Bulls that looked Good, but never turned em out

[clubcalve]

afhm You should take jonny walker red and cherry bomb off your list , I love those bulls  ;D

 

[stick]

JIT or others, help me out here. Was it Willow Crest Elevation that was Louisville or Denver champ that they couldn't get much semen from and ended up producing very few calves?

 

[HeiferShower14]

i havent seen alot of johnny calves. but i really like him to

 

[yuppiecowboy]

If I remember correctly willow crest elevation had an infection at some point and never froze. I remember either an ad or an article mentioning how he loved to stand in the cement feedbunk and wait for another heifer to be put in with him. For some reason that struck me as funny. Did Waukaru own him? It was a "good then still good now" herd.

 

[BIGTEX]

It almost seems impossible to evaluate promoted bulls anymore. By the time you see them they have been weaned....put under fans or whatever.....pushed on show feed....had photos doctored....and have a massive haircoat. Almost looks like the best option is to use proven sires and let someone else do the experimenting. But then how do you find new bulls? I wonder what the nation's semen sale volume is for a year and I wonder what % of display bulls are washouts?

It suprises me there are no shows for these bulls, no EPD's. Why does no one show these bulls? In a lot of Breeds the ones that win seem to be the ones that everyone uses. It is hard to pick a bull just on pictures. Like Aj says, let someone else do the experimenting.

 

[shortyjock89]

BT- Who likes to get beat?  And at the major's there isn't a class for x-breds.  If Lautner dragged out his new bull battery every year, and got beat because the bulls werent big enough, not sound enough, too feminine, who would use them? (I have yet to use a Lautner bull in my entire life, btw).

 

[inthebarnagain]

The only two we have used of Lautners was Ali and Hardcore.  The Ali is very impressive.  We used him on a heifer who luckily was a very big heifer because he was 2 weeks overdue and 95 pounds.  Needless to say, we stuck with proven Angus calving ease bulls this year. 

 

[simtal]

I would say that just because a bull showed well, that doesn't translate into good progeny.  How many show bulls didn't sire anything? Predictability is hard to control.

 

[bcosu]

only lautner bull i've ever used was who. i was ashamed to hear that lautner bought money shot because i really want to use him but i'm not looking forward to him dilluting all the semen.

 

[Bawndoh]

I would say that just because a bull showed well, that doesn't translate into good progeny.  How many show bulls didn't sire anything? Predictability is hard to control.

Absolutely true.  The semen company I work for rarely buys show bulls because they know how things work out with them.  Sure they are popular for a year or two afterwards, but then things often go downhill fast.  Also, what if a semen company invested big money in a bull, he was show, and then beat hard.  How would the majority of the population accept the bull after that.  I personally would not care, because I know how many "National Champions" I thought belonged in the dumpster or never were that good when you got them home, threw them in pasture, and took away the barley.  I also know from experience how good or great some of the cattle that get last in class can turn out!

 

[aj]

Bawndoh..... (clapping)

 

[Joe Boy]

I have bred lots of heifers to ALI and had good luck.  The calves weighed in the 50's and low 60's.  We have one born last week that is a deep red, but the others were black.  They looked better as 18 months of age than earlier.  They are small and slow growing.  They do have a great look.  My brother will use one that 3/4 Maine and the rest Chi-Ang-MA.  He is small but will throw little calves on his Brangus heifers.

On Hard Core, I got 10 straws will get no calves.  I called the stud service when the semen arrived and told them that it did not have any liquid nitrogen in it but they said it would be fine.  If it was, then I did a bad job breeding.  I hit 100% with Ali and a bull called Himmer on my heifers and I used Hard Core on the second year heifers.  Go figure.

 

[bcosu]

i know mossy oak sired his share of good cattle but i know he was kind of a disappointment structurally. i don't think he really belongs on the list but it reminded me that i hadn't seen too many mossy's recently. anyone have any?

 

[kane1598]

Agreed on Mossy. I have seen some that are really crippled up by the time they were fat, actually I have never seen a fat Mossy that I would call sound.  Anyway,  I will add American Outlaw to this list.  He is a shorthorn bull owned by Caldwells, I really like him, but never have I seen a calf out of him.  Anyone seen any American Outlaw babies?

 

[simtal]

The only mossy I ever saw that I really liked was that one Buck had about 3-4 years ago.  She was nice.

 

[oakview]

Larry Reap in Illinois raised Elevation, I believe he sold as a calf in Larry's dispersal to Jordans.  I was at the sale, probably have the sale catalog somewhere.  I think Elevation was a Dividend son.  He was later sold for a high price as a show bull, unfortunately he turned out to be low in fertility.  If I remember correctly, Jordans placed an ad explaining the fertility problem due to a low grade infection and to dispell unsubstantiated rumors.  At the time, I thought Elevation was one of the top bulls around and the few calves he sired seemed to be good as well.

 

[Throttle]

The only mossy I ever saw that I really liked was that one Buck had about 3-4 years ago.  She was nice.

The Mossy x WMW (what a structural nitemare of a mating ) that Morgan Tomsen showed that won IN state fair then the Chi and Maintainer shows at NAILE, was as nice a one as I've seen in a long time at Louisville last year.

 

[chambero]

only lautner bull i've ever used was who. i was ashamed to hear that lautner bought money shot because i really want to use him but i'm not looking forward to him dilluting all the semen.

For what its worth, I've used several of Lautners bulls the last two years and conception has been (Heatwave, Heatwave 1, Rocky Balboa, Tyson, Jimmy the Greek, Golden Child, Hard Core) substantially better than bulls owned by others.  I haven't gotten any poor quality semen on his bulls.  His bulls are what they are, but I've been completely satisfied on the business end with them.

 

[DLD]

only lautner bull i've ever used was who. i was ashamed to hear that lautner bought money shot because i really want to use him but i'm not looking forward to him dilluting all the semen.

For what its worth, I've used several of Lautners bulls the last two years and conception has been (Heatwave, Heatwave 1, Rocky Balboa, Tyson, Jimmy the Greek, Golden Child, Hard Core) substantially better than bulls owned by others.  I haven't gotten any poor quality semen on his bulls.  His bulls are what they are, but I've been completely satisfied on the business end with them.

I'm with Chambero on this one - usually, semen quality from Lautners is as good as any.  Most problems with semen quality aren't because it's been over diluted, they're due to human error somewhere along the way.  You've got to remember how many people have handled that semen between the time it was frozen and the time it reaches the cow - it's very easy for someone along the way to slip or simply get distracted for a moment, and a straw or even a whole cane ends up exposed just long enough for a little damage to occur.  They prob'ly don't even realize it could've happened, but there it is. 

 

[bcosu]

that's encouraging because guys i've talked to said that there had been straws cut open of semen from his bulls that weren't any where near the suggested level of concentration. hopefully it will all turn out okay