I have a Char/Angus heifer that I will breed this fall; what do you all recommend I breed her to ? She will be upper moderate framed, has ample muscle & length, is fairly clean throated, and is sound. I like the Vanilla Ice bull but I don't know if he will work on a heifer.
Charolais / Angus Heifer
- Thread starter shortdawg
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shortdawg said:
Well shortdawg you know my philosophy on heifer breeding - breed 'em to a proven (not just because the semen seller says this yearling bull should work great on heifers!) calving ease bull - maximize your chances for a healthy calf and a heifer who survives and thrives her first calving - I try never to gamble with heifers. There is very little market in Michigan for a great dead calf (could be better in the "real cattle states") ...bouncing babies and bouncing heifers - that is my goal! (clapping) (clapping)
TJ
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dragon lady said:
DL & I think a lot alike on this issue...
I wont ever gamble on a heifers future... especially if she is a "good one". Like DL mentioned, a "great dead calf" is not worth much in Michigan (and it isn't worth much in the "real cattle states" or any other state that I am aware of). Like DL's goal, bouncing babies & heifers that breed back quickly after their 1st calf is what it is all about, IMHO. I've tried it the "other way" too, using borderline (at best) calving ease bulls & even breeding heifers to bulls that you just almost knew you would be pulling atleast 50-75% of the calves. That might be for some, but I will not do it ever again, which is one big reason why I breed full sized Tarentaise, Angus, Charolais, Red Angus & commercial heifers to Lowline bulls. I've yet to pull a calf since I started using them & you can't beat 100% calf crops or heifers that actually breed up one heat cycle after their 1st calf!!
To answer your question... I don't know a lot about Vanilla Ice, other than I think that he has a low 80 birth weight, so I may be way off base. However, since the heifer has Charolais in her (which aren't typically the easiest calving), I'd be kinda scared to do it, but that's just me. I think that you'd probably be better off using a proven, calving ease Shorthorn, a proven, calving ease Maine or a proven, calving ease Angus (Black, Red or Lowline). Anyway, that is just my opinion.
Show Heifer
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I always stay with PROVEN calving ease bulls....If ya something showy, try Juneau, Legend, TC Freedom, or BR Midland. I don't think I would ever go "clubbie" with a heifer...those three way crosses have way to much "wiggle room" for me....maybe a 70 pounder, maybe a 120 pounder, its a roll of the dice, and I am just not that lucky!!!
If you insist on going "clubbie" try Jakes Proud Jazz (shorthorn) or Pale face (1/2 maine). Both are pretty proven as far as calving ease, but still a gamble I wouldn't take!!
If you insist on going "clubbie" try Jakes Proud Jazz (shorthorn) or Pale face (1/2 maine). Both are pretty proven as far as calving ease, but still a gamble I wouldn't take!!
TJ
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Show Heifer said:
I almost mentioned Jake's Proud Jazz because I knew that Shortdawg likes him & he is low birth weight. I just wasn't 100% sure if he was "proven" on heifers, but it is good to know that he is. With that in mind, I have little doubt that he is probably a better heifer option than "Vanilla" & probably would sire a very nice calf.
I also agree with you about using 3 way composites & calving ease... especially on a Charolais cross heifer... it's just too much like Las Vegas for me!!
If you don't go with an Angus, I'd go with a purebred Maine ease bull on that one. Witchdoctor, Ali, or Hard Core would be my choices if you want a shot at getting a good steer. Slightly more risky might be Total Solution (crossbred WMH son).
If a half-blood Charolais bull, I don't think you could beat Yellowjacket. His momma is as good a Charolais as has walked, his daddy (Lifeline) is as proven as any on Charolais cows, and Yellowjackets first calf crop was very good with outstanding black and yellow calves.
If a half-blood Charolais bull, I don't think you could beat Yellowjacket. His momma is as good a Charolais as has walked, his daddy (Lifeline) is as proven as any on Charolais cows, and Yellowjackets first calf crop was very good with outstanding black and yellow calves.
cowz
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I dont think a 3 way is the way to go on your smoky heifer. If you want to go Charolais, try Fred's Husker, Baldridge Fasttrack. If you want to go maine, consider Jazz. We have used all of these on heifers with good results.
showcattlegal
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I didn't like my Ali calves at frist but now there my best ones. I would use him again in a heart beat.
Chap
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I used ALI on 10 Char/Angus heifers this spring. I will let you know how that turns out in February.
Freddy
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I like the ALI bull a lot but I have heard various reports on using him on heifers, my nephew used him on smoke heifer an had a very big dead calf an heifer that didn,t look so good for a while. We calve purebred Chars to SUCESS- TAZ- AN HOT TODDY an have done it for three years, very seldom help them.We also use NORTHERN GUN on these heifers with great success. The reason I use these sires ,are they usually are saleable , something the straight Chars would not be.
afhm
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The Vanilla Ice doesn't have any big bw's in his pedigree I can't remeber his actual bw but don't think it was very high. Alias, Who, and Meyer are all ok on their calving. It could be worth a try. Oahe Wind is a pb Charolais that will work on heifers Thomas Ranch uses him heavily on their heifers.
TJ
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shortdawg said:
I was thinking hard about using White Chocolate, but have been told that he has some soundness issues when he walks. Can't say if that is so, but that's what I've heard. Kinda disappointed me, because I liked him.
I've seen several real nice looking pics of Yellow Jacket calves, but had no idea he was calving ease.
OH Breeder
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I have had good luck with Northern Improvement and Gizmo. I really lke the Northern Improvement calves. They are small and lively. Fancy made. The gizmo's seem to be a little meatier!. Both came small and have done a great job for me. I tried Ali, but he was not a cow changer for me. There are lots of good proven calving ease sires to use.
shortdawg said:
I'm sorry to confuse things, I was referring to Yellow Jacket for later calves. I haven't seen him used on a heifer. His sire, Lifeline, isn't bad on calving ease and I doubt Yellow Jacket is either. I just mentioned him for consideration on down the road if you are wanting a good half-blood Charolais bull that isn't all crossed up or with any of the genetic defects. Yellow Jacket needs to be used on clean fronted cows. He is a stout, sound bull but not "freaky fronted" - which I consider a good thing for a bull honestly. He looks like a bull.
I don't know anything about White Chocolate.
CAB
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Been watching the Yellow Jacket bull. Is it hard to pull black calves back out of him? It still is best to have black calves here in the midwest.
Do the Taz cows have nice udders in them & will they milk? Don't like the unpredictabilty of milking abilty of the Heatwaves & am trying to figure out where the lack of comes from. I hate a cow that can't milk or blow out bags when they are entering their prime productive years. Thanks for any info. Cab
Do the Taz cows have nice udders in them & will they milk? Don't like the unpredictabilty of milking abilty of the Heatwaves & am trying to figure out where the lack of comes from. I hate a cow that can't milk or blow out bags when they are entering their prime productive years. Thanks for any info. Cab
As far as I know the Taz females make fine cows. Kris Black has sold a bunch of them. They ought to be fine on the milking side with the close ties back to Cunia. I've personally seen a bunch of very nice calves out of him still on the momma and as bred heifers. I don't have any Taz cows because we've got our own Cunia son we use.
Bred to a homozygous black cow, you should get 50% yellow and 50% black calves out of Yellowjacket if I have things figured in my head correctly.
I saw a few black calves out of Yellowjacket last spring that had plenty of hair.
Bred to a homozygous black cow, you should get 50% yellow and 50% black calves out of Yellowjacket if I have things figured in my head correctly.
I saw a few black calves out of Yellowjacket last spring that had plenty of hair.
Thanks for all the input . I'll decide for sure in a month or so. The blue roan heifer I aked for input from you all on last fall had a smoker of a steer prospect out of Witchdoctor back on 9/10. He is also blue roan and should work well for my youngest boy.
