarding the original question. Make the trip and see for yourself.... I did... I bet if you're there writing a $6000  check for a  5 frame bull the stories  will change. It did for me??  You'll get a break on hotels and the exchange  rate is ok. I might add that when you visit herds, ask about vaccination programs? See if they serve american beer or just canadian during your visits? 

 

[aj]

In red noses case......don't let the facts get in the way of a good story. ;D

 

[aj]

Are there any operations up there that raise welsh ponies? I need a good cow pony to rope off of?

 

[comercialfarmer]

I googled up some info. Canada has 5 million beef cows and 1.5 million calves are shipped to the USA. Canada has 5 million beef cows where Texas has 14 million cattle in their state alone. Are Canada's cows bigger and better than Texas cows? Where does Alaska rate in cow numbers in the USA? Is there a Alaska Livestock Assn.? What % of the industry is Canada in world wide production?

I don't have anything constructive to add, but this really cracked me up and I am sad I missed it earlier....  I need an emoticon that is rolling on the ground laughing!  Texas?  Really?  Texas?  Yes when I travel through the lone star state, I think... man, if only all the cattle could look like this.  We could use an entire continent filled with eeeeeeeared cattle.  I haven't seen all 14 million, but I travel quite a bit down there.  Being that you are so closely associated with the feedlot industry, I would like to see you take a cut of average cattle in mid texas and average cattle in mid Canada and see what you get on the rail.  Or just resale in any Kansas, Nebraska, Colorado, Wyoming, or  Montana auction.  I know when I was in some feedlots in Kansas in the early 2000's, there was no love to be found for the eared Texas bovine.   

It has already been said over and over, each area will likely have a type that will work for them- or at least perceived.  I think it is funny that human kind has domesticated livestock as long as we have, and there are the same arguments today as when it started.  I understand the need for efficient cows, and I understand the need for growth.  I see some people setting up shop in the middle and doing well.  But I can also see benefit to putting a growthy bull on some efficient cows.  Which I tend to believe will benefit me the most.

No matter what type you are after, I do think that having a line of cattle that produce nice bulls and females is where it should start. 

Okay, I do have something on topic:
I guess I am afflicted by some disease, as I am always looking at cattle.  This guy looked interesting on the screen  http://www.crookedpost.ca/shorthorn/animalProfile.htm?name=Crooked%2520Post%2520Grissom%252024T&animalType=Herd%2520Sire&returnPage=herdSires.htm 

Just curious, anyone have any thoughts on him?

 

[Okotoks]

I googled up some info. Canada has 5 million beef cows and 1.5 million calves are shipped to the USA. Canada has 5 million beef cows where Texas has 14 million cattle in their state alone. Are Canada's cows bigger and better than Texas cows? Where does Alaska rate in cow numbers in the USA? Is there a Alaska Livestock Assn.? What % of the industry is Canada in world wide production?

I don't have anything constructive to add, but this really cracked me up and I am sad I missed it earlier....  I need an emoticon that is rolling on the ground laughing!   Texas?  Really?  Texas?  Yes when I travel through the lone star state, I think... man, if only all the cattle could look like this.  We could use an entire continent filled with eeeeeeeared cattle.  I haven't seen all 14 million, but I travel quite a bit down there.  Being that you are so closely associated with the feedlot industry, I would like to see you take a cut of average cattle in mid texas and average cattle in mid Canada and see what you get on the rail.  Or just resale in any Kansas, Nebraska, Colorado, Wyoming, or  Montana auction.  I know when I was in some feedlots in Kansas in the early 2000's, there was no love to be found for the eared Texas bovine.   

It has already been said over and over, each area will likely have a type that will work for them- or at least perceived.  I think it is funny that human kind has domesticated livestock as long as we have, and there are the same arguments today as when it started.  I understand the need for efficient cows, and I understand the need for growth.  I see some people setting up shop in the middle and doing well.  But I can also see benefit to putting a growthy bull on some efficient cows.  Which I tend to believe will benefit me the most.

No matter what type you are after, I do think that having a line of cattle that produce nice bulls and females is where it should start. 

Okay, I do have something on topic:
I guess I am afflicted by some disease, as I am always looking at cattle.  This guy looked interesting on the screen  http://www.crookedpost.ca/shorthorn/animalProfile.htm?name=Crooked%2520Post%2520Grissom%252024T&animalType=Herd%2520Sire&returnPage=herdSires.htm 

Just curious, anyone have any thoughts on him?

Crooked Post Grissom is a really good and useful bull in my opinion. Crooked Post is like Waukaru north. They have used a lot of Waukaru bloodlines and blended in some Canadian bred lines. I really like the fleshing ability of Grissom. Crooked Post have also used his full brother Crooked Post Arbutus and Tom says he has a little more performance .
CE +2.3,  BW 2.2 WW29  YW47 Milk +8
BW 83lbs.  weaning 903 lbs. Yearling 1213 lbs
Red polled, by Byland Gold Spear ou of a Bodacious dam and grand dam was a Downsview Red Rose by Eionmor Mr. Gus 71Z.

Crooked Post also bred the Crooked Post Boston Bodacious bull that Waukaru used. Bodacious is the grandsire of Waukaru Patent and Top Shelf.