White Shorthorn Bulls

[nate53]

I think there is a line of unbeatable carcass(black angus) out there. However they are not the black simmental,black limi's, black gelbviehs, black maines, or black whatever the hell. There are acres and acres of counterfit blacks out there.

I agree acres and acres!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[JTM]

I really like this thread and how it has progressed. Especially since my program is currently on both sides of this discussion. Most of our Shorthorn calves this year are sired by a white Shorthorn bull that we actually sold through steer planet about a month ago. They are really nice calves. Also, we have a new group of black commercial cows that will be bred to TG/RRA Complete 421U which is a solid red 3/4 shorthorn 1/4 red angus bull we got from trevorgrey. Being in Ohio, we also get destroyed taking white and roan feeders to united reducers. As of last year I will no longer be doing that and will raise them for freezer beef. I know that the shorthorn breed no matter what color has a future in the beef business because of the marbling, tenderness, and the beef tastes dag gone good! Our freezer beef customers on purebreds have been very happy! All of this said, I set up our commercial herd using black angus cross cows and got a heck of a bull to put on them. I agree with earlier posts, the beef industry has a lot to gain from crossing angus and shorthorn. It also makes some of the best tasting beef in my opinion.

 

[sh breeder]

Here is a white bull that will be walking our pastures for a long time. ACC Genral 4U was bred by Okotoks and  is sired by Northern legend and his dam is sired by Ghostrider. She is nine and has as good a udder as any cow on our place.
I do believe that an auction mart could be considered the "REAL WORLD" and the last time we sold black calves our roans at the same sale outsold them by 2 1/2 cents a pound.
Are we using him for the showring?  No, but if his calves are good enough to go they will, whether they are roan or white.
His first bull calf born here will walk our pastures also this summer.
[/quote
We here in eastern Iowa.USA
sell blacks by there self and red, roans, whites sell for the same price with the shornhorn looking cattle top the wt.
But they are straight shorthorn there is NO    Red Angus blood in these steers



As I think I heard mr Canada say many times... "Must be a Canada thing"... you won't find a single, and I quote.. SINGLE breeder south of the boarder say that... NOT ONE!  I GUARENTEE THAT.  that is if they are equal in quality.. but even then I'm not sure.?   I've seem some pretty sorry black beasts bring more than some pretty special looking roans in my days of watching.

 

[sh breeder]

And there more the family that bought our steer last fall sent them to the locker
they are 12-13 months old and wt 1250-1300# finshed so that why our shorthorn sell here.
And yes we run a white shorthorn bull here to and I got orders for white shorthorn bull to fill.
and he was 72# at birth and good 1 to

 

[kfacres]

sp-sp-sp-speak english

 

[jaimiediamond]

sp-sp-sp-speak english

kinda amusing coming from you... since there are a few times I had the same thought about your comments

 

[Okotoks]

And there more the family that bought our steer last fall sent them to the locker
they are 12-13 months old and wt 1250-1300# finshed so that why our shorthorn sell here.
And yes we run a white shorthorn bull here to and I got orders for white shorthorn bull to fill.
and he was 72# at birth and good 1 to

A black hide no longer means much as an indicator of carcass quality. The fact the Shorthorn breed did not go black could end up being a marketing tool we could use to our advantage. I think in the future the actual buyers of feeder cattle(not the order buyers) will start to demand calves from herds that have proof of carcass quality whether its scan data, DNA markers etc. With the low margins to be made in feeding out cattle I think they will want the ones they know will give them what they need.
I remember when hereford calves with feather necks outsold any black calf by a lot. It didn't make a lot of sense at the time nor does the hide color prejudice of today. If ever there was atime to change that color discount crap it would be today if we use the tools available to us.
The following is todays infomercial to promote Shorthorns everywhere![/b]

 

[rarebirdz]

If you are shooting for an all red color.....Using a white bull is almost insane. In Canada and the showring cattle is might work. I do appreciate what herds like Lovings and Wakuru have done as far as the solid red color is concerned. It is hard to hit that all red target. I think captain obvious is a result of such selection. Spotted cattle and roans are very economically incorrect where I am. It seems like Canada and where I am are like different planets as far as color's are concerned.

diferent planet is 1 way took at it, CO is a neat bull but he ain't the answer to every question.   the white bulls that started this thread and the bulls that were posted by other users are usful beef animals
Now correct me if I am wrong Shorthorns are red, red white marks, white or roan. 

I dont know of any bull that is the answer to every question. Just good parts to help you build your puzzle is how I see it. Believe it or not, I like to see ANY shorthorn sell good. I wish the Canandian Mafia would come down to the states and do a little persuasive talking to the buyers around here about off colored cattle. I still say its a conspiracy here. Either that or the black angus breed has a army of bushman who blowdart the buyerss before they go to bid.

On a better note, I got to play golf today. 79 with 3 triple bogeys but hey, the weather was good and the birds were singing. Life is good.

Just regardin the shorty mafia I think some of the american breeders should take a step back n either postively promot there breed or maybe consider changing it, generilly the negativity some of you users use leads potetntial buyers rit to another breed. Who wants to use a shorty if the just dont work?

 

[JTM]

If you are shooting for an all red color.....Using a white bull is almost insane. In Canada and the showring cattle is might work. I do appreciate what herds like Lovings and Wakuru have done as far as the solid red color is concerned. It is hard to hit that all red target. I think captain obvious is a result of such selection. Spotted cattle and roans are very economically incorrect where I am. It seems like Canada and where I am are like different planets as far as color's are concerned.

diferent planet is 1 way took at it, CO is a neat bull but he ain't the answer to every question.   the white bulls that started this thread and the bulls that were posted by other users are usful beef animals
Now correct me if I am wrong Shorthorns are red, red white marks, white or roan. 

I dont know of any bull that is the answer to every question. Just good parts to help you build your puzzle is how I see it. Believe it or not, I like to see ANY shorthorn sell good. I wish the Canandian Mafia would come down to the states and do a little persuasive talking to the buyers around here about off colored cattle. I still say its a conspiracy here. Either that or the black angus breed has a army of bushman who blowdart the buyerss before they go to bid.

On a better note, I got to play golf today. 79 with 3 triple bogeys but hey, the weather was good and the birds were singing. Life is good.

Just regardin the shorty mafia I think some of the american breeders should take a step back n either postively promot there breed or maybe consider changing it, generilly the negativity some of you users use leads potetntial buyers rit to another breed. Who wants to use a shorty if the just dont work?

Not sure who's comment you are referring to here but I think some of us are complaining about the buyers not appreciating the value of the Shorthorn. Most of us believe wholeheartedly in our breed. When you have excellent maternal traits, docility, almost unmatched marbling, great carcass traits, and the greatest show breed in the industry, I don't believe one can complain about the breed too much. Do we have issues, yeah, but no more than other breeds. I agree with you though, if you don't like what a particular breed has to offer, then don't use that breed.

 

[rarebirdz]

there are 3 people I am referin to and not all the coments are on this thread I could list there names but that is childish and not necissary , but they no exactly who they are as do other users I am sure

 

[kfacres]

there are 3 people I am referin to and not all the coments are on this thread I could list there names but that is childish and not necissary , but they no exactly who they are as do other users I am sure

Am I one?  Are the others my friends? 

Naw, I don't think so... 

 

[trevorgreycattleco]

there are 3 people I am referin to and not all the coments are on this thread I could list there names but that is childish and not necissary , but they no exactly who they are as do other users I am sure

I am sure you are refering to me. I spent well over a hundred thousand dollars starting my herd and building my farm. I have no family that farms. I have no one to tell me a mistake or a good decision. I have learned the hard way. I have spent every penny I had, lost a wife and a son over the farm and am working on another one leaving because they all say the farm is more important to me. I still raise shorthorns because I believe the same things JTM does and the farm is the one thing I can leave my kids, so I push on. I feel shorthorns are very under used in the industry as a whole. The popular genetics of the past decade basically carry no weight in the commercial world. In fact they set us back. I dont know who you are and your always entitled to your opinion as am I. If you ever showed up at my place, I would welcome you in and say the same stuff face to face eye to eye as I do here. I get very frustrated when I see what I feel are wrong moves. Its just my opinion. Dont really mean squat.

 

[rarebirdz]

Quote from: justintime on Today at 07:50:09 PM
For goodness sake, Jody .. give it a rest!  This family has raised, managed and promoted an outstanding breeding program for many decades. They are quite capable of managing their cows and if they want to flush an older cow because she has been a stellar producer ( which all of these have been) what concern is it of yours? I'm sorry, but this constant arguing you want to do on a continuous basis is really getting old. I would suggest that when you have been half as successful as this family has been you might have cause to question how they manage their outstanding breeding program. Their genetics can literally be found around the world.

Naw, I'd rather not... I have no interest in selling all over the world, I have zero interest in producing a show cattle, I have no interest in doing alot of things anymore...  I have no interest in registered purebred Shorthorn cattle either for that matter.  I'll continue to build on my interest to produce what I like, what converts grass into red meat, and what generates a profit.

I have no concern with their program, and must admit that people sure admire it.

Like I said, I don't really care anything about this program- just looking for a simple answer about what was going through their head...  Maybe someday I'll have something similar.. and can think back to myself...  "I once heard a great story teller, tell a story about his shorthorn bull, who knowbody knew was faulty.  Some blamed the cows, some the bull...  Ended up being nothing wrong, but human error...  What should I do now?  Shoot the bull, or cull the cows?  Heck, keep em all- then you know you kept the right one.. or sell em all, then you know you sold the right one.. Guess that's about it for now folks....  If I had money, or great stories, I'd make a movie.. Course no body would watch it, as it involved ****horns. 

this comment took you out of the running as ur not really a breeder "truth" it seems big of u to think it would be you

I am sorry trevergrey for ur losses

 

[JTM]

Had another beautiful red neck roan bull calf today out of the white bull I used last year. Only one white calf from him and the rest have been really awesome colored! I told my wife tonight that we might have to buy another white bull some time because these calves' colors are so good.
Of course the colors are only good for show cattle, retained ownership feeders, or a feeder who will buy them off the farm. Sale barn will kill me on these colors. It almost makes me laugh  but it is too sad to laugh.  ???

 

[jaimiediamond]

Had another beautiful red neck roan bull calf today out of the white bull I used last year. Only one white calf from him and the rest have been really awesome colored! I told my wife tonight that we might have to buy another white bull some time because these calves' colors are so good.
Of course the colors are only good for show cattle, retained ownership feeders, or a feeder who will buy them off the farm. Sale barn will kill me on these colors. It almost makes me laugh  but it is too sad to laugh.  ???

I have to admit the red neck roans look smashing in the field I personally prefer the even purples that I have been lucky enough to have in the last couple of years.  Regardless I think it is highway robbery that your coloured Shorthorns don't sell as well at market, although I honestly believe that if breeders keep promoting the marbling and easy fleshing ability with the maternal traits Shorthorns are (were) known for the breed will rise.

 

[Shady Lane]

I was always told by the old timers that using a white bull now and then would help to darken the reds in succesive generations, would help to get rid of spotting and keep the colours true.


I really hate Orange ones!

 

[justintime]

I was always told by the old timers that using a white bull now and then would help to darken the reds in succesive generations, would help to get rid of spotting and keep the colours true.


I really hate Orange ones!

That is very true! If you use a white bull, then follow up with a couple red bulls, you will get dark red or very dark roan colors. White bulls are also the answer for removing spots from cattle, and they seem to help eliminate them from coming back a few generations later, unless you go back to using spotted bulls again

 

[rarebirdz]

I was always told by the old timers that using a white bull now and then would help to darken the reds in succesive generations, would help to get rid of spotting and keep the colours true.


I really hate Orange ones!

That is very true! If you use a white bull, then follow up with a couple red bulls, you will get dark red or very dark roan colors. White bulls are also the answer for removing spots from cattle, and they seem to help eliminate them from coming back a few generations later, unless you go back to using spotted bulls again

how does thus work?

 

[colosteers]

With the shorthorns, why does it seem the really good, easy fleshing, productive type is tipically a roan or white -- and some of the tighter hided, harder doing cattle are typically the solid reds?

I know there are exceptions, and the solid reds are more excepted in the U.S. sale barns, but does any body else notice this?

 

[Davis Shorthorns]

With the shorthorns, why does it seem the really good, easy fleshing, productive type is tipically a roan or white -- and some of the tighter hided, harder doing cattle are typically the solid reds?

I know there are exceptions, and the solid reds are more excepted in the U.S. sale barns, but does any body else notice this?

From what I have seen on this when you go into a herd of cattle where people are breeding for these traits most of the time they are also breeding for a solid red animal.  So if you do see a roan, a white or a crazy spotted up one you know they were just SO much better than the rest of them they had no choice but to keep them.  Try to go out into a solid red herd and if you spot the roan one it will be in the top 10% most of the time.